Using wide band to tune cis?
 

Did a search but nothing conclusive. I just purchased this out of curiosities sake to see what my afr is at full throttle.
PLX Devices Inc - USA
http://www.plxdevices.com/images/plx...d_page_WIP.png
Gonna try to install it next weekend and see what we see:cool:

Cool, I was always interested in getting the innovate LM-2 wideband with logger... But didn't know how you would trace it vs. RPM. I wonder if you can log multiple channels with it? Oh well I will look into it more when I have the money...

Tom - I have a LC-1 with turbo timer in case you want to try one of those. All I know is I keep blowing out o2 sensors. lol

I wanted to try it as I have a friend with a turbocharged, VW powered Manx buggy. He's running a blow-through carb set up and he swears by the PLX wide band to aid in tuning.

I have been thinking of getting an Innovate kit also. Please let us know how this one works out.

I'm not sure if you would need a logger with CIS if you have a display. It seems like you could only tune for full throttle, or maybe for fuel economy, since there is only one adjustment and it affects the entire range. I could be wrong though, I'm still learning about CIS.

At WOT, my AFRs would be in the 9s.

Yeah, but you're turbocharged. And besides, flames on decel are cool!!!:D

I got this a short while ago MTX-L Wideband O2 Digital Air/fuel Ratio Gauge, very easy install, works a treat.
Just had the car dyno'ed and the AFR results from my Innovate and the dyno machine where almost identical (they had there dyno re-calibrated only a few months ago so its spot on) so it does a good job too.

I'd be curious to see how this works out for tuning CIS as well. For $200, not much to lose!

There is only one adjustment in stock trim but you can have your WUR built to be adjustable and then have a much wider range of adjustability.

I think that'll be the next purchase. Or on of those digital wur(s)........

You would know for sure if you didn't drive like a 90 year old Asian lady.

:mad:

It is in the mid nines. Cruising is 14.7 and when I step on it, it drops rapidly. Unfortunately, the o2 sensor is gone so I haven't tested WOT with the fuel enrichment dropped down a notch.

You aren't even going to attempt to deny this?

Ronnie's930, I'm curious, how does one get a WUR to be adjustable.....is there much involved in doing this? Villiageidiot sorry for hijacking your thread!

Cheers!

Alex

No problem! the more people that post in this thread the betterSmileWavy More info is always good:D

You're just mad because I passed you on that drive with my windows up and the ac on! :D

And here we go.......:D

Does this look familiar?

1974 Porsche 914 race car - $1500 (Kailua)
1974 Porsche 914 race car

There were severaly threads on this when I did a quick search - here is one:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/272502-modified-my-wur.html

I am a DIY person, but for this I just sent mine to the WUR guru, Brian Leask.

Another guy, well know on this board, Brian Bodart - RarlyL8 Motorsports, even stocks already modded WURs that you can buy . . .

"I'm not sure if you would need a logger with CIS if you have a display. It seems like you could only tune for full throttle, or maybe for fuel economy, since there is only one adjustment and it affects the entire range."

That's exactly right on! And using the WUR as an adjustment for the AFRs has
the same effect as the mixture screw, i.e. Both vary the control pressure which
affects the full range.

Wow! that looks just like my 914!! I wonder...............:eek:

I respectfully submit that you are mistaken - I know for certain that adjustments to the WUR have much more dramatic effects to control pressures/AFRs than the mixture screw does. The mixture screw affects idle AFRs but only has a very minor effect on the mid and top ranges while adjustments to the WUR have dramatic effects all across the board. This has been well documented time and again with wide-band meters both on the road and on dynos . . .

"I respectfully submit that you are mistaken - I know for certain that adjustments to the WUR have much more dramatic effects to control pressures/AFRs than the mixture screw does."

So! The key point is that they both affect the same thing, i.e. the control pressure,
and over the full range. And for most/all situations, only very small changes are
required to tweak the AFRs unless a major problem exists. This excludes situations
where an external ECU is used to selectively change the control pressure at certain RPMs.

Bottom line: A monitor of the AFRs has limited utility other than to make a change
of the mixture over the full range, and not like the utility for an EFI system.

Ronnie's.930, any idea how much a modded WUR goes for, for an '80SC?

Alex

Brian Leask charges about $350.00 to mod a Turbo WUR don't know about SC. His also comes with an excellent, comprehensive guide to tuning and a tool as well.

Brian Bodart is very easy to get in touch with - RarlyL8 is his handle on this board. I believe that he works in concert with Leask (or did at one time).

Here is one of Bodart's threads:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-930-turbo-super-charging-forum/642234-show-tell-help-me-restore-neglected-930-a.html

Once nice thing about both is that you tell them about your engine, ignition and fuel system (mods etc) and they "pre-set" the adjustments - it seems they are usually pretty close if not spot on (based on feedback on this board).

This is the one that I have and it is great. You can get it from our host and on the setup I have you can log RPM, AFR, vacuum/boost. Up to 2 hours worth and download with a USB connector to your PC or laptop.

I have used it very successfully with my MFI 2.7 motor. Could not do without it. And it is an easy Porsche installation with no need for other parts, like a tach adapter, and a data logger and and....$$$

This is my installation AFR is the lower gauge. Upper one is a volt meter. There is a switch on the right to turn off the voltmeter so you don't get confused with AFR

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1330568648.jpg


Here is the main unit. This box, a cable and a wideband sensor is the whole setup. The internals are mil-spec and really high quality.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1330568778.jpg

Here is what the kit looks like. Comes with everything including software. The cable is made in China.......the rest right here in the USA. Check more information at http://www.daytona-sensors.com/WEGO4.html loads of information here.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1330568824.jpg

Looks like a nice unit. Data logging is a plus, I'm only really worried about what's going on when I'm hard on the gas in 3rd or 4th.

I just found out I'll have to swap the exhaust studs for some longer ones for the thick-flanged SSI's.

I'm excited though as none of the exhaust nuts were seized:D

Here is a chart from the supplied software

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1330575792.jpg

So, are those dips in the green line indicative of when you shifted into the next gear?

No, rpm's are increasing while AFR's are jumping, looks like a bad CIS

Shifting looks like this:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1330589926.gif

Have you tested the PLX unit yet, how did it turn out?

Waiting on new(longer) exhaust studs. Just got a call that they've arrived. Hoping to get everything done this weekend so I can report the results:cool:

Hopefully the old exhaust studs won't be too hard to remove..........

So my understanding is that without the adjustable WUR, one can only make one adjustment to fuel enrichment which entails adjusting the AFR at WOT. Should this be done "under load" or by simply applying the throttle until redline and adjusting the mixture to your desired AFR? Does being under load affect the AFR at WOT?
Thanks!

Alex

Took me awhile to finish as the first 2 studs came out easily while the remaining 10 broke:mad:
So, after much, much cursing I mulled over pulling the motor to flip it in order to drill and time-cert the offending portions of the studs.

In the end I drilled them on the car(thank God for the lift @ work) and time-certed them.

Thank fully the w/b kit I have had just enough length in the wires to do the install. After I check for oil leaks from the new oil lines, I took her out for a good spin.

After warm-up, at idle I was seeing afrs of 14.6 or so which is good. Under load in 3rd and 4th I saw 12.3-12.9 and 13.5 under cruise(moderate load). I was a bit concerned when I first fired it up as I was seeing the afr @ 12.1, but once warm(above 170 deg on the gauge) it fell in line.

Now that that's done on to the next project!!

On to raising the spindles on my Bilstein strut housingsSmileWavy

Thanks for the followup.

Was this on E10 or pure gas?

Good ole 92 octane:)

I can't wait to save up enough cash for some Weber/PMO's to see if this will be helpful