3.6 A/C Upgrade

[wwest]

Originally Posted by 962

My car is an 1987 Carrera What if you add a modified 95 3.6 twin turbo transplant engine with a full bay intercooler like this into the mix.

Recommendations appreciated.....Money is no object ! What mods should I make to the 87 chassis, to make the system work well?

In its "Native" environment that engine had an "after-run" cabin heater blower control to prevent rising engine heat post engine shutdown. The circuit also worked during engine operation to prevent overheating during low engine RPM operation. Some of that have been the result of the aerodynamically curved fan blades being "tuned" for moreso for high RPM engine operation with the cabin heater fan as "fill-in" at lower RPMs.

In any case you most certainly wish to transport that engine cooling capability to the new host.

I would also seriously consider an upgrade to that cabin heater fan/blower.

Also, were this to be me, I would install a rear spoiler large enough to accommodate 2 good size high volume "Spal" fan to help with cooling the IC and the engine, powered via that same after-run circuit....couldn't hurt.

Regarding A/C this is were to start...



And be sure to ignore any Pro-Cooler suggestions, those are purely, ONLY parasitic.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by wwest

10-15 years in business and still getting by primariliy selling Snake Oil...

You blow off posts where folks take time to write with the assumption you will read and respond in good faith and then you don't. A flippant juvenile response is the best you come up.

Is that all have to offer?

Fans, switches, jihad/flippancy? That's it?

[wwest]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

You blow off posts where folks take time to write with the assumption you will read and respond in good faith and then you don't.

We can be pretty certain that Kuehl had no expectation of an "in kind" response as he is well aware that I am purely a NewBe in this venue. Kuehl posted that only for "effect"...

A flippant juvenile response is the best you come up.

And here I was thinking my response was very much to the point.

Is that all have to offer?

Fans, switches, jihad/flippancy? That's it?

Fans and switches are NOT to be taken lightly....

Speaking of which does anyone know why Griffiths now only sells the 930 A/C condenser W/O fan...? Was the fan dropped from the product line for a reason?

[brads911sc]

Post the videos wwest

[tirwin]

Originally Posted by wwest

Obviously you haven't done much remote troubleshooting....most of the time you only hear back if your suggested fix/solution doesn't help.

^^^This is how quotes work. You use the words QUOTE and /QUOTE inside square brackets. It's like HTML but with square brackets inside of left/right carats.

This statement deserves correction. How is it obvious that I haven't done much remote troubleshooting? Please explain. I'm very interested in this since I spent a good chunk of my career running the engineering group for a very large ISP network with millions of broadband and business customers and I've spent many years providing technical consulting to one of the nation's largest wireless providers. I spend a lot of time right down the road from you in Redmond and Bellevue in fact. Was just over at the Willows Lodge recently. I've done quite a bit of remote troubleshooting in my day. Pretty darn good at it I might add. So I'm trying to figure out how it is that you're apparently the only one that gets to make statements like "Obviously..." and yet you're the first in line to call everyone else out for making "speculative" statements.

Now as far as your statement that "most of the time you only hear back if your suggested fix/solution doesn't help", well I see people all the time that people report back. Sure, not everyone does, but it sure seems to me that SOMEONE, ANYONE, at this point would've said by now that they took your advice and given us some feedback on how it went. Maybe, just maybe, the way you're going about things is proving to be a DISSERVICE to the community. What seems most important to you is NOT what helps the community, it is that you "win" the argument. To have the last word. So you'll have to excuse me if I find you to be disingenuous in that regard.

Once again, you miss the point. All kinds of people have tried to give you the hint, but you just don't get it. I thought ol' Bob with his lighthearted ways ("Nobody calls me Bucky." That stills makes me laugh.) might just actually stand a chance but once again I was proven wrong.

Q: What's the difference between a bad idea and a good idea communicated poorly?

A: Nothing.

So, yes, I do believe my remote troubleshooting skills are just fine. In fact I think I have this problem NAILED. It's not about tech at all. It's about your ego.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by wwest

Fans and switches are NOT to be taken lightly....

Speaking of which does anyone know why Griffiths now only sells the 930 A/C condenser W/O fan...? Was the fan dropped from the product line for a reason?

We have been through this before. We (shills and deputy shills) assume you are thinking that he pulled the product because it solved too many issues and would render his other offer of no value at any price (save fender condenser)

Regarding the super hot Houston scenario. If there were super duper fans on the front and rear condensers - I am am talking real nice kit - and all the switches you could have - and an additional fender condenser, kuehls or similar, would that make the difference that is needed to reach the temp goal kuehl posted in the "challenge"? Let's say a more efficient compressor as well, unless the 87 is way better than my old York was.

At least give us your thoughts and allow kuehl a chance to respond given his stake in your game.

[brads911sc]

^^^ what he said...

[wwest]

Originally Posted by tirwin

wwest,

You are just impossible. I mean if you were really so concerned about helping others and preventing them from spending money unnecessarily, there are a quite a few things that I could think of that would be far more useful to people than the A/C subject.

A couple of weeks ago, a mechanic posted a question one of my CIS YouTube videos. He had a old 911 in his shop and clearly had no idea how to troubleshoot what was wrong. He replaced the fuel accumulator (~$500) and a few other things just randomly swapping parts out trying to fix the car. I told him he shouldn't do that and he said "it's ok, I got permission from the owner." That is taking someone to the proverbial cleaners in my book. And you know what? It happens all day, every day.

So the way I look at it, there are all kinds of topics on here where we could discuss (argue?) for hours about whether the benefits suggested by the manufacturers are really as good as they say. Heck, maybe all those people who believe polybronze bushings are vastly superior are suffering from some form of mass delusion. There are plenty of things where we can help other people by learning from our mistakes or coaching them through the problems they face. There are examples of that all over the place.

But yet you seem to fixate on Charlie and his products. Why is that? It seems it's all because at some point he dared to bruise your delicate ego.

I just don't get you. Just think what you could contribute if you used your powers for good instead of evil. There are healthy ways of carrying on an intellectual discourse. You choose not to. I am giving you honest feedback when I say this -- if you think you are trying to help DIYers, the way you have handled these A/C conversations has probably counteracted any help you seek to provide.


I asked you recently if we had ANY examples of someone listening to your advice and coming back to this forum and saying "yep, what wwest suggested really works."

You instead gave me some vague statement that others have tried it before. So I'll go back to my previous question. Since it seems we have NO evidence of you convincing anyone to attempt your ideas, how successful would you say your approach as been? If you were actually selling a product, I'd say it's time to go back to the ol' drawing board and re-examine your approach. It does not appear to be working. At the very least, if you still believe you technical ideas have merit, I'd certainly say you need to rethink your sales approach.

But maybe it's not really about your ideas being helpful. Maybe this is all just a petty little game that is designed to steer business away from Charlie because he made you mad. All I can say is - how pathetic.

For the record, I have none of Charlie's products. I don't know Charlie. So no "buyer's remorse" (as you put it) here. I just think this little charade has gone on long enough.

I'm sure you'll respond like you always do. Picking apart every sentence. Never learning how the quote tags work so that you can pick apart words but making difficult for others to do the same to you. (It's really not that hard, I promise.) Always have to have the last word in everything. Let me save you the effort in your response. Unless you're ready to drop this little jihad and move on to actually attempting to be a productive person around here, I don't give two hoots in hell what you have to say.

I think I speak for others when I say we would welcome productive input from you, but really, this has gone far enough (too far, really, and for far too long).

No feedback for POSITIVE results, typical.

[brads911sc]

How do you explain all the positive feedback for GTI on ac, or other products? Brad penn oil? Barry hershon distributor service? PMO carbs? Nickies? Elephant racing oil coolers? Lol wwest lol you are delusional.

[wwest]

Originally Posted by tirwin

^^^This is how quotes work. You use the words QUOTE and /QUOTE inside square brackets. It's like HTML but with square brackets inside of left/right carats.

This statement deserves correction. How is it obvious that I haven't done much remote troubleshooting? Please explain.

See post #208..

I'm very interested in this since I spent a good chunk of my career running the engineering group for a very large ISP network with millions of broadband and business customers and I've spent many years providing technical consulting to one of the nation's largest wireless providers. I spend a lot of time right down the road from you in Redmond and Bellevue in fact. Was just over at the Willows Lodge recently. I've done quite a bit of remote troubleshooting in my day. Pretty darn good at it I might add. So I'm trying to figure out how it is that you're apparently the only one that gets to make statements like "Obviously..." and yet you're the first in line to call everyone else out for making "speculative" statements.

You question implied, OBVIOUSLY, that there is an expectation that positive results will yeild a call back in acknowledgement. The above makes it OBVIOUS that you should be fully aware of that circumstance.

Now as far as your statement that "most of the time you only hear back if your suggested fix/solution doesn't help", well I see people all the time that people report back.

Sentence seemingly not well constructed but...

"...I see people allthe time.."

Yes, face to face folks very often express appreciation.

Sure, not everyone does, but it sure seems to me that SOMEONE, ANYONE, at this point would've said by now that they took your advice and given us some feedback on how it went.

Sorry, in my 40 some odd years of worldwide remote computer systems troubleshooting my experience has mostly been that I must call back myself if I wish/need feedback.

Maybe, just maybe, the way you're going about things is proving to be a DISSERVICE to the community. What seems most important to you is NOT what helps the community, it is that you "win" the argument. To have the last word. So you'll have to excuse me if I find you to be disingenuous in that regard.

You're excused...

Once again, you miss the point. All kinds of people have tried to give you the hint, but you just don't get it. I thought ol' Bob with his lighthearted ways ("Nobody calls me Bucky." That stills makes me laugh.) might just actually stand a chance but once again I was proven wrong.

Q: What's the difference between a bad idea and a good idea communicated poorly?

A: Nothing.

So, yes, I do believe my remote troubleshooting skills are just fine. In fact I think I have this problem NAILED. It's not about tech at all. It's about your ego.

Maybe so...

Do people thinking "outside the box" always get this treatment...??

[wwest]

Originally Posted by brads911sc

How do you explain all the positive feedback for GTI on ac,

"Hereabouts", involving responses to my posts, mostly buyer remorse, self justification for spending $$$$ on A/C upgrades, Snake Oil, when $ would have done the trick...

or other products? Brad penn oil? Barry hershon distributor service? PMO carbs? Nickies? Elephant racing oil coolers? Lol wwest lol you are delusional.

"..Brad Penn.." You mean like maybe this post series..?

question for the oil guys

"..Barry Hershon.."

Who rebuilds/restores Bosch distributors??

Elephant...

...

Originally Posted by mrm930

1) Rebel - yes Clint can be hard to get a hold of sometimes. But, he is extremely helpful and does package deals - where Elephant doesn't.

2) I had to get cost from Elephant twice and in both cases I told him it was 80% street/20% DEs. And he still kept quoting me items that I didn't need. All at his list price - no package deals. I called and talked to the owner (sorry - forgot his name) and he sent me another quote - still with the same items that I didn't need. To me - Elephant is more interested in the sale than helping you.

I am doing coilovers and removing the torsion bars. Already installed the fronts - getting quotes from Clint to do the rears.

Again, my vote is for Clint at Rebel.

[tirwin]

wwest,

Highlighting it in purple and using a larger font doesn't change anything.

But if you want to keep telling yourself that because it makes you feel better to believe it, then go right ahead. It doesn't change the facts.

You would have us to believe that there are all kinds of people that have taken your advice and yet not ONE single person has come forward to support it after all this time? Now that is funny.

Maybe it's not the message, but the messenger.

[Bob Kontak]

These AC threads where wwest crashes the party have got to be in the same family as Off-Topic Politics and Religion Forum - PARF.

I am forwarding my concern to a moderator.

[brads911sc]

You Are missing the point. Again...

It's not about a particular product. It's that there are positive statements made and they do not = buyers remorse.
Get a life wwest. If positive comments = buyers remorse them you regret buying Lexus, spal and whatever else works well for you. Or does that only apply to those other than you.

Quote de brads911sc/wwest

How do you explain all the positive feedback for GTI on ac,



"Hereabouts", involving responses to my posts, mostly buyer remorse, self justification for spending $$$$ on A/C upgrades, Snake Oil, when $ would have done the trick...



or other products? Brad penn oil? Barry hershon distributor service? PMO carbs? Nickies? Elephant racing oil coolers? Lol wwest lol you are delusional.

"..Brad Penn.." You mean like maybe this post series..?



question for the oil guys

[Algernon]

The more I hear this BS from Wwest the more I want to save up and buy Kuehl's stuff!
Wait - maybe that is Wwest's motivation! - He secretly admires Kuehl products so much that he feels by playing devil's advocate he will actually increase Kuehl's sales!
Damn, it's working!

[wwest]

Originally Posted by Algernon

The more I hear this BS from Wwest the more I want to save up and buy Kuehl's stuff!
Wait - maybe that is Wwest's motivation! - He secretly admires Kuehl products so much that he feels by playing devil's advocate he will actually increase Kuehl's sales!
Damn, it's working!

Oops, you found me, us, out.. That extra $300.00 that Kuehl gets for each evaporator sale goes directly to......

[brads911sc]

Wwest = loser

[wwest]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

We have been through this before. We (shills and deputy shills) assume you are thinking that he pulled the product because it solved too many issues and would render his other offer of no value at any price (save fender condenser)

Regarding the super hot Houston scenario. If there were super duper fans on the front and rear condensers - I am am talking real nice kit - and all the switches you could have - and an additional fender condenser, kuehls or similar, would that make the difference that is needed to reach the temp goal kuehl posted in the "challenge"? Let's say a more efficient compressor as well, unless the 87 is way better than my old York was.

At least give us your thoughts and allow kuehl a chance to respond given his stake in your game.

To begin, let's talk about what I do know, what I believe factually. I strongly believe that the single major shortcoming if our Porsche's factory A/C is the lack of refrigerant condensation capacity with the engine consistently operating in the low RPM ranges. That may well be due to low pumping volume of the compressor. But I do not believe that to be the case.

How many owners have added the fender condenser/fan assembly and ended up satisfied with the results....??

So why not add additional cooling capacity for the rear engine lid condenser as a first pass solution...?