WTF happened to plugwire thread? Wayne?
 

Don't tell me that this thread was excised just because of a little tussle over union labor? I had an important question I wanted answered, (about plug wire connectors, not labor). It had Porsche content, whassup? :confused:

Hmm. Thought I could help you as I saved the link. I plan to make my own wires at some point), but its now invalid!:confused:

Denis, did you post the original thread? If so I was going to offer to give you the set of old plug wires off my '86 Carrera to play with. They were working just fine when I replaced them with Magnacor wires (purchased from Pelican).

I'm the one who started the thread - I contacted Wayne this morning about it being deleted.

Kurt, I would be interested in your old wires. What can I give you for them?

Thanks.

Ah yes, I should have remembered you were from Omaha! You can have them for the cost of shipping. I'm always willing to contribute to the cause of experimentation on 911's! Just PM me with an address that you want me to send them to.

Once again, I do not understand this thread being surgically removed from existence when other crazier, more inflamatory threads simply wind up in the OT forum. What's up here, Wayne? You are usually not shy about defending yourself when a disagreement pops up here. (?) :cool:

Geez, you guys spend way too much time on this board. A whole bunch of you emailed me this morning...

I added a huge rant to the thread about certain opinions I have about certain things - then decided it was better left unsaid. You can say I censored myself...

It's gone - let it go or start a new thread...

-Wayne

I think it was the whole, if we think union labor is bad in the US look how bad it is in Germany remark. Usually I get nasty PM's from Wayne when he disagree's with me. In this case he makes his problems disappear. I guess some of us are only human while others are above it all.:cool:

Wayne? Which is the greater sin? Censoring others, or censoring others in order to censor one's self? You deleted a thread to delete yourself???? (edit) Tough thing, censorship...though I remember one you eliminated that many of us agree with....it offered nothing but gay obscenities.

Interesting how the thread starts as a simple question.

"Why are spark plug wires so expensive?" ( pardon me if i dont have the exact thread title)

People offer advice and opinions..... all may be granted with grains of salt. Then the pool of opinions and advice gets wider until the intent of the orginal question is lost.

I think Wayne introduced the labor unions in Germany into this thread..

Spark plug wires cost more for Porsches because of "supply and demand" its that easy.


Things only cost as much as you will pay for them

Big Bummer!

I wanted to print the thread as soon as it slowed down.

IMO, nothing lasts forever..and for some reason the thread had to go..no problem..I did feel myself getting worked up over the new topic....................Ron

Im wondering what I missed?

Ron...I didn't see the original,,

Yeah...and what happened to the two free Porsches? :D

Tim/Paul..the thread started as a straight 911 topic..then escalated into an emotional one concerning jobs/unions/money/cost of parts..you didn't miss much..any business mag would give you better info than me doing a rant..which is what was happening, IMO..so, one thing for sure..when a male is good you pat him on the head, and when he's bad you pat him on the ass........................Ron

http://www.pelicanparts.com/support/smileys/paddel.gif

I started the original thread and somebody (I don't remember who) had a great paragraph about building your own wires. I was going to print it out today (after it had fleshed out a little) because it was really good stuff. However, I look for it this morning, and lo and behold, it's missing.

I don't blame Wayne for throwing away some of the stuff that wasn't related to spark plug wires, but I'd sure like to have that paragraph back. So, if you're the one who posted, PLEASE REPOST! It sounds like a lot of people would love to read it again (or for the first time).

Steve,

Here is the first, and most important thread I posted on the rebuilding project:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7497&highlight=ignition +wire+beru

Here is another one that rebutts what Wayne said about the braided wires curing problems caused by early non-shielded sets. Read it all the way through, as at first is sounds like the non-braided wire set caused a missing problem ... humans DO sometime cause a new problem(s) when replacing old components!

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=77112&highlight=ignitio n+wire+beru

A couple of additional threads about testing components, rebuilding, and a few other issues like missing at temperatures above 90°F ...

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=70650&highlight=ignitio n+wire+beru

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=70180&highlight=Beru+co nnectors

Thanks, S_Man. Sorry you had to post twice.

I'm probably the infamous author of the communist labor remarks, and also the author of the plug wire rebuild story. The hard part is getting the screw-ends and getting them crimped onto the wires properly. The screw ends are Porsche part # 911.609.310.00. Mercedes part number 000.159.1438. I've had better luck with the Mercedes dealership than the Porsche dealership. Go there with 20' of 7mm copper-core nonresistor wire (as opposed to resistor wires without metal cores), cut into six strips that are at least long enough for your purposes. Buy the screw-ends and plead with them to crimp them on for you. This is the hard part. The rest is easy enough that my 10-year-old would have no trouble:

The distributor ends and the spark plug ends both just screw off. I mean they unscrew. Le me know if you need more....

Thanks Warren & Superman

"Here is another one that rebutts what Wayne said about the braided wires curing problems caused by early non-shielded sets. "

Warren, I didn't say that. What I did say is that the factory supposedly went to shielded cables to prevent cross-fire and other electrical interference. I have had customers in the past who have used non-braided wires, and then replaced them with the stock ones - and the problem went away.

What I did say is that in the absence of information, I would trust that the factory knew what it was doing with the braided wires...

Making your own plug wires is not something that I would terribly recommend. It seems like it would cause many, many intermittant problems if not done 'just right'.

-Wayne

Wayne's right, which is why I recommend the ends be crimped on at the dealership. It's actually two crimps per end. They have The Tool (the one for crimping those screw ends, that is). I have mis-crimped these at home, so I have experimented lately with soldering the conductor into the screw end, and then do the outer crimp. That method seems to be the hot ticket, but it's a multi step process since you have to go find someone with the crimp tool after the soldering is done.

Wayne,

I was not trying to place blame, antagonize you, or play semantics games ... but, what I posted seems to be a fairly close paraphrased summary of what you posted above ...

If you would like to edit "what Wayne said" in my post to read "what was said" ... feel free, or I will do it later. I don't happen to believe 'who said what' is as important as accurate information on this board!

On the matter of backfires on startup, most experts, or at least people with plenty of CIS experience, seem convinced that it was a lean mixture problem all along, not cross-firing sparks plugs, and that 1981 changes to the CIS airbox eliminated the majority of the backfires. To me, the fact that backfires still occured with cars equipped from the factory with shielded spark plug wires ... is evidence enough that the ignition crossfire issue is/was completely bogus!

As to the EMI/RFI issue, the fiberglass tails may have created a detectible increase in RF enegy outside the vehicles, but that was easily fixed with adhesive-backed aluminum foil, as GM has done for decades on FRP hoods! I don't believe for one minute that there ever was a problem with a steel or aluminum deck lid equipped with a normal metallic grille ... on cars with the unshielded '69-'73 wires!

As for your "customers in the past who have used non-braided wires, and then replaced them with the stock ones - and the problem went away. " ... there are plenty of possible customer-induced faults that could have been at work there ... just as in the case of the thread I cited and posted the link to ...

You are entitled to your opinion about rebuilding spark plug wires, and I see the motivation from the perspective of lost sales ... but I don't see the potential reliability problem. Maybe 0.1%, but that seems acceptable.

I have reecommended in the past that if a new set of ignition wires is to be purchased, the OEM '69-'73 set is the way to go, and I still believe that is the best choice. I also see 0% chance for error or intermittent problems in replacing the old Hypalon wire in the OEM '69-'73 wire sets! Bosch, Beru, and Bremi connectors that screw directly into the wire end ... work equally well with copper, stainless steel, tinned copper, resistive, or spiral-core wires, and have for more than five decades on various VW and Porsche models! It was a technology that didn't need to be changed, and Porsche made a blunder when their engineers changed the wiring style for the spark plug and distributor connectors! Just as with the headlamp circuits ... some design mistakes are allowed to continue in production for decades.

Just FYI for those contemplating building their own, I did this two years ago, am not real mechanically inclined, did my own crimps and tested the wires a few weeks ago during a valve adjustment. They were all in spec, around 4k ohms end to end resistance.

Buy the bulk wire, ends and crimp away!

Not trying to cause any trouble / disagreements but this is really easy.