Please explain the 17" fuchs process
 

I know there are threads discussing the 17" fuchs. How exactly do I go about getting these. Am I correct in reading I need to have a donor set that will be cut up and refinished as part of a 3 piece process?

Lindsey Racing will build you a set of 3 piece of whatever width you want if you source 4 6" wheels IIRC. You can also buy new replica 3 piece Fuchs from Zuffenhaus but plan on waiting a few months for them, or you can buy Braid "semi-forged" Fuch replica wheels, or you can buy Rota Cast Fuch Replicas, or you can buy used real Fuchs (not in 17's tho), or you can buy brand new Fuchs from Germany (not sure of the sizes)

Lindsay and TruDesign both take donor 16" Fuchs, cut them up and weld them to 17" barrels. Custom sizing. Pros: Cheaper than Zuffenhaus. Quicker turn-around time. You're using real Fuchs centers, for authenticity's sake. Cons: You're using real Fuchs centers--they're gonna be 20+ years old. Aesthetically the 16" centers on 17" barrels may look not quite proportioned right to you.

Zuffenhaus makes 3-piece forged replicas in teh Fuchs design. Pros: Brand new materials. Forged centers. Custom sizing. Aesthetically the centers have been "upsized" to fit the 17" barrels. Cons: Cost more than Lindsay/TruDesign, but not out of order for custom aftermarket stuff. Wait times may be long.

I don't know of anyone with any experience with Blown6's 17" 3-piece replicas.

Rota makes cast 17" wheels. Pros: Most economical option of the bunch. Cons: Little flexibility in custom sizing. What they have is what they have. Heavier than the above, forged options. Some people have made noise about the supposed inferior quality of Rota's casting process, but no one has yet posted any evidence of any wheel failures. (Or maybe they just haven't live to tell about them.)

This chart I created isn't up to date with Zuffenhousen's wheels, but FWIW:

http://members.rennlist.org/911pcars/Fuchs,3-pieceSource.htm

No affiliation or recommendations. The board archives has the answers.

Sherwood

Thanks for posting the question. I've been wondering about this too.

The 3 piece from original Fuchs have to be from 6x16" wheels. Relatively easy to come by, but everyone knows the core cost from Lindsay so you wont be finding a 'deal' here. Maybe craigs list or fleeBay...

-Michael

My understanding is that True Design's 17" welded Fuchs are made from a 16x7 wheel.

Sherwood

I believe Trudesign will make them from any Fuchs widths, not just 7s. Lindsay, however, uses 6s.

It is possible to take a 6 x 16" cut off the rim, drill the center for 20 bolt BBS 3 piece wheel components and make up 17" wheels of your choosing size wise. Good thing about Trudesign is they can use 6" Fuchs for the front wheels, and I really like the fact that they can/will use a 7 x 16" to make the rear wider 17" wheels. Yes - getting a good deal on 16" Fuchs is hard to do since everyone is constantly looking for the 6 x 16". The 7 x 16" Fuchs are usually much less expensive than the 6" Fuchs. Jim

If I am looking for a 9" and 11" width, does anyone go to a smaller diameter like 16 or 15 to look more retro.

I have a set of very nice 17" weld ups in refinishing with Al Reed right now. I was able to score a set of the Zuffenhaus 17's (also in refinishing with Al) so I am planning on selling the first set. They are all 9" and 11".

Tru Design made me some 9.5x16 out of 6" Fuchs.

They machine out the center then swage it into a new barrel.

They did a superb job, I couldn't be happier!

Both True design and lindsey can do the smaller wheel diameter. But you really end up with only one or two expensive choices for tires.

Last time I saw Gary Stratton (sonjay on the board) he had a set of either 15 9's and 11's or 16 9's and 11's that he was looking to unload.

Kumho makes the Ecsta XS in 265/16 which makes wide 16 inch wheels attractive again.

Kumho Ecsta XS

Here's a TruDesign Fuchs 17x9.5 custom offset, 275/40 tire.

They do really nice work.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1289922832.jpg

Everyone,
thanks for all the info, I know this is a topic many get exhausted hearing again but it really clarified things for some of us knee deep in builds. At least I didnt ask about the tires. :)

Donor or no donor
 

Ed: Some of the guys building these type of custom rims have "donor" rims and they pricing includes or it's extra. Most seem to include that in the price, but you can offer to get them donors. I had Gary Stratton build me a set of 17's (7 & 9") for my RS Clone (83sc). The offset is important and as his or her skill, "don't
just get a "deal". I have seen many versions, I have enclosed a photo from Monterey his year. Give Gary a call at least: 407-421-1911http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1289926017.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1289926052.jpg
SmileWavy Hope it help, email or check out my garage if you have questions
art
agrimmitt@pelican
11/16 Tues 8:50am pst>CA

I have a set of 3-piece HRE Fuchs-style forged wheels in 17x8 and 17x10. Polished rims and black centers, in excellent condition with brand new 100% tread P-Zeros on the back (17x35x285) and 85% tread P-Zeros on the front (17x40x235). The fasteners (20 to a wheel) are visible. HRE stopped making these several years ago. They have 6,000 miles on my pampered 930. I'm thinking about going to 18x9 and 18x11. Let me know if you have an interest.

Thanks Tom but I'm looking to do something more traditional without the bolts showing in an RSR finish. Ill pass along the info if I hear of anyone during my discussions about this.

These are my 17 x 9 rears made from 16 x 6 Fuchs by Tru-Design.http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1289945913.jpg

This shot gives you an idea of how much weight the car has lost. This pic is before the rear end was lowered with re-indexing the t-bars. TD does very nice work. These are polished, not chrome. I'm running 275 / 40 / 17 and they fit: barely.

Lindy

Can you post a pic of these?

Apparently these were nearly perfect forging dies for the centers and were discarded by the owners due to lack of interest.

the True Designs are really nice.

I went to barnes and noble today and looked through all the Porsche mags. I saw a least two or three companies offering fuchs copies. One of them supposedly forged. New and forged is the best way to go if you're gonna track the car. Zuffenhaus is one of the best looking options, but they seem to be letting people down with their several-month-long deliveries.

Zuffenhaus Wheels - 9 and 11's - Al Reed frosted finish
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1283127450.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1283642317.jpg

Same car - 17" True design wheels - same offset (tires look weird - because they are small for the rims - 235 and 275's)
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1284251250.jpg
Front wheel
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1284251261.jpg
Rear wheel
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1284251287.jpg

The Zuffenhaus wheels are awesome. You do wait a long time to get them. The wait is not the issue - custom built is like that - Keith's lack of upfrontness is. If it's going to take six to nine months to deliver, tell the customer that. People can handle it and make their own decisions based on the facts. I don't honestly think most of that is the fault of Zuf, but the cagy answers to reasonable questions and lack of accurate communication certainly is. Despite all that, for me the wait was worth it, though I only had to wait six months or so. :)

Jeremy, why did you switch to TruDesign and what width are the ones on your car? I guess you wanted to go wider than the Zuffs?

Nope - just wanted a set of track wheels in the same offset. They are made to the same dimensions.

The true designs were made from a set of 951 7's and 8's that sat in someone's garage for 20 years. They have the deeper lug holes that better clear my 993/965 brake calipers.

Jeremy, what size tires are you running on your Zuff's? Thanks, John

Thanks Jeremy. It's probably just the lighting, but I like the look of the TruDesigns better. Both very nice though. And the car is spectacular! Very nicely done!

255's and 315's on the Zuffenhaus wheels

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1290008279.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1290008288.jpg

Now the question nobody whats to ever answer on here. Can someone at least PM me and let me know even roughly what I need to budget for 9 and 11 x 17 wheels like the photos above.

pretty sure they both have prices on their websites

The ones I had on the car this past weekend.
https://www.zuffenhaus.us/cgi-bin/commerce.exe?listcategories

The track wheels that I had made from my old fuchs
True Design Wheel

The true design will be cheaper if you have a set of donor wheels.

it looks like Zuffenhaus would be between 3200 and 3700 between offset needed and finish. TruDesign says you need to call for pricing information.

I'd say that looks perfect! Love how that 315 fills the flare.

I ordered a set of Zuff. wheels on 1-24-10. I still have not recieved them. If you must have the Zuff. 17's be prepared to wait, a very long time.

That's sad... and friggin ridiculous... They simply should not accept orders, let alone take someones money. Is Kodiak still doing them? I have a request in to them for race wheels and mentioned my wait for the Fuchs they made for Zuffenhaus and have not even got a response. My advice to anyone out there is to simply go elsewhere.

I've had a few different flavors of 17" Fuchs - Zuffenhaus, Lindsay, TruDesign, and OEM Fuchs with BBS shells.

My order of preference:

1st: Zuffenhaus wheels. After genuine Fuchs (which aren't available in 17") I think Zuffenhaus wheels are the best wheels made. Expect long wait times to get them. A huge plus to the Zuff wheels are the fact the centers are brand new and proportioned for 17" wheels.

2nd: OEM Fuchs with BBS shells. I like the profile of the BBS shells. It's more Fuchs like vs Lindsay or TruDesign. It's possible to setup the wheels using hidden fasteners.

3rd: Lindsay. I wish he'd use 7" wheels as donors but he has his method and I understand that.

4th: TruDesign. Nice that he'll use 7" wheels as donors. IMO 951 7x16 centers are the best donors for TD wheels due to slightly increased clearance for brakes.

All the above are very good wheels and all the above suppliers stand behind their wheels. You really can't go wrong with any of them. 1, 2, 3, and 4 are all very similar except 2, 3, and 4 require using real Fuchs centers. Unless you buy a set of brand new Fuchs to use as donors then the centers have numerous stress cycles already, possibly 30 years worth.

If you go with 3 or 4 consider going 3-piece (bolted) instead of 2 piece (welded). This way the wheel parts are replaceable.

Zuffenhaus:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1285070934.jpg

Fuchs with BBS shells:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1251298159.jpg

TruDesign front, Lindsay rear:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1224031893.jpg

sorry for bump, but...

i would advise against the rota's; apart from blatantly ripping off established companies and contributing nothing to the industry, they are wheels made to a price after all.. and it shows:

Track Report: Rota Rims And P-cup Slicks.. - Skylines Australia
this was after six months use.

these weren't flawed from factory, the owner running the experiment with these had them xrayed when they were first fitted, and the cast was perfect:
http://www.forrestfamily.com.au/duncan/GTR/misc/rota_xray_1.JPG
http://www.forrestfamily.com.au/duncan/GTR/misc/rota_xray_0.JPG

i don't know what materials they use, but just remember the wheels keep you connected to the tarmac and shiny side up! i wouldn't risk it :D

hope that was informative.

Nice first post.

And no, it wasn't terribly informative. This is a Fuchs thread.

No, it's not a Fuchs thread at all and it was informative, though only showed the negative aspect of Rota wheels. I'm sure many run them on the street w/o issue. Only thing "Fuch's" here is the possible use of their centers in repro 17" wheels as there is no such thing (AFAIK) as 17" Fuchs.

Sorry, I thought the title, "Please explain the 17" Fuchs process" suggested it might be a Fuchs focused thread. The contents detailing the different variables such as genuine Fuchs centres, Zuffenhaus and Rota Fox, to get them and their variants in 17 inch appeared to support this.

It seemed like a post directly intent on bashing Rota wheels. That he jumps in with both feet on his first post like this seems a bit off. His example doesn't shed any light on the Fox 17s debate. I have no opinion on that and don't wish to start/continue that particular argument as there's already a thread that deals with it all too effectively. I was just concerned it seemed directed at primarily knocking the Rota (and not even the Fox) product.

Edit: I apologize if this came across as snarky, but I was in a bit of a "mood" this morning and a bit less diplomatic than I maybe should have been. Sorry 'bout that.