Hard to shift while cold..Is this Normal??

[Epster77]

I have a 1987 911 Cabriolet and I notice that it is harder to put into gear while vehicle is cold. This is my first Porsche so I do not know the characteristics of this car. There isn't any grinding, it just seems to not go into gear as smoothly for the first 10-15 mins
of driving.

I also have another question...I did my first tune up(including plugs,cap,rotor,&wires) and oil change and was surprised at how much easier it was than expected. I was also concerned when I pulled out my oil drain plug and noticed some metal shavings attached to the magnetic part of the drain plug. The engine was rebuilt only 15k miles ago and I do not know if this is normal or not...Any help to set my mind at ease would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Jimmy

[mwbaum]

My 85 has the same characteristic...however I changed to Swepco trans fluid and cold shifting improved dramatically.

[falcon]

I too had the same notchiness going into 2nd when the car was cold. I replace the transmission oil to Mobil 1. The notchiness is not as noticable

[Clark Griswald]

In the oil drain plug, it depends on how big your "shavings" are.

You should have extremely fine metal particals sticking to the magnet. They are so fine they form a cream with the oil. You should not be able to discern individual particals.

If you can see individual particals, something is wrong.

My '86 also shifts smoother after the trans has warmed up. And I use Swepco. I think this is common and not a problem.

[svlTarga]

On my 88, second takes longer to get though the gates than any of the rest. When cold, it and third are notchy. When warmed up things smooth out noticeably.

New oil and clutch a year ago and things have been great compared to before.

[masraum]

Yep, it will be harder to **** when cold due to the fluid being thicker. Since you have a G50 car change the fluid and use Mobil 1 Synthetic gear lube. It should help the cold shifting some and is more recommended for the Borg Warner/Getrag transmissions than the Swepco which is more often recommended for the Porsche 901/915 trannies.

As stated, it's normal for engines to make metal filings, but the size is one of the important factors.

[Epster77]

Thanks for all the useful info everybody!

Maraum,
I am going to take yyour advice and try the Mobil 1. I will report my results. As for the metal shavings, they were very fine. They did seem to form a cream with the oil as Clark Griswald had mentioned, but at the same time I could still tell that they were shavings.

[Doudi]

"Swepco" : Is that an oil brand ?
Sorry if I look ridiculous, but leaving In Europe, and being french, I never heard of that name.
Let me know ;-)

Doudi.

[BER]

Doudi,

Swepco is a brand of petrol products primarily sold in the USA, including here at Pelican Parts. Here is the link to Swepco's web site:

http://www.swepcousa.com/lubesite/highperf.htm

The Swepco 201 Gear Lub is a favorite for many 911 drivers with 901/915 gear boxws.

Regards, Bruce

[Doudi]

Thanks a lot :-)

We use same kind of oil in Europe, with molybden componants added. I will soon change my gear box oil with such oil. I didn't know that brand (but for sure I don't know all oil brands !)

Cheers,

[Jdub]

Hold on: we're talking at cross-purposes. The G-50 will naturally be harder in the cold, getting better in the warm. The 915 OTOH seems (at least to me) to be better shifting cold than warm!

Jw

[jamesiii]

This is the same post I was considering on the way into work this morning...I've been wondering the same thing about my difficulty in shifting a 78 into gear in the morning. I know I've got a 915 tranny, which is by all accounts much more tricky/quirky than the G-50, but I was wondering what the tell tale signs of a pending clutch replacement are. This is my first pcar as well, and although Wayne's book is great for showing the clutch assembly replacement, it doesn't really mention what the precursors are.

When the car warms up it's much better, although it still isn't as smooth as I would like it to be. My very trusted mechanic has not mentioned anything so I'm hoping it's just a product of being cold in the morning. Also, I don't have the PO's complete maintenance log so I'm not certain which clutch is currently in the car, though it's certainly not the original w/ 135,000 mi.

[Nickshu]

Your 915 will most definitely be more difficult to shift when cold.

Signs of problems would be grinding into gears at any temperature (at appropriate speeds for those gears), loud whining noises, etc. The first place to look is your shift linkage adjustment. Pelican has a tech article on this and it may be in Waynes book.

As far as your clutch...if you have not replaced the cable and helper spring and adjusted it, you should think about doing this first. This solves many peoples concerns with heaviness and lack of total disengagement. One test if the clutch is disengaging totally is to press in the clutch and put the car in reverse (at a full stop!). If it grinds, generally the clutch is still catching.

I would be very surpised if your car made it to 135K with one or two clutches. I dont know what year you have, but some of the SC's came with rubber centered clutches which are known to "explode" when the rubber centering unit brakes up. If yours has been replaced (and it most likely has) it was probably upgraded to the newer style.


Start with the simple...shift linkage adjustment, cable adjustment (replacement?) and Swepco 201 or the 210 which people on this board are begining to like better than 201 (see recent discussion on this in archives)

Hope this helps.
Nick.

[jamesiii]

Nick,

Thanks for the advise. You hit it on the head w/ the "put it in reverse and see how it acts" comment. It is definitely not fully disengaging so I'll check the linkage first. I was planning on doing the cable & helper spring this coming Spring but I was hoping to get through the Winter w/o it...a couple of other items are taking precedent.

I'm also going to give the Swepco 210 a try.

Thanks again,

Jim

[Epster77]

Today I drained the tranny and replaced the fluid with Valvoline 75w90 Synthetic. What a difference this made. My 911 shifts as smooth as a Honda(well maybe not that good) but it is much, much easier to run through the gears warm or cold. Thanks for all the advice everyone. Last Sat., I also added an Autowerks performance chip that I bought on Ebay. This made a huge difference in power and only took about 30mins out of my day to install. (Just in case anyone was debating the chip addition).

Jimmy

[mwbaum]

Epster, can you describe the differences you feel over the rev range since adding the chip?

Thanks

[Don Plumley]

(repeat of my response to a prior thread):

I'll concur with the other posts. In my '87 with a G50, shifting was notchy 1-2. Replaced with Mobil 1 and shifting has improved - highly recommended.

To those who have not done this, remember, REMOVE THE FILL PLUG FIRST! It's bad form to empty the case without a way to put fluids in. I had to really yank on mine to get it off. Hand pump worked fine, took just over 3 liters.

Make sure you are getting "Synthetic Gear Lubricant", not Slushbox Fluid. The boys at the local Kragen barely knew it existed ("what's a manual transmission?") on the shelf.

Good luck!

Don

[Epster77]

Since I added the chip, I have noticed better power in the under 4000 RPM range. That is were I felt a need for more hp. Over 4000 RPM is a tremendous difference. Feels like I added a few more cylinders or something! 2nd gear reaches 80 or so and quickly. Before the chip I was able to reach about 70-75 in 2nd and not as quickly. Throttle response is much better throughout all gears and RPM's. The chip also raises the rev limiter an extra 400RPM and removes the top speed limiter(which I have not tested as of yet!)
I have not noticed a significant drop in gas mileage either.
My Cab is all stock other than this chip and a K&N filter. For $60 I and 30 mins labor time, I would definitely recommend the chip. I can email you simple instructions for removal of the old chip and installation of the new chip if you decide to do it.

MRSLOTS is the seller and EBAY will allow you to search for auctions by user name. His feedback is what convinced me to buy the chip. Everyone that had bought one, was highly impressed with the performance gain. Not to mention, he ships the chip rather quickly.

Jimmy

[masraum]

Epster/Jimmy, be careful with that engine and the new chip. The valvetrain and rods are the weak link in the 3.2L engines. When the factory made the Carrera Clubsport they used different lighter intake valves because they increased the rev limit from 6520 to ~6800. They had to do this because the stock springs will tend to float the valves at higher rpms than the stock limiter. Valve float in our engines means valve to piston contact means rebuild/replace the motor $$$$$. Also by revving the engine higher you are putting much higher stresses on the rod bolts that were decreased in diameter by 1 mm. Doesn't sound like much, but from what I understand it makes all of the difference in the world, again this leads to mucho $$$$ in repairs when a rod bolt goes. The up side is the bent/broken/twisted engine parts make great conversation pieces later.

Also, there is no speed limiter in our engines from the factory. The only thing that will limit your top speed is redline in 5th. That should be in the 150-155mph range. I was too busy driving to get a really good look.
Again, be careful with that new rev limit. You may want to check with Steve Weiner of Rennsport Systems,
Steve Weiner
Rennsport Systems
Portland Oregon
503.244.0990 http://www.rennsportsystems.com/~porsche/
porsche@rennsportsystems.com
Very knowledgeable, very nice, and he'll let you know about why higher rev limits are bad in stock 3.2L cars.

[rokemester]

It's turned pretty cold in Northeast Ohio and the 911 has been cold soaking for about a week. Changed the gear oil to Mobil 1 a week ago. Went to take it for a spin this morning but couldn't get the car into gear, either reverse or first gear. When trying to get into reverse the car moves slightly backward. I read somewhere in the forum that this was an indication of an issue. Worn clutch slave perhaps?