question on factory paint from the 80s.

[PabloX]

I have an '86 3.2 black on black coupe. As far as I can tell, it's never been resprayed by the previous owners. It still has the original orange peel and I've even talked to all 4 of the previous owners, all of whom denied having any paint work done on it. I also can't see any signs whatsoever of body work having been done on it.

Here's the thing though, if I shine a bright LED flashlight on it when it's otherwise dark, I can see a bit of a difference in the color on the panels. The front hood and roof have a slight bronze tint while the front fenders, doors and rear deck all seem pure black or maybe have a blue tint. This only visible with the really bright (900 lumen) LED and occasionally under bright daylight.

One person theorized that something bad happened in shipment and it was resprayed before it was ever delivered. Any other thoughts?

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by PabloX

One person theorized that something bad happened in shipment and it was resprayed before it was ever delivered. Any other thoughts?

That is a stretch.

Is the paint a metallic black or just "old fashioned" black? 21 Line Glasurit is single stage black. No clear coat. No nuthin'. No metallic sprinkles. Just tough.

If your car was black, that is what the car came with unless there is a black that is metallic and from the factory, has clear-coat.

If that is the case, the sky is the limit as far as properly assessing the color. It is really hard to make a call if that is the case. Angles and light will easily make the paint look different.

[PabloX]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

That is a stretch.

Is the paint a metallic black or just "old fashioned" black? 21 Line Glasurit is single stage black. No clear coat. No nuthin'. No metallic sprinkles. Just tough.

If your car was black, that is what the car came with unless there is a black that is metallic and from the factory, has clear-coat.

If that is the case, the sky is the limit as far as properly assessing the color. It is really hard to make a call if that is the case. Angles and light will easily make the paint look different.

It's not metallic, just straight black, and it's not a case of angle. I've been doing photography (used to get paid to do it) for 20 years and I'd recognize that. A few other people have noticed it without being prompted also.

It's also worth noting that if it were repainted, it happened a long, long time ago. There are also no records of accidents per 2 VIN checks (not that those are completely reliable).

[boxster03]

Use a paint meter

[javadog]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

That is a stretch.

Actually, it is not. I know of a black car that got fixed at the port of entry.

JR

[awhnry]

I represented the owner of an M5 that had gotten repainted at Port of Entry due to damage. BMW did a good job masking the damage but as the car aged, it became more apparent. We used the paint gauge to determine the areas of repair. My client got a large discount on his next M5.

[PabloX]

Originally Posted by awhnry

I represented the owner of an M5 that had gotten repainted at Port of Entry due to damage. BMW did a good job masking the damage but as the car aged, it became more apparent. We used the paint gauge to determine the areas of repair. My client got a large discount on his next M5.

Thanks. Good to know.

Also, the underside of the hood shows no signs of body repair and the paint there seems to match the fenders, not the top of the hood.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by javadog

Actually, it is not. I know of a black car that got fixed at the port of entry

Regarding it being a stretch, here are my thoughts.

I would assume a panel(s) repaint would have been sprayed with the original type single stage with hardener paint if it were still in the Porsche pipeline through to delivery. (This may be the actual stretch - my assumption)

If it were painted with the original paint, it's the same end surface product whether force dried or air dried. It should age the same.

Regarding orange peel, if it has been re-sprayed, the Porsche peel is hard to replicate. Someone really good would have had to have done that.

I like the idea of a paint meter. Also, a wee bit of mild compound on a rag should pull a touch of color off to check if the "different panels" are single stage or BC/CC.

[Jrboulder]

Another possibility is that a shop damaged it and had it repainted while in their possession without telling the owner at the time.

[Marine Blue]

Not everyone is honest so you really can't rule out a previous respray.

Port of entry resprays are also common enough to be a possibility, definitely can't rule it out. It could have also happened at the selling dealer before the car was sold/titled. A paint meter will be a good starting point.

[PabloX]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

Regarding it being a stretch, here are my thoughts.

I would assume a panel(s) repaint would have been sprayed with the original type single stage with hardener paint if it were still in the Porsche pipeline through to delivery. (This may be the actual stretch - my assumption)

If it were painted with the original paint, it's the same end surface product whether force dried or air dried. It should age the same.

Regarding orange peel, if it has been re-sprayed, the Porsche peel is hard to replicate. Someone really good would have had to have done that.

I like the idea of a paint meter. Also, a wee bit of mild compound on a rag should pull a touch of color off to check if the "different panels" are single stage or BC/CC.

In other contexts, body shop guys have told me that replicating factory paint isn't as simple as getting the code off the VIN and ordering it. There can be variances from batch to batch even within the same factory and model year of production. The context in this case was getting a bumper resprayed on a modern car.

Also, I have detailed the exterior (clay, swirl remover, light polish, wax) and when I did, it seemed there was no clear coat (black on the pads).

Regarding the paint meter, I'll try to rent or borrow one. I assume these would tell me that the thickness is different? If so, it'd be interesting but I'm pretty sure it was resprayed, just not sure when.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by PabloX

Also, I have detailed the exterior (clay, swirl remover, light polish, wax) and when I did, it seemed there was no clear coat (black on the pads).

That's good news. At least the paint is the same.

Ouch. I just looked up the paint millage testers. That ain't giving them away. $350-ish.

Might want to find a high end shop and beg for their assistance (bring donuts) or pay them a few bucks to check the thickness.

[awhnry]

Try looking for a high end paint supplier. That is where we located our gauge but since then I have several used car dealer clients who carry one to auctions and for trade analysis.

[Sicklyscott]

Besides the color I have to point out your reference of "orange peel". My '80 is black with original paint on the roof only. The paint has no orange peel to it at all, it's as smooth as a mirror. There's another black SC in my area which claims original paint and his is as smooth as mine. I'm not sure that that is the norm but it certainly is something to look in to.

[wportervt]

Could it just be fading on those panels due to the fact that the front hood and roof receive the most direct sun exposure?

[86 911 Targa]

I personally saw a paint run on a newly delivered 1982 911 passenger door @ Circle Porsche Audi.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Sicklyscott

Besides the color I have to point out your reference of "orange peel". My '80 is black with original paint on the roof only. The paint has no orange peel to it at all, it's as smooth as a mirror. There's another black SC in my area which claims original paint and his is as smooth as mine. I'm not sure that that is the norm but it certainly is something to look in to.

The 911 orange peel is very subtle and uniform. Very hard to replicate on a re-spray. At least those are my thoughts.

It's also hard to call it orange peel, it's so slight. Mirror finish? Knocked down a wee bit and polished.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by 86 911 Targa

I personally saw a paint run on a newly delivered 1982 911 passenger door @ Circle Porsche Audi.

This could happen. Not sure when Porsche cut over to machines spraying the final color but humans did it in the 80's.

[mepstein]

My friend worked a Mercedes dealership and one of his jobs was to fix the new cars that came into the dealer with damage. It happened all the time. He said it never was documented. He also said this was common for all dealerships in the 90's. He got out of car repair by y2k so I have no idea what is going on today but cars are damaged all the time so I imagine they get fixed. I recall one of the earliest Porsche's, #1 or 2 car, was damaged unloading from a boat.

[Marine Blue]

Originally Posted by mepstein

My friend worked a Mercedes dealership and one of his jobs was to fix the new cars that came into the dealer with damage. It happened all the time. He said it never was documented. He also said this was common for all dealerships in the 90's. He got out of car repair by y2k so I have no idea what is going on today but cars are damaged all the time so I imagine they get fixed. I recall one of the earliest Porsche's, #1 or 2 car, was damaged unloading from a boat.

Although car handling has likely improved significantly over the years I can say that the most stressful time ordering my Spyder was from the time the manufacturing was completed to the time it reached the dealers hands. I knew that any delays could possibly be due to damage needing repair. I was fortunate and I'm sure the majority of us are but a small percentage probably do get damaged.