Really dumb RS Clone question... be nice!
 

So, I've decided after going back and forth (keep it stock, or make it the car I've always wanted..?), that I want to make an RS clone out of my 71 911T. (The final straw was the offer of a brand new getty duck tail for less than a night out for dinner!)

I am pretty sure (still only 2 years in to the 911 game) that all RS clones have the wider fenders in the back. Do I HAVE to do this? I don't mind removing the stock bumper and deck lid, but to start actually cutting off metal from this thing seems a bit harsh... and sad...

Talk to me guys. Am I out of my mind?? :)

(This is the dream car!)
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1296574735.jpg

You don't HAVE to do anything. Make it like you want it. If you don't want to widen the flares then don't. Who cares as long as you like it.

+1 Mark Seems like their is a template fpr RS Clones that a lot of people follow and they wind up with just another RS Clone. If your going to modify a car do it as you like. After all it's your car.

Bill

"Am I out of my mind??"
yes. does it matter?
if getting a fg ducktail on the cheap is your determinant for the car's future, then everything's on the table. create your own icon any way that satisfies (but don't expect the world to beat a path to your door if you sell it some day).

Yo my mind a clone should be as close to the original as possible, w/ constraints of availability and budget

When I built my '72 into an RS clone back in the days well before the internet and widely available current information sources I used SC quarters modified w/ the '72 oil door. This of course is not totally correct but is compatible w/ the spirit of the project.

As noted above you don't have to do anything, but the more correct the better

Thanks guys. I will always have this 71 (its my first 911, and the year I was born, so its not going to be sold). When I got this car almost 2 years ago, I put a ducktail on it and starting getting the "way to ruin the value" messages from friends and family. But now, I think I just want to make it a nice driver. And the RS clones are just amazing. I think the ducktail coming back in to my life was just a sign! :)

My wife is getting a Carrera 4S, and I have a Panamera at my disposal (dealer friends!), so this can be the fun car.

Thanks again all. Will start up the Project thread soon. Its -17 here in Colorado today, and even the heater in the garage is taking the day off..!

...oh, and God forbid I did have to sell it someday, I would think an incorrect RS clone with all original steel would be better than a cut up "more correct" clone, no?

Ah, what am I thinking... my 4 year old son (and co-mechanic) would disown me if I sold it... :)

You might just be messing up a very nice T?

To have the 'look' of a carrera RS you would have to widen the rear arches but have you considered how difficult and expensive it is to get the correct shaped flares to weld on? SC flares would just not do it so I would suggest it is better not to do it at all unless you have the right flares.

Also, it is very unwise to fit a duck without the corresponding front spoiler from a high speed stability point of view.


Regards
Mike

Make yourself happy - Pesonally, I wouldn't be chopping sheetmetal. Adding the tail is something that can be easily reversed someday.

I have a very original 73.5 (except paint). I've debated for years on whether to rebuild the 2.4 or put in a bigger engine. Finally bought a very nice 3.2 and it's on a truck today coming my way. I will prepare the 2.4 for long term storage and keep it. Decided to do what I would enjoy most and keep all the old parts.

It's certainly true that if you butcher it it will be worth less, the value of a clone depends on the quality of the work and the potential buyer.

A virgin car will almost always be worth more that a sister that has been modified.

You don't have to do an "RS Clone," just do what YOU want. Myself, I would first replace the bumpers and decklid, then call it a day. Keep the original bumpers and decklid, so you could go back to stock later if you wish. Later on, if you are still not satisfied, then start cutting.

Yeah, I have the RS bumper already installed, so the only real cosmetic difference will be the narrow rear end. I already made it "unstock" on the interior is RS door panels, 3 point seat belts, and new seats.

I guess I add the duck tail, and if it still doesn't look like my dream, I can always do the flares later. Its just such a perfect machine... if it were rusting out, it would be a whole lot easier to cut. lol

I am probably not going to "save" the original parts, as the bumper that was on there is from a different 71 911, and the rear deck lid is also from a fellow pelican. Could use the funds to complete this baby.

Thanks Scooter.... was posting that same thing (almost) while you were posting.

Here is some inspiration. The black one is a friend's narrow bodied '73 T with a ducktail (which came with a duck from the factory), and another friend's aubergine real RS. I like both for different reasons:


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1171896943.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1171896977.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1171897003.jpg

So some 911's came with a Duck and skinny rears from the factory?? I had no idea. I thought I would be creating a "mutt" so to speak. Thanks Scott!

Nope, but a lot of them were added afterward.

A factory ducktail only came on '73 and '74 Carrera, all of which have the wider SC/Carrera rear quarters

Sorry Bill, but this time you are wrong. The black car has a COA from Porsche with the ducktail listed. It was a special car at the end of '73.

Scott, do you think you friend would be willing to send me a few more pics of his car? I would love to have them in the garage as inspiration!!

Without flares, you'll sound like a poser if you call your car an RS clone.

It would be better to have a sleeper like Brad's black car above.

W/ special wishes anything was possible but there were no regular production cars other than the '73/74 RS sold w/ a ducktail.

it's like the turbo looks, regular production of turbo looks started in '84 but there were some built as early as '76, these were not the sort of things that could be ordered in any dealership.

Awesome point. I guess what I really want is a 911T that looks like an RS. A clone would mean actually going full out, and I am not prepared to go that far! :eek:

Check for piscean911/914 posts. He has several pics of his car here on Pelican. You can see a couple of pics of his car and COA on this page:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/223479-show-me-your-narrow-bodied-early-hot-rod-15.html#post4742256

what's it like being celibate? :D

yes, it was obviously added as a special wishes, you could also have speced bigger wheels but they are still not rpo items. There are all sorts of things that could be added or subtracted by special request

That does not make it a production line item

Thankfully, my better half is a Porsche fan too. She grew up traveling the world in the back of a 1970 911T he Dad bought new as the family car...

(OK, no jokes about my wife and her love of the back seat.... ;))

LOL!

I say do what you want to do on the car. T's were made for having fun with, in the backseat and the front seat! I added SC flares to my 73 last fall but and keeping the flat decklid. Looks a little leaner, meaner to me.

I was not directing my post to you Bill. I am merely trying to help the OP.

For the record, I never said it was a production line item, I merely corrected your post that indicated

"Nope, but a lot of them were added afterward.

A factory ducktail only came on '73 and '74 Carrera, all of which have the wider SC/Carrera rear quarters"

which was incorrect. The ducktail was not added afterward, it was added at the factory.

I was not (and am not) trying to get into a pi$$ing match (I respect you too much for that), I was just trying to give accurate information. I've provided the OP all that I have to offer. SmileWavy

Do what you want with it and understand that it may detract from the value of it in the event you decide to sell it someday. And I wouldn't worry about SC vs RS flares. It is a subtle difference that only the most detailed eyes will pick up on.

I'd also go on to make the generalization that most RS clones are/were built to be drivers. I know if I had the coin for a real RS, I wouldn't want to be driving it regularly. So if you want RS-ness, building/buying a clone is a much more reasonable way to have that, but have it better because you can incorporate much of the modern improvements available without destroying the value of a real RS.

My '72 is on the path to RS-ness along w/ a '96 3.6L conversion.

Don't cut up that nice longhood. There are lots of RS clones around; it's been done to death. How about something along the lines of an aggressive "sports purposes" car and keep all the stock parts in case you change your mind later? Or just get a cheap SC or middie and cut all you want! JMHO; it's your car afterall! Have fun!

99.92% of 911 owners don't know the difference between an SC and an RS flare.

Hey Levdeb, fellow Coloradan here. Your dream car looks an awful lot like mine! If you're interested, here's the thread where I documented my RS lookalike project. Skip to the end to see the results. It's certainly not a clone...stock drivetrain and upgraded suspension, but otherwise an '86 under the skin.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/461573-carrera-backdate.html

Hey Porschenut! Enjoying the -8 temp today? :)

I will check out your link now. Do you go to many Porsche events here in CO?

Thanks everyone for your input. Really appreciate it!

Going to go take pics of the parts I am going to remove and sell and create a "parts" page on my site. I am getting excited!

Hi Scooter, just in the spirit of being accurate, the real RS in the photos you posted is Lilac not Aubergine.:D

For the OP, original profile RS flairs are available from Porsche, so no need to get SC/Carrera flairs and try to massage to shape.

It's you car so do what you want as others have said. My opinion is that the first order would be to focus on the mechanical. A cosmetic clone with 2.2T mechanicals might be less than satisfying. There is a lot of room for improvement on suspension, braking, and power without cutting the body. If you have any interest in future value, keeping all the take off stuff is worth considering.

You made some comments about limited budget, before you start do the research as to how much it will cost to do all the things you want to do. A lot of people will spend years collecting the special parts for a project, that can be fun and a rewarding project itself. Along the way you can do some of the mechanical upgrades while collecting all the bit to build your special hot rod.

do the F spoiler - keep the old one as per above; see how you like it

2nd - buy an old deck lid with duck or add to the one you buy; keep the old one so you can always say "that is the original deck lid too" when you turn 84 and want to sell the car; see how you like it now

3rd - think about fender flares for the next few years while you drive the car

Well it's 72 in my little home office so I'm just as toasty as usual today :)

My car's hibernating until April or so, but I do attend some Porsche events around town. I take it to HPR several days a year for some exercise. In the spring "the gang" will all go for a drive in the mountains once they get the sand off the roads. You'll need to have your "RS" done by then. :D

Thanks all!

RWebb- the front bumper and read deck lid are not the originals. I sold those here in haste. Got a brand new unused Duck tail to put on, and already did the RS front.

Love the idea of trying this first, and adding flares in the future. We have nothing but time!

Awesome. My wife and I were just invited up to Steamboat with Porsche USA for the Winter Driving Event. It was amazing driving around in Cayennes, Panameras, and Carreras on the frozen tundra...!

No flares can still have fun!

ok, still do the F spolier 1st for aero stability reasons

I personally like the sleek, trim look of smaller or no flares - that's why the ones on my '73 are unmolested. I like the original 911 even more...

You are absolutely right. Should have known better, since the owner's Pelican name has "Lilac" in it. Stupid me. :(