Another wheel question.....

[GH85Carrera]

Yea, I have searched around and learned a lot but I still have some questions. Sorry this is a bit long.

I have a 85 Carrera that still has the OEM 15s 7&8s on it. I am at the end of my rope trying to find a decent tire that will work on the highway in the rain, or having some fun at the autocross. There are tons of sticky track tires but those are useless on the highway on a long road trip. I can't possibly care less about my top time at the autocross. After 40 years of autocrossing I do it ONLY for my personal enjoyment not to win another trophy for the collection.

I still want a tire with some decent grip so I can have some predictable handling. Right now I have treadwear 320 M&S tires and those are no longer produced in the sizes I need. I will want find a tire with a 180 or 200 rating, even a summer performance tire no more M&S.

I have borrowed a set of rims and tires from a friend. They are 17 inch and 205-50-17 & 225-40-17 and they fit and stuff the fender wells up.



These are the borrowed wheels and I could buy them for $500 but I don't really want them, they are heavy replicas and I want Fuchs or good replicas.



These are the REAL deal forged Fuchs but have the offset for a 964. They need a 35mm thick adapter for both front and rear from what the folks at the US distributors say. They are only 16.5 lbs for the fronts and 17 lbs for the rears. The price is a breathtaking amount just under $3,400

I can buy the Euromeister Alloy Replica Wheels, for $700 for a set of 4 right from Pelican. The are the proper offset but they are not anodized, just machined finished. I would likely get either set of wheels painted Grand Prix White on the centers to look like my current rims. I like that look.



I wish I could find a decent set of 17 Lindseys and get those refurbished.

Any other ideas or suggestions? What are the best tires for 205-50 & 255-40?

I think just typing this out I have convinced myself it is freaking nuts spend $3400 for wheels that are forged and anodized. The Euromisters may be the answer to my question.

[will hung]

I was going to recommend Zuffenhaus Zuchs. But then I decided to check the price before recommending. Dang! They look good, but they are way more expensive than when they first came out.

[GH85Carrera]

Yea, those are more $$$ than the real Fuchs.

[javadog]

What about the Pirelli P6000 for your 15's? I think Falken also makes tires for those.

Used 16" Fuchs?

JR

[GH85Carrera]

JR, I looked at those options. 16 inch tires are going the same way as the 15s, away.

If I have to spend the money for new wheels why not go to a rim I can live with for another 20 years.

The P600s are an option but they are pricey, and they are a lot smaller than the rubber on my car now. I hate the idea of going to less rubber on the road.

[darrin]

GH85Carrera -- re 16" tires -- while I agree that the 245/45-16 size needed for 16x9 tires are getting rarer than hens teeth, I'm still seeing broad availability in the 205/55-16 and 225/50-16 sizes used for 16x6, 16x7 and 16x8 wheels, with tire manufacturers continuing to offer these sizes with new offerings as well.

Just stumbled on the following links, that list the various car makes/models that use these tire sizes -- as you'll see, a pretty broad spectrum of cars use the 205/55-16 and 225/50-16 sizes, making it likely that these sizes will continue to be produced to fill demand. List of vehicles that use 205/55R16 Tires - Wheel-Size.com List of vehicles that use 225/50R16 Tires - Wheel-Size.com

Conversely, given the very limited list of vehicles that use 245/45-16 tires, it's not surprising that these are hard to find.

So, what am I missing here? While I'm still comfortable that I'll be able to find NICE (and use-appropriate) tires in the 205/55=16 and 225/50-16 sizes that I use, I want to be sure I'm looking out for the future.

[OffCamber00]

Not a whole lot of middle of the road options for us. Its either cheap or full on track wheels. I ended up with a set of 17" Rota Foxes for the street. I got them in the RSR finish and I am perfectly happy with them. Hard to argue w/ $1400 delivered when the alternative is $3500++.

[redstack]

I'm running 205/50/17 front and 255/40/17 Bridgestone RE-11 on cup two wheels. With spacers they fit fine. I'm looking at going with the Euromiesters in the same size so I can eliminate the spacers I need now.

The RE 11 are a Good all round tire, and SCCA is going to a 200 tread for street tires so there should be more in the pipeline.

[Steve W]

IMHO, you're thinking about all this too hard. For what you want, just get a set of Euromeister 17s, 7s and 9s and mount a set of Dunlop Direzza ZII Star Specs 225/255s. They look good and just like Fuchs but 17s, aren't that heavy, and the Star Specs wear well, have way more grip on the street than you'll need, have amazing grip in the rain, are pretty quiet and comfortable, and if you autocross it, you have no excuse for not collecting another trophy as it's one of the current tires of choice by SCCA autocross national champions.

[Bill Douglas]

Those Cup fakes sure look good. I know what what you mean about heavy - frightening. How about real ones with spacers?

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by Steve W

IMHO, you're thinking about all this too hard. For what you want, just get a set of Euromeister 17s, 7s and 9s and mount a set of Dunlop Direzza ZII Star Specs 225/255s. They look good and just like Fuchs but 17s, aren't that heavy, and the Star Specs wear well, have way more grip on the street than you'll need, have amazing grip in the rain, are pretty quiet and comfortable, and if you autocross it, you have no excuse for not collecting another trophy as it's one of the current tires of choice by SCCA autocross national champions.

Thanks Steve.

My biggest goal is to find a good set of rims and tires that will bolt on and not need rolled fenders, spacers, and funny alignment setting to keep the tires from rubbing. Since I have to buy new wheels I figure now is the time t get wheels and tires that get the maximum rubber on the road without needed a mortgage. $700 for Euromeister 17s is a bargain.

[javadog]

You have a pretty light set of wheels on your car now. Anything else will be heavier and some choices will be a lot heavier. You might ponder that before you make the jump.

JR

[GH85Carrera]

JR, ya I agree. When I put the borrowed wheels on I noticed how HEAVY those wheels and tires were compared to my 15s.

It is one reason I contemplated the real deal Fuchs. They are light but my gosh expensive. I drove my car for 50 miles and did not notice any huge difference but I know under braking from high speeds it will be a massive increase of effort needed.

[javadog]

I'd probably just buy a set of the Pirellis. Cheaper than changing wheels.

Second option for me would be to buy a set of used 16" Fuchs. The replicas and later factory Porsche wheels have zero interest for me. Too many downsides.

JR

[javadog]

If you want a cheap option to buy some time, maybe the Falken ZIEX ZE950 is worth a look. Lots of choices in size, should work well in the colder half of the year, available near you, and cheap.

I've never tried them but you never know. I bought a set of inexpensive A/S tires for a winter beater and ended up liking them better than an expensive set of Continentals on my daily driver, at twice the price for the Conti's. Never buy another tire from them...

JR

[Driven97]

Lose / lose.

There's really nothing good in the right sizes for 15s. The P6000s are your best bet, fine for touring, lacking a bit in the actual performance department. But you'll have your car as designed, with the nice big sidewall for comfort, low inertia wheels.

The 17s it's not just the total weight, but where that weight is. Most of the weight of a wheel is in the rim, so if you push it all an inch further out, it's going to increase the rotational inertia even if you were able to find the same total weight 17s as your 15s. But on the bright side, the world is your oyster on tires.

FWIW, a 205/245 or 205/255 combo on the Euromeisters should not rub. If you run some camber on your car a 225 should fit up front without rubbing, even if you get a 225 that's "generous" for it's rated width like a ZII.

I swap around a lot between my OEM 15s on all seasons, fake Fuchs 15s with small diameter 225 sticky tires, and my 17s with sticky tires. I just like the car best on the Euromeister 17s despite the few drawbacks.

EDIT: Your car looks quite a bit lower in the rear than the front, is tha ton purpose?

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by Driven97

Lose / lose.

There's really nothing good in the right sizes for 15s. The P6000s are your best bet, fine for touring, lacking a bit in the actual performance department. But you'll have your car as designed, with the nice big sidewall for comfort, low inertia wheels.

The 17s it's not just the total weight, but where that weight is. Most of the weight of a wheel is in the rim, so if you push it all an inch further out, it's going to increase the rotational inertia even if you were able to find the same total weight 17s as your 15s. But on the bright side, the world is your oyster on tires.

FWIW, a 205/245 or 205/255 combo on the Euromeisters should not rub. If you run some camber on your car a 225 should fit up front without rubbing, even if you get a 225 that's "generous" for it's rated width like a ZII.

I swap around a lot between my OEM 15s on all seasons, fake Fuchs 15s with small diameter 225 sticky tires, and my 17s with sticky tires. I just like the car best on the Euromeister 17s despite the few drawbacks.

EDIT: Your car looks quite a bit lower in the rear than the front, is tha ton purpose?

It is the parking lot. There is a slope to the parking spot and the right rear is still on the slope part. The car was aligned and corner balanced for the 15s a couple of years ago. It is all fine as to ride height for the 15s on level ground. I think the 17s will be just fine as well.

[Steve W]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

Thanks Steve.

My biggest goal is to find a good set of rims and tires that will bolt on and not need rolled fenders, spacers, and funny alignment setting to keep the tires from rubbing. Since I have to buy new wheels I figure now is the time t get wheels and tires that get the maximum rubber on the road without needed a mortgage. $700 for Euromeister 17s is a bargain.

225 ZIIs set at max camber -2.0 will rub the lip edge just a little bit (~2mm) on a hard dip so a slight roll between the 11:00 to 1:00 area would be recommended, but I prefer 0.85-0.87 front to rear tire width ratio to minimize understeer on 911s, and 205s with 955s would push too much.

As an alternative to fender rolling, you can actually pull the fender out quite a bit maybe about 1/4", which you can do by hand, or very easy with a fender roller without rolling the lip if that's what you prefer.