74 911 vs 95 XJS

[Jamul74]

With all the talk about Porsche moving away from its roots/racing/design etc...I thought I would offer some insight into my driving impressions between the two cars and some comments on just who has moved farther away from the original design.
My wife's 95 XJS convertible(96 was last year for old style design) is a beautiful car, sapphire blue, cream leather, nice wood and probably(in my opinion) the most gorgeous lines on a luxury car I can recall.
Now, the XJS is the culmination of many years of XK design and is still recognizable as deriving from the XKE which most of you will agree is one of the best looking designs ever. But, if you look at my 74 Targa and compare it to the 74 XKE and then take wifey's 95 XJS and compare to a 95 911 or 993 or whatever, the Porsche is much closer to its roots than the Jag is.
I guess what I'm saying is in comparison to other marques Porsche is still recognizable as what it is.. a real sports car and not some luxo cruiser.

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Dan S.
1974 911 Targa

[epbrown]

I don't agree with that. Porsche is good, but Jaguar has been pretty good as far as sticking to their heritage as well. Until I saw Jack's pending XK8, I thought Jaguars were easily recognizable as far as lineage went. It's the US companies that like the dramatic "what the hell is that" changes, in my experience.

Emanuel

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Everybody wants a normal life and a cool car;
most people settle for the car." Chris Titus
1966 Rolls-Royce Silver Shadow
1983 Porsche 911 SC Targa

[Jack Olsen]

Well, well, a subject near and dear to my heart. I agree that the XJ-S is a gorgeous car, but I'd say it has more in common with the XJ-6 than the C-, D- and E-type Jaguars. I'd say the new XK8 bears a pretty good family resemblance to the XK-E:

XKE:



XK8:



The XJS ain't bad, either:



(Click for a larger image.)

In fact, I think the XK8 is a nice modernized reinterpretation of old Jaguar elements, without ever sliding into retro nostalgia (in spite of their lame retro marketing:



Which goes as far back as the XJS, at least:



There have always been two kinds of Jags. There's the lightweight Rolls Royce look -- the parade car for loyalty, from the early models to the current XJ and the new, smaller models. The kind where you put a leaper on the hood. And then there's the sports type, which threads from the C-Type all the way to the new F-type. All of them bear some things in common. Pretty much all of them are extremely easy on the eyes, too.

As a footnote, my long-in-delivery XK8 passed by Warren's hometown of San Angelo earlier today. I expect to see it on Wednesday.


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Jack Olsen
My Rennlist page • My Pelican Gallery page • My Porsche Owners Gallery page

[This message has been edited by JackOlsen (edited 08-20-2001).]

[Jack Olsen]

And bringing it back to Porsche...

I think Porsche was great at maintaining the lineage of the 911. But cars like the 914 and 928 seem to have nothing at all in common, really, in terms of design. Porsche has always been an outfit with only two or three great ideas, and then enough other crap to round out the product line and keep them viable as a company. The 550, 356 and 911 are the anchors of the breed, to me. Everything else, while nice, is window dressing.

My over-inflated .02.

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Jack Olsen
My Rennlist page • My Pelican Gallery page • My Porsche Owners Gallery page

[Jamul74]

EP/Jack,
When we were searching for her car I offered to go for the XK8 but she was adamant that the old style of 95/96 was what she wanted. SHe even accused the XK8 of looking like a Chrylser Sebring. Now that is a low blow but in my opinion I'm still trying to work through the new style. Until you brought up the XKE comparison in looks I never would have seen the conection but I think you may be onto something there. Either way my wife is happy with it and I'm enjoying the solid luxo ride.
I wonder if Porsche is thinking of moving in the same direction someday, first the Cayenne and then who knows maybe a two door luxo cruiser with a V8?

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Dan S.
1974 911 Targa

[Jack Olsen]

The XK8 owes most of its styling cues to a one-off XJS spyder that Pininfarina did for Jaguar as a design study. The XK8 is built on an XJS frame, although it has different suspension subassemblies and about a third fewer parts. Everything else -- drivetrain, electronics, brakes, AC -- is all new.

And yes, there are some angles where it looks vaguely like a Chrysler. I can see the argument.

Pininfarina also did the redesign of the Series III XJ-6. I've read on this board that Porsche was offered the chance to submit a redesign for the same model, but Butzi -- who drove an XJ6 -- said he couldn't improve on it.

The new one is a little too streamlined, for my tastes. There's a design midpoint between the XKE and the XK8 that I'd probably be most happy with, but I'll give the new one a try.

Especially in the convertible, the XJS is a pretty flawless design. As a longtime owner of an XJ-6, it's the ZF transmission, all-new engine, Japanese electronics, and such that I'm excited about.

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Jack Olsen
My Rennlist page • My Pelican Gallery page • My Porsche Owners Gallery page

[Roland Kunz]

Hello

UPS

The 914 is a strong follower from the 911. The car is even more radically functionaly then the 911. It has a lower drag and the lines where didtatet by the function but it isnt a "box" design.

The 928 was made to look complete new and should capture own markeds. the car was used to be designed contrary to the other Porsches but still the from follows the function. It was only Fuhrmanns idear later to swift the 911 people into that car.

About Jaguar:

Sir Lyons is dead and his last influenced car was the XJS with should hit also the same costumers like the 928. The 911 and XK where very close and both companys feared to continue such a "foolish" car that would provoke Nader or Neider ( german Wordgame Ned = envy ).

Both cars had potential for Racing. Tom Walkinshaw showed a biting cat while Porsche made some Clubsports and let private drivers seek for laurels. They should have tryed to win Le mans or the Safari ( remeber the 911 failed due to bad circumstances and Mercedes sent out the 928 competiture SLC 500 to show there invincibility ).

The new XK8 is somehow mixed beetween the original XK and the XJS but if you jump from a 928 GTS into a XK8 you think you sit in a XJS again. If you jump from a XJS into a XK 8 you think you drive a 928 with a undertone Mercedes. But the XK8 is still going his own way.
The XK engine is a jewel even compared to the 928 engine. Not brute power ( didn´t drove the eaton version ) more Lexus refienment ( or close to the V12 ) but the sounds made are from nice puur to loud roar with is the favorite tune for cat people.

BTW is Warren Testdriving your XK to check if everything is proper ?

Grüsse