How to make progress on a limited buget?

[Enigma03]

I get about 200 a month I can dump into this car....how the heck do you guys afford these things ?
I need some alterntives on building this motor...I made a parts list on here and for new stuff its over 3 grand for just cylinders/pistions and gaskets I'm not sure what cams cost but I have a feeling I be into 4 grand before I get just the engine done...Are there any used places I can check for used parts?
I am almost thinking that a used motor would do me just as well and be cheaper to deal with...I have seen some for less than 3 grand that are complete and fewer miles....what motors can I use in my 68?
But if not a used I think my new plan of attack is just getting everything cleaned up and back together with a gasket set.
I have other systems I need to overhaul too (such as brakes and fuel) and I can't wait to see the prices on that stuff :P
So I guess what I am really asking is are there some cheaper alterntives to just get it up and running and then come back later when I get richer and redo it better ?

E

[Joe Bob]

A 3.0 motor can be had for 3-5500 bucks....just depends on how many miles and other stuff.....

[HarryD]

I feel your pain. I am weighing an top end plus ??? vs a 3.0/3.2 transplant.

If you go the transplant route (3.0/3.2), for the 3.0 and larger motors you need to consider the addition of an external cooler. This can add $1-2k to the cost. Also, with an older car and a 901 Tranny, you may have additional issues with mating the tranny and it's longevity due to the higher torque/power of the larger engine.

[Rot 911]

Originally posted by Enigma03
I get about 200 a month I can dump into this car....how the heck do you guys afford these things ?Are there any used places I can check for used parts?
I am almost thinking that a used motor would do me just as well and be cheaper to deal with...I have seen some for less than 3 grand that are complete and fewer miles....what motors can I use in my 68?
E

All valid concerns. To be honest if all you have is $200 a month to put into the car, I suggest you need to think about possibly abandoning this project. I've read you previous posts and understand the sentimental attachments, but you are probably looking at $6000-$8000 in this car by the time all is said and done, and this is in a car that at best is worth no more than that and probably less. But if you want to go ahead, you might want to look at some used engines (as I suggested a week or so ago. In your car I would look for a used engine as they can be found cheaper than a rebuild. For used parts I would check out Parts Heaven www.partsheaven.com or Ians Europarts http://www.ianseuroparts.com/index.html What you really need to find is someone in the area that will take a look at the car and help guide you in your efforts. If nothing else, let me know and as long as you provide the beer and maybe some eats I will drive to KC and take a look at your car!

[anthony]

Here's how you do it cheap: you comb the classifieds for months looking for a donor car with a good engine. It would be better if the donor has actually be wrecked or has other issues. You strip it and part it out on Pelican and eBay. If you buy the right car for the right price you'll have a cheap or free engine in the end.

[Enigma03]

Kurt gimme a email when you have a free weekend I'd love to have someone that knows this stuff come up and see what they thought...and sure suds on me

The parting out idea is pretty good too....have to look into that...
I have some other cars I might be able to get rid of for some $$ but it wouldn't be lots....and I figure by the end of it I'd have about 6k into it if I do it right...and I was hoping it would be worth about that and possibly gain some value as I get older...

hmm mabey its part time job time....

E

[pbs911]

Eventually you just acquire a false sence of reality, meaning you no longer look at the prices but the parts. You then rationalize that you need a specific part regardless of the cost. Later, you just nod in approval when your wife spends $2,500 on pots and pans.

[surflvr911sc]

Sounds like good advice Paul. Now you tell me.

[Sunroof]

Another source is Porsche Audi-Parts (PAP) in Georiga. They have a web site and they have been in the dismantling business for over twnety years. Try and get as much help as you can from this board. Knowlege and expereince surpasses any shop in the land!!

Regards and luck
Bob

[Rich911E]

E:

I think that $200 per month is a plenty to spend on the car if you ask me. Don't bail on the car but don't set your sights on the killer "bells and whistles" car. You can drive a 911 cheaply and you can almost everything yourself on these early cars -- they are simple.

First: Work with what you have. I don't know what you have in your 1968, but if the 2.0 is still there just use it. It may smoke a bit, who cares. Take the time to scour for some parts and plan on a 2.0-2.7 engine. You can find 2.0 parts fairly readily and a lot of 2.2 and 2.4 stuff. A nicely tuned 2.0-2.4 motor will give good performance and will last a long time. This idea that you need a 3.0 liter motor, etc. is overkill. Just make what you have as light as possible. Used sway bars and torsion bars from later model cars will upgrade your suspension for cheap. On an early light car, 911SC or Carrera stock sway bars and torsion bars will be very sporty for your car.

I would buy a completed used engine, preferably one that you can hear run. I bought 2.0T engine for $800 from a garage closet in Huntington Beach where it had sat for several years. I brought it home cleaned it up, put it in, added oil, crossed my fingers and started it up. It is still running fine almost two years later. Is it perfect, no, but it runs and I can drive it daily without worrying that my kid's college fund is going to be raided if I miss a shift. Plus, I have another spare 2.7 (EGAD!) and 901 that is going in if it blows up. It will last a few years.

Cams are about $500 from WebCam or Elgin and they can regrind on your cores.

It is not very popular to drive a Porsche this way to the purist, but it will get you driving. Driving it with a 2.0T motor is better than talking about it with a 3.6.

My $0.02

Rich

[Enigma03]

Well the motor is locked and after getting the right side heads off I can see why...theres muck in just about every cylinder....
I think tho that if the lower end checks out then I will just get a gasket set and put it back togather after a good cleaning of everything and hope for the best...would hot tanking do a good cleaning job on the cylinders and heads?
I am guessing I would also need cam bearings since they have been removed?

I do want to get a new fuel tank (who knows if something is in there) and blow the lines out good...
Wiring looks a-ok and if the motor is up to snuff I may just drive it with the stock motor and be on the look for another motor like you did...
Now if I could find a motor thats halfway decent for $800 thats just a reg 2.0 or whatever I would hop on it...don't seem to be that many around for that cheap tho ...but I will keep looking...I think first then mabey I should just spend my $ on the fuel and brake systems and get them ready to drive then perhaps I might come across a motor....heres crossing fingers
Thanks for the buget approach...I'm no purist yet ...I just want to drive as I have never had the pleasure to drive one (oooooh how I have wanted to)
buget approach = good ..then its just replacing stuff here and there until its all replaced heh...and all the while you get to enjoy it!


E

Anyone else around KC that wants to come check it out and offer some ideas just drop me a line

[Rich911E]

E:


Clearly the car has sentimental value to it and if it is structurally solid, the mechanicals can be fixed. Unfortunately, being located in Kansas City, you don't have a lot to choose from compared to SoCal. It might be worthwhile to post an advertisement in the local PCA chapter website to see if there are some parts laying around in somebody's garage that they might want to sell you for cheap. You may have to load up for a drive to get a motor and trans, but it should be able to be had (in running condition) for less than $2K. Shipping engines is pretty expensive.

You mentioned that it might have an S motor in your earlier thread. If so, check the cylinder heads and casting numbers. I acquired a set of early unmolested 1969 911S cylinder heads last year as part of a package deal and ended up selling them for a bundle. You could easily buy a 2.0-2.4 motor for what I sold mine for so you may have money there you don't know about.

Alternatively, you should check out the classifieds and see if you can find a decent set of 2.2 pistons and cylinders with new rings and 2.2 cylinder heads. The pistons and cylinders should fit on the 2.0 liter block without machining and the 2.0 cylinder heads have 46mm intake and 40mm exhaust valves which are better than 2.0 heads. The easiest way to get more air is to have bigger valves. I would bet that you could get these items and get your cams reground to a slightly better profile all for less than $1000-$1200.

If the engine is out on the engine stand, pour in a bunch of penetrating oil into each cylinder to free the rings from the cylinder walls and seperate the pistons from the cylinders. Since you have experience with VW racing engines, I am sure you know somebody who can take a look at the pistons for you. If the cylinders are T cylinders, they are cast iron and can be remachined. The fancier Nikasil pistons and cylinder have a special surface treatment that makes them difficult to machine without being re-Nikasil-ed. Cosworth and J&E both make aftermarked pistons in oversizes for 911s.

Regarding the other stuff like the fuel tank, just take it over to a shop that cleans them out (check radiator shops) and have it flushed and cleaned. Blow out the fuel system with compressed air and rebuild the carbs with some new kits. Bleed the brakes really well and perhaps plan on rebuilding the calipers.

Good luck with your project. It will run again and come spring you will be blasting through the winding roads of the Ozarks.

Rich

[rvanderpyl]

I have a 68 that needs work as well, but I'm cash strapped since I'm building a new house (and garage) at the moment. So I'm basically driving the car with it's <90 compression motor, and just cleaning the plugs on a regular basis. I do peruse the ads here and on e-bay, and when I see a part that is a great deal I buy it, and add it to my stockpile of items for my eventual rebuild.

I think in your case the best thing is to disassemble the motor, clean it all up, have the cylinders honed (2.0 weren't nikasil so you can do this) and just replace the bearings/rings and gaskets so you can drive the car. Brake rebuild kits are cheap, new transmission fluid is cheap.

Then decide what you want to do and start collecting the parts while you enjoy driving the car.