3D Printing Hard to Get Parts?

[Tspringer]

I was reading about some of the new 3D printing technology that is out there and it sounds pretty amazing. Guys are "printing" all sorts of stuff, even to include pieces that are mechanically functional including some moving parts.

This got me thinking....

The last time I priced a set of reproduction high butterfly MFI stacks they were like $10K which seems pretty crazy.

I know Porsche made MFI stacks of different materials including plastic. Since the injectors are in the head, there is not much sustained fuel exposure. 3D printers generate parts in plastic of different types and I read that some are fuel resistant.

I doubt that you could print out a complete MFI stack setup ready to go... but it would sure seem plausible to print out the basic stacks that would need minimal finishing and then assemble with the metal parts.

Anyone looked into this? R style taillight housings - tall carb manifolds - all sorts of brackets and trim pieces - its seems that 3D printing would bring all sorts of rare and stupid expensive parts to being cheaper and available.

[Alan Lindquist]

I looked into 3D printing. For now, it is more appropriate for prototyping parts. Its very expensive to use the technology for production of goods for use.

[chris_seven]

The economics are still quite poor and once you want more than 2-3 parts it seems better to pay for tooling.

We just used this method to rapid prototype a tap handle for a beer diespenser and it cost about $4000 for a single part.

It isn't strong enough to function but looks OK.

There is a guy somewhere printing shoes but the cost is horrific.

[Cory M]

We have a couple of rapid prototype machines at my work. I have given the guys solid models at lunch and received parts on my desk the following day. For plastics the quality can vary a lot depending on the machines (surface finish, ductility, etc). They sure are convenient though.

If you want to see something really cool look up Direct Metal Laser Sintering (DLMS). It's rapid prototyping using metal powder instead of liquid plastic. The capability is crazy. You are creating the interior and exterior surfaces at the same time, so you can make detailed 3D parts without any of the limitations of traditional machining. It's used in aerospace but must be getting cheaper because I recently saw a bike manufacturer make parts with it.

[quattrorunner]

There are some really cheep printers available these days. Not close to good enough for the jewelry need I have, but the models I've gotten as samples would be appropriate for making a sand mold.

[herr_oberst]

F1 teams are printing parts in the pits these days. Won't be long until this technology filters down to the common porsche owner.

[SoCalSK8r]

We have a 3d printer that prints in ABS. Some of these part are definitely functional, just depends on the application, but it's definitely awesome.

[Brad394]

I'm in the process of putting together a 3D printer for home use - the hardest part is the set-up to get quality pieces. The home stuff uses mostly open-source software which adds to the learning curve. quality does vary but like most manufactured parts they can be post production finished as well. I'll keep everyone posted as to my progress.

As mentioned above - high butterflies, carb - throttlebody manifolds, etc ... the limit is your imagination

[dad911]

I've been printing parts for about a year now, will post some pics later, but you need to consider the limitations. Parts are strong in compression, but can have issues where the layers bond. Makes great spacers, pulleys, mounts for low-stress things. Some printers are designed to use printed parts, making them almost self-replicating.

Lots of examples/files on 'thingiverse'

[69911e]

The printer we have will print ABS but does not have a beautiful surface finish. Well, maybe on a single flat surface under some circumstances. These print layer by layer with a lower limit somewhere around 0.1mm. They have better resolution on the x and y axis.
The material is not as strong as the same part injection molded under most circumstances, but can have advantages as it can create a honeycomb internal structure for light strong parts if your design takes advantages of this.
Cost is relatively cheap. Machines are starting at $400; material is $20 per pound (cheaper in bulk). A pound goes a long way.... I have designed products at work which we use the printer for production parts which are not visible. Mostly internal brackets. Most materials other than ABS or PLA can get very expensive and/or toxic to print from these printers.

Brad: Have fun assembling yours. My boys spent a couple months of last summer assembling their PB+ kit and getting it running (ages 8&11). I then assisted and we modified it significantly to get better quality faster prints. PM me if you run into any problems.

Here is the link for the shift couplers I made last night.
Cut your own shifter bushings; open source CAD model!

[dad911]

Here is a vid of my printer:

[Matt Monson]

We are using the technology both in prototyping and in manufacturing. Attached is a picture of our proprietary Cup Car sequential that we just finished designing and manufacturing. Originally we went with the 3d printing on the plastic oil lines you see because we were having a problem finding someone that could work in aluminum in the diameter and with the sort of radii that we needed. PRI was coming up and we needed to have it "finished" for the booth. After further discussion with the printing company we decided to use it on the production pieces. We've tested on it and it works just fine at gearbox temps of 200+ degrees. We haven't run a 12 or 24 hour race with it yet, but that will probably happen at some point. And it is not terribly expensive. We recently had a complete gearbox case printed. That cost $3500, but even that is 1/2 to 1/3 of what it would have cost just a year ago.

[dave 911]

What material is the gearbox printed in? Can printers print using metal?

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by dave 911

What material is the gearbox printed in? Can printers print using metal?

The gearbox case was only a rapid prototype to make sure that our new design could be assembled as a gearbox. That print was plastic. We are going to get patterns made and have it cast in aluminum or magnesium. We haven't quite reached the point yet where we can do something like that, though I believe certain F1 and/or hypercar makers are playing with different materials for printed gearbox cases. I think I read it in Racecar Engineering but my memory isn't what it used to be and I don't recall the exact context other than it got my attention because they were talking gearbox cases.

[69911e]

Originally Posted by dave 911

What material is the gearbox printed in? Can printers print using metal?

Yes, some can print in metal. It is heated after printing.
Here is a link for a service which will print your designs:
3D Printing Materials on Shapeways

[Hydrocket]

It really depends which method, since there are so many different types of "3D printing".

Stereolithography is layering using liquid resins. Many printers use this method.

Laser Sintering (SLS) does essentially the same thing, but from powdered resins.

And then there is Laser Melting (SLM)...which can created metal parts from standard metals. Direct Metal Laser Sintering (DMLS) is the big-brother to SLM. It can create production ready, strong metallic parts. But the machines to do this last one are extremely expensive.

[Hydrocket]

Originally Posted by dave 911

What material is the gearbox printed in? Can printers print using metal?

Direct Metal Laser Sintering can do this. But the machines are prohibitively expensive. ($500K+)

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by Hydrocket

Direct Metal Laser Sintering can do this. But the machines are prohibitively expensive. ($500K+)

I guess it is all relative. Some of our machines cost twice that or more.

[SpeedracerIndy]

My job takes me into a lot of automotive R&D facilities and I see these 3d printers all the time being used for fast prototyping. They are amazing.

One of the R&D guys told me one time that they can 3d print a part that can't be recreated in a manufacturing facility. So engineers are always coming up with ideas that can't be manufactured large scale but can be printed. For example a ball within a ball with no molding seams (might not be the best example). Something I had never thought of. I wonder if they will ever progress to manufacturing in large scale and we will begin to see a new type of innovation in automobiles. Just thinking out loud...

Sorry for the unrelated hijack. I tend to geek out over stuff like this.

On another note, I've heard that the adult novelty industry has started utilizing 3d printers as well.

[Hydrocket]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

I guess it is all relative. Some of our machines cost twice that or more.

Well yea. I meant for the Average Joe.

Our 6 Axis CNC machines here are $1.8 million. Each.