Thinking about a new muffler... - Page 2

Randy W · Randy W's Garage

I think the dual in/dual out Flowmaster is a great product and sounds the closest to an RSR of anything out there. It's a rasp alright but it sounds right on a Porsche with that "RRRRRIIIIP" above 5K. It became too loud for me after awhile and I replaced it with a Triad dual in/dual out muffler that is quieter and develops the same power. The Bursch sounds cool but they rust like crazy, same with the AJ sport mufflers. I still like the original factory early 911 mufflers best for a "neighborhood friendly" winter muffler - also works the best with MFI.

dd74 · 04:41 PM

I've had two dual in single out Bursh mufflers, and though I'm up for a change to a dual out system, I do believe the Bursch muffler to be a good set up. Supposedly it improves mid-range and top-end power, though I'm not entirely certain if that increase is measurable. It's loud, though. Not uncorked loud, but loud. As far as ease of installation, it's pretty much a bolt on affair; nothing much to it. I've heard Bursch mufflers rust, but have not seen evidence of rust on my car as of yet. Price-wise, I don't think they're a bad deal at all.

dd74 · 10-01-2002, 04:42 PM

http://www.coastfab.com/ultralights.html

Want to be · 10-01-2002, 04:45 PM

Bursch exhaust , quiet exhaust.

I would stay away from Bursch load , your neighbors might vote you out of the association.

German Parts. Restorations is a great place to purchase the exhaust.

They sound good and are cheap.

Good luck

jpc

A Quiet Boom · A Quiet Boom's Garage

Bill, I like your Flowmaster set up, didn't think to "flip" the muffler on mine so I had very short tailpipes which could definately have accounted for some of the "rasp" I don't like. Very nice install!

scottb, I think you're gonna find that the general consensus here is either a Flowmaster or similar setup, most muffler shops have tubing benders and welders and will do this cheap for you. Before I started fabricating my own exhaust I had a local muffler shop do custom dual exhausts on several vehicles, in every case I had a wonderful system for less than I would have spent to buy and have installed a pre-made one. Give serious thought to having one made up. Your best option would be a single outlet on the drivers side so you don't have to cut the valance for a second tip, there are several ways to do this with a fabricated exhaust. First would be a flowmaster single in dual out with the passenger side outlet capped, second would be the Walker muffler I found with the inlet and outlet on the same side and the last option may be the best a single in single out flowmaster with the outlet facing the driver's side and a curved pipe crossing in front of the muffler to the inlet on the passenger's side. The last setup would give you a longer secondary pipe length which will build some midrange power. Any good muffler shop can accomplish this for reasonable money, in fact if I was in SoCal rather than Ohio I'd do it for ya!

makaio · 10-01-2002, 07:38 PM

Right now I prefer the sound of my Bursch on the cab, to that of the GHL on my SC.

You could give me a call tomorrow, and I could start each one individually so you could hear the difference if you like.

scottb · 10-01-2002, 08:36 PM

Matt: You have mail!

CEO · 10-01-2002, 10:22 PM

A Quiet Boom - no problem I understand your point of view. I just used to have an 87 5.0 convertible that had the Flowmaster 3 chambers on them and they started to rust within 5 months. And the resonance was too much for me to bare. The sound was a bit to unrefined for me too.
I am also aware that Flowmaster makes different kinds of mufflers but I used the term "a few" loosely. Should have been more specific.
I am however under the impression that you get what you pay for. I just happen to know that Mille Miglia spends lots of R&D and money on testing for the Porsche and Ferrari. They also have dyno sheets to look at if you like. In addition to standing behind the product forever. Oh and they can make you a custom muffler if you want.

http://www.millemiglia.com.au/

Case in point: Why do you buy from Pelican? Sure there are other places that are cheaper than here. But Pelican makes sure that you are have outstanding customer service. And will stand behind what they sell. To me that is worth more, so I am willing to pay more. And if you have it spend it. You knew that this was not a cheap car in the first place. Why treat it like one?

P.S. It does look that you have fabed up a decent exhaust system.

Regards, Kenneth

A Quiet Boom · A Quiet Boom's Garage

Yeah I believe you get what you pay for to a point but sometimes things are priced very high for a niche market when something else that costs less may work better. Flowmaster has really improved their product in recent years with aluminized mufflers and their new delta flow series which cut down on resonance. When I see a price of $850 for a P-car muffler, I have to ask why? Why is it so expensive, does it perform as well as it looks? Would it perform better than a race inspired or full race muffler? Flowmaster, Walker and Borla are proven on 1500+hp drag cars, their proven on the lessor powered cars as well and since it's HP not engine size that determines the necessary flow rate of an exhaust system I prefer to go with something I know will work in a higher HP application than mine. I'm not buying/building my exhaust for looks or even longevity (like stainless provides) I'm building it for performance plain and simple. It has to meet my sound and HP requirements or it's not gonna stay on the car. And while I'm sure those prefabbed systems are good I need to know that the extra $$$ is also buying me more performance. There's and old saying amongst drag-racers; "if it don't go, chrome IT!" which implies the chromed up "hot rods" that perform terribly on the track, the serious guys put their money into parts that make their cars faster and more durable, looks are a distant third. I've seen $500 beaters with $15,000 engines and $5000 in the chassis yet the owners (myself included) could care less about the looks of the car because all we care about is dropping our ET and paint ain't gonna do that. So when I see a shiny stainless exhaust system for big $$$ I gotta wonder how much of that money is show and how much is go. And since I constantly lust for more power and performance I only buy parts that will improve the power and performance. Things like that enhance the look of my cars are the last things I buy. To each his own to be sure, but to me form must follow function.

Dignan · 10-02-2002, 04:29 PM

Here is mine it's a duel in duel out GHL with 3" tips.... sounds GREAT!!!!

Lothar · Lothar's Garage

If sound is the main interest, why not just get a cat bypass. I understand that alone will give a little growl. Their fairly cheap, especially used, and can be replaced by the cat for inspection time.

What does anyone else think.

fastbydrmike · 10-02-2002, 05:31 PM

I just ordered 2 in 2 out B&B Headers and Muffler with high velocity intake for my 86 Cab. My mechanic said I wouldn't believe the sound and HP gain. I will send pictures and let you know about the sound after the work is done.

Mike

masraum · 10-02-2002, 06:32 PM

Here are some sound files from the new setup.

stock '88 3.2 stock heat exchangers, catalytic converter, and flowmaster single in dual out muffler.
The two middle links have the sound of my sunglasses vibrating against the case of the laptop throughout in case anyone hears that sound and wonders what it is.
http://home.swbell.net/smasraum/flowmastersitting.mp3
http://home.swbell.net/smasraum/flowmasterdriveing2.mp3
http://home.swbell.net/smasraum/flowmasterdriving.mp3
http://home.swbell.net/smasraum/flowmasterdriveby.mp3

nostatic · nostatic's Garage

Yow! That sounds nasty! Do small (and large) animals run in fear upon startup?

scottb · 10-03-2002, 02:04 PM

I'm seriously considering the Bursch muffler due to it's sound and reasonable cost. I've heard, however, that the paint is next-to-useless, and flakes off after a few miles. Is there any reason not to strip the paint before I install the muffler, and then do a quality repaint on it with some manifold or engine paint? It seems to me that stripping the paint, especially bad paint, would be a relatively simple job. Any thoughts?

efhughes3 · efhughes3's Garage

Scott:

I think someone recently posted that they got a Bursch muffler and then immediately shipped it off to Jet Hot for ceramic coating. If you wanted to paint yourself, I don't see why you couldn't. If however, you had some sort of rust problem in the 2 year warranty period, they may have grounds to reject the claim. But, at the price they can almost be considered a disposable!

It seems that Bursch gets a lot of knocks since they are a cheaper product than the other mufflers, but the funny thing is, the guys I've seen post who have them really like them!

I'm seriously considering one also. I'm waiting for my Fabspeed pre-muff to ship so I can see what it does on it's own.

scottb · 10-04-2002, 05:34 AM

Ed: I considered the Jet Hot option too, but by the time you add another $150-200 for Jet Hot, the Bursch is getting pricey. Decisions, decisions...