Secure service agents?

[Big_Mac]

A friend of a friend recently had his car stolen. It was really traumatic because the thieves broke into his house during the night, woke him, threatened him with a gun and took his car keys (leaving his wallet and rolex).

The police later recovered his vehicle after a high speed chase but the thieves managed to escape. It transpires that they had stolen a number of similar vehicles, probably to order, and had obtained the owners addresses by breaking into a main dealer and stealing the service and sales records.

The car was returned by the police forensics last week and went to the (same) main dealer to be tidied up. But get this - during the valet they found live rounds under the passenger seat! The car has now gone back to the forensics.

I guess if someone is determined enough to have your pride and joy then there isn't much you can do. And if it is taken, how much faith do you have in plod in getting it back and catching the offenders?

[Rick Lee]

How could this happen in England? I thought the gun ban made everyone safe. Geez - I sure hope my gov't confiscates the SIG Sauer .45 I have waiting for an intruder, before I hurt an innocent with it.

[Joeaksa]

Richard,

They can confiscate my .45 auto when they "pry if from my cold, dead fingers!"

I was in London last week and there were two cases where criminals used guns to commit crimes then. Glad to see that their ban on guns has kept honest citizens from being able to protect themselves!

Joe

Lifetime NRA member

[HawgRyder]

There is only one way to fix the gun problem....with a new (and completely encompassing) law.
I drafted one several years ago, but nothing has happened with it.
I guess lawyers would be out of work too quickly!
The law reads: Possession of a gun in the commision of a crime carries a mandatory death sentance.
This way...no matter whether the gun is used or not...there are no repeat offenders.
A nice sidebar to this....drive by shootings would fall...after all...it is illegal to have a gun in the car unless it is properly licenced.
All an officer would have to do is stop the car on a routine check...find the gun....and arrest the owner (if one of the bunch did not claim it, then all would be deamed to be in possession).
Any law abiding citizen would be protected...like hunters and target shooters...and moving weapons from place to place would be covered with a temp permit....hence...no crime.
All the jury would have to determine...did the perp have a gun?
Imagine....the perp enters the corner store...says give me the money....worker says no...perp says "I have a gun"...worker says "show me"...perp can't...(would show on the camera)...worker refuses to hand over money....perp leaves in disgust!
My 2 cents
Bob

[makaio]

If some one tried that $hit on me, my attack cats would shred them to pieces. And if that didn't work, then the perp has their choice of a 12 gauge slug, or .45.

[Saffs]

There's another phenomenon at work here - relevant or not - a lot of the gun hold-ups in the UK are with replica guns - it's become quite a big thing after handguns are harder to come buy. Not that that makes much difference to the fact that someone is pointing at you, and it's just as wrong.
Anyhow, I'm intrigued as to how all you who are saying, "Try that **** with me" stuff: how do you get your gun out and shoot someone when they wake you up in the night with a gun to your head?

[Rick Lee]

I know the toy guns are more popular among European crooks, as the real things are a little harder to come by, but also because so many Europeans didn't grow up around guns and many wouldn't know a real one from a Fisher Price. I don't think that phenomenon would cut it here in the States. Whether or not the gun is real, the law treats it as armed robbery or aggravated assault and the perp is just as likely to get shot by the cops or the victim. A criminal is far more likely to need a real gun to pull off a crime here. There's no way someone who's dumb enough to break and enter a house at night in Virginia (a lot of armed homeowners here) is gonna make it to my bed without me being wide awake and waiting for him. I even had a cop at my house once ask me if I was "protected", meaning did I have a gun and know how to use it. He nodded in approval when I told him yes.

[Saffs]

Originally posted by Richard LeSchander
I know the toy guns are more popular among European crooks, as the real things are a little harder to come by, but also because so many Europeans didn't grow up around guns and many wouldn't know a real one from a Fisher Price. I don't think that phenomenon would cut it here in the States.

You're right, there. And as you point out, there's so much difference in the gun situation between Europe and the US - although I'm just aquatinted with the UK really, and worked in the US, on and off, for 10 years, so I have some feelings, and I understand how different it is....

[Kemo]

this is kinda off the topic...But...

Do the police in the UK even carry guns? For some reason thought they didn't, just a whistle and a billy-club.

[Saffs]

Originally posted by Kemo
this is kinda off the topic...But...

Do the police in the UK even carry guns? For some reason thought they didn't, just a whistle and a billy-club.

For the most part, no. There's armed response vehicles available, fast, I think. Plus for certain jobs, like airport security, they are armed - in the case of airport security, they carry around machine guns, and have done for many years. But the bobby on the street, or car, is unarmed, and I don't think they want to change it as they deem they don't need too. I'm sure Police in bad areas of big Cities have apprehensions, though....

[Joeaksa]

I have lived and worked in Europe (Denmark and Germany) for over 10 years. Had a carry permit for weapons in Germany, which is very hard to obtain.

The various gov'ts have almost banned weapons for the general public in most of Europe. You have to go through a long (up to a year) school and licensing process and have a complete background check as well as join a local gun club. You then cannot keep the weapon (unless you are authorized to carry) at home and must lock it at the club. Pistols are very difficult to get, rifles a bit easier and shotguns the easiest.

Everywhere I went, the criminals had weapons to commit a crime, and most places the public were defenseless, like lambs at slaughter.

I had a friend in Holland and stayed at his house a while back. We all slept upstairs and before turning in he told me that should I hear intruders in the downstairs floor, pls do not do anything against them! Seems that the locals have an "arrangement" with the local druggies that they will not molest them whilst they steal what they want to sell for drugs, and in return the druggies will not shoot them! Insurance pays for the losses and they just turn their backs and let this continue... Sounds real spineless to me and it would not happen in my household.

Hope they do not try this in Arizona or Texas.... we practice gun control and I mean the type where I use BOTH hands to shoot the perps!

Joe

[ChrisBennet]

Alas, even New Hampshire is not immune from this sort of anti-gun sentiment. There is even talk of dropping the NRA membership requirement for NH citizens and fines for shooting car radio thieves.
-Chris