Good source for R12 R134 conversion fittings?

[neilschelly]

I've got a brand new Sanden compressor and I'm finding myself unable to hold a vacuum now. I replaced all the o-rings to be safe, but I think the problem is in my r134a conversion fittings. I attached some pictures of the pieces I'm using:


I've tried the cheapo aluminum ones available at all auto parts stores, and I've been disappointed with them leaking. I'd also really like 90-degree angle ones like this, since they seem to fit better, but it's not a hard requirement. These seemed good, but I think I might have over-tightened them since the o-ring now looks destroyed on my high side adaptor. And I can't remember where I bought them, so I can't just go order another set.

Who has a good source for these? I don't think our host does, so should be safe to share the secret. Here's the only one I've found online, but I'd prefer to buy from somewhere people have had good luck with buying such things.
Aliexpress.com : Buy R12 thread interface to r134a Conversion automotive air conditioning high& low Quick Connect Coupler Adapter valve pin interface from Reliable valve chain suppliers on Number One's store.

Any suggestions?
-N

[m110]

Rennaire sells Sanden compressors and can probably help you out

RennAire Porsche 911 Air Conditioning Products

[Tigerrat]

I had similar issues and got good parts from ackits.com, Arizona Mobile. Adapters, cores, etc. Ken

[crownarch]

Best thing you can do is use two O-rings on the aluminum high side adapter fitting. That will prevent it from leaking and you don't want to over torque it when tightening it down.

[kuehl]

1) There are two types of R134a service port adapters:
A) Without schrader valve, uses a push pin.
B) Steel, with its own schrader valve.

The "B" is the preferred in a straight configuration. You do not need 90's.
Be sure you have removed the existing schrader valves from the compressor's
R12 service ports.

If you are cutting the o-ring in the R134a adapter then either leading edge
of the R12 service port fitting has a sharp angle or burr, you can remove it,
and don't overtighten the R134a adapter, it just needs to be "snug".

[neilschelly]

kuehl,
That is exactly the sort of information I'm looking for - thank you! Do you know a place I can buy the type B you are referring to?
-Neil

[kuehl]

I'm sure you can find them in various places, however you are using the host's forum to your advantage so I would suggest you try here first:
PelicanParts.com - 1984 Porsche 911 Carrera Convertible - Ventilation & A/C

If you get stuck then PM me.

[neilschelly]

The only kit I saw that seemed close from Pelican was 55-9807-901-M325, from Santech. At first glance, I skipped it because it looked like the same bits from auto parts stores that didn't work for me before. Now, on second glance, I see that it actually comes with replacement valve cores too, so that looks like the bit I was missing from the other kits that you're talking about.
-N

[kuehl]

Neil,

Are you trying to put a 507 on a 3.2 engine?
And, if so, why?

[neilschelly]

Yes, I replaced the stock one (was a Nippondenso, I think) with the 507. I have probably replaced more pieces than necessary to repair the AC, one part at a time. At some point last year, I was confident that this needed replacing. I still have the original one, so perhaps someone else will prove me wrong and make it useful again.

As for my choice of the Sanden, it seems like it's among the preferred choices for replacement, but I have read other opinions as well. Unfortunately, dissenting opinions on AC repairs here are difficult to sort through. If I bought one that just won't work, I'd appreciate knowing. But if I bought one that isn't the ideal choice for me, it's too late to do anything about it now. When all is said and done, a working AC will be 100% better than a non-working one. Since I haven't had a working AC in my car(s) for 4 years, functional will be awesome.

I've also replaced all the hoses with barrier hoses and the receiver/dryer with a ProCooler. Again, I know opinions on the usefulness of all this is varied. So far, I haven't had reason to suspect either of my condensors has failed or clogged, and the evaporator and expansion valve appear fine as well. I also wouldn't be surprised to find out one or more of those devices is next on my list to replace. By the time I actually replace everything, I may find that I just cannot get the ProCooler dry because I've had the system open too many times and permanently damaged it.

I'm doing things the DIY way, making sure to spend far more time and money than necessary to make my AC cold. I'm sure I'm on the A-list of Pelican Parts customers by now, at least.
-N

[kuehl]

Ok, just so you know the 507 is less cc's then the denso, it will work, but
normally its easier to bolt on a stock denso.

Since you were able to source the 90 degree steel R134a adapters, with
incorporating their own internal schrader valves, just get another set
or remove their damage o-rings and replace them (remember to remove
any burr's or sharp ridges on the R12 service ports and don't overtighten
the adapters).

[wwest]

One of the few things Kuehl and I can agree on(***) is that the procooler is mostly, if not all, SNAKE OIL, maybe even detrimental in our system that's marginal to begin with.

Read his dissertation..

Griffiths supplies a range of air conditioning components for your Porsche 911,911s,911t,911 turbo, and 930, such as: Porsche air conditioning upgrades, Porsche air conditioning improvements and updates: Porsche barrier hoses and hose sets, Porsche c

[neilschelly]

kuehl,
I've got new straight service ports and shrader valves on their way to me. Once this leak is resolved, I can go on to the next problem with the system. Appreciate the help.

wwest,
Thank you for the information, and yes, I've seen that information before. I didn't see it until after I'd ordered the ProCooler. Should it need replacing again, I don't plan to replace it with another. For now, I am hoping that it will at least function.
-N

[964TargaC2]

I would avoid aliexpress/alibaba for anything to do with my car...the bottom of the barrel in cheap chinese components..

[neilschelly]

Originally Posted by 964TargaC2

I would avoid aliexpress/alibaba for anything to do with my car...the bottom of the barrel in cheap chinese components..

Wasn't planning on buying from them.
-N

[neilschelly]

I replaced the terminals and was able to pull/keep a vacuum for a few days, so I charged it up. It's not the world's coldest AC, but I can consistently get about a 30-degree temperature difference between ambient and the air leaving the vents. It's not enough to cool the cabin, but plenty cool if it blows over your skin.

Making the system stronger is a project for another day when I can devote more time to it. Could be the old condensors, old evaporator, ProCooler having gotten too saturated with moisture, etc, etc... For the immediate future, I'm just going to enjoy a functional, even if not ideal, system for the first time in my 3.5 years of owning the car.
-N

[cabmandone]

Originally Posted by neilschelly

I replaced the terminals and was able to pull/keep a vacuum for a few days, so I charged it up. It's not the world's coldest AC, but I can consistently get about a 30-degree temperature difference between ambient and the air leaving the vents. It's not enough to cool the cabin, but plenty cool if it blows over your skin.

Making the system stronger is a project for another day when I can devote more time to it. Could be the old condensors, old evaporator, ProCooler having gotten too saturated with moisture, etc, etc... For the immediate future, I'm just going to enjoy a functional, even if not ideal, system for the first time in my 3.5 years of owning the car.
-N

When you get around to trying to make the system work better, make sure you check your coils for dirt blocking the fins. If the evaporator is dirty (or the condensers for that matter) the system won't cool properly. I point to the evaporator because the fan system in this car had enough work to do without trying to move air across a partially blocked coil.

[neilschelly]

Originally Posted by kuehl

Ok, just so you know the 507 is less cc's then the denso, it will work, but
normally its easier to bolt on a stock denso.

Kuehl, in hoping you have some advice in the context of your comment above...
I have my stock Denso in essentially unknown condition, since it was replaced by the Sanden in my strategy to keep replacing stuff until the system worked. Given that the system now works (albeit poorly), I will soon be having the system emptied again so I can revert to a new dry receiver/drier and get a good charge.

It's possible my stock Denso works awesome, but it definitely hasn't had good refrigerant flow for probably at least 10 years. It has definitely spun in that time just to run the fan I'm sure, but I know little of the history before I owned the car. It's fair to assume it's run a good number of hours without refrigerant, and so without good oil supply.

Is it possible to bench test the compressor without actually trying to charge up the system with it? If not, is there a way to service it and be reasonably sure it will run well? Or should I just sick with the Sanden that is nearly brand new and is at least a known quantity?

Thanks for any advice you (or others) can offer.
-N

[stormcrow]

I made my own out of copper fittings and flare adapters that you can buy at HD. Used soft silver solder. In order to do the connection between the nut and the flare adapters you need a flaring tool. Here are some pics

[kuehl]

Originally Posted by neilschelly

I have my stock Denso in essentially unknown condition. It's possible my stock Denso works awesome, but it definitely hasn't had good refrigerant flow for probably at least 10 years. Is it possible to bench test the compressor without actually trying to charge up the system with it? If not, is there a way to service it and be reasonably sure it will run well? Or should I just sick with the Sanden that is nearly brand new and is at least a known quantity?
-N

If you are happy with your Sanden 507 performance in your system, some people need more flow, then stick with it. We usually put 507's pre-Carrera's or early turbo's,
because of ease of installation and costs, and stick with Denso on OE Denso models.

Our preference is to tear down the Denso and inspect the:
1) Bores
2) Pistons
3) Wobble Plate
4) Shaft area where nose seal contacts

Any of 1 through 4 NG then toss it.

4) Reed valve assemblies (you can swap with other like donor compressors)
5) Bearings (seldom go bad however if they are bad the typically you toss the whole compressor).
6) Clutch assembly (you can swap with other good units so long as you properly shim the air gap); if you got a worn pulley bearing then either the unit has high miles or it overheated, if you have a coil with cracked epoxy then ditto.. it overheated.

If the Denso internals are good then you just need a seal kit.

To "bench test" you need typically 5 hp to drive it or more, pressure gauges, and so forth, however a good bench test does not guarantee good internals:
alike someone taking an exercise electrocardiogram, passing and they fall on their face outside the lab.