Where to buy Euro pre-muffler for '87?

[movin]

Where can I get a Euro pre-muffler for my '87? will it give an improvement in performance over the Bursch Test Pipe (cat elliminator)?

[masraum]

I doubt that it would give an improvement over a good test pipe, but I believe Fabspeed makes a cat bypass in the Euro premuffler style.

If you have a Bursch bypass then I would go with it, but if you were just considering one then you might want to consider the other as well. On an otherwise stock engine they'll probably be about the same.

[Bill Verburg]

Bruce Anderson mentioned at a Tech session a few years back that the euro premuffler was worth a few extra hp(I really don't remmber the exact #). I do remember that I had people lined up bidding for one that I was selling at the time.

[dickster]

dansk do them (£155 in england)

pelican should be able to supply

[1Gunner]

Bought mine from Europroducts. They advertise in Excellence.
Great addition to my 87 Cab, after installing a Borla SS.

Good luck

[89911]

I saw one of these a few months ago. It looked like a bypass pipe with baffling around it. How an open pipe that is less then a foot and half long can be less efficient then this "premuffler" is puzzling. I am beginning to believe this may be an Urban legend! As far as testing goes, was this done with a bypass pipe vs the premuffler, or vs a catalytic converter? As far as the Fabspeed one, they better claim in increase in performance for a $350 pipe. Ouch.

[911nut]

The whole issue on exhaust systems and backpressure is a hot issue on the BB. IMHO, after playing around with my exhaust system for a year now, is don't expect a HP increase by installing a pre-muffler; rather, expect a slight decrease due to the additive backpressures of the pre-muffler and the muffler.

[JDaniel]

From a post by Richard Nelson... actual dyno results!

"Ok, a bit of back ground.

Car: ’86 coupe, US spec engine, standard cat./muffler (cat. looked original, and I tried wayne’s test by shinning a light through one end – well I couldn’t see any light looking through the other end so I guess the cat. was pretty clogged)

Dyno was a bosch.

All runs were done today within 5 hours (I’m knackered – I changed the cat/muffler myself at home – phew!). Each “run” was done twice for consistency.

No tuning or adjustments were made throughout – simply bolt on and go.

Run 1:
With std cat and muffler produced 220hp at the flywheel (190hp at the wheels). I am pretty pleased with this as I have a US engine, and the same dyno usually shows around 230hp for euro spec cars.

Run 2:
Changed that restrictive cat, for a dansk premuffler (not a sports one), and used with the std muffler. No change in noise levels. I would have said before it was dynoed that it seemed to rev better. Produced 228hp. Gain was throughout the rev range. Impressive.

Run 3:
Changed the std muffler for a dansk 1 in 2 out sport muffler, to use with the dansk premuffler. Now I got LOTS of noise!! At idle there is a burble, and it is a bit “tinny” (I guess that’s the construction or something). As you pull away from a standstill there is that lovely V8 like sound around 2500rpm, its GEORGEOUS! It reminds me of the V8 TVR’s. Upper rpm’s are more like a YEEOOWWWLLL. The noise is not too much (maybe ,marginally quieter than the TVR), and would suit me for everyday driving. The radio is of course now redundant, as is the side window.

I tried recording the sound of all three combinations but I fear the quality is not very good. I’m working on it.

Anyway the 3rd and last power run. 2 were done and the results were odd. 10hp down on the first run – about 210hp!! I have no idea why this happened, but I am happy with the results of the runs overall. Anyways another run was done and now peak power moved slightly upward to 232hp. There was no gain all the way up the rev range over the 2nd run, it gained only at the top end. These things like to be revved.

All power curves were pretty straight all the way up.

Conclusion
So I’m reasonably happy. The gains were in line with Bruce Andersons findings, and I’ve now got somewhere near the power I thought I started with when I bought the car (thought it was a euro spec). Hope fully I will be able to gain a few hp now with a rechip and fine tune.

If you’ve got a euro spec car without the cat then it does not look as though (before rechip anyway) you will gain much usuable power. If you want a nice sound then that’s another story! The sport 2 out muffler makes a nice sound combined with the premuffler, and I think it may be too much for me used with a bypass pipe.

There, I hope you find this useful – I’ll leave you to your own conclusions, please email etc if you want further info, fitting the system etc. "

[BIG MIKE]

I got my pre muffler today and I am going to install it ASAP with a standard muffler.

I have an 87 Targa, chip installed, and 92K on the car.

I may have some questions later this week.

MIKE

[don911]

89911, I think the price on the fabspeed pipe is $225. I think the $350 price is for their chip. Their ad is a little confusing but if it is $225, it seems like a decent price if it's well made.