No start for spring

[rekstein1]

Hi guys need your help. 1988 911 cab. Started it a month ago in the middle of winter and everything was fine. Placed the jwest headlight relay to upgrade the headlamps and now..............................

No start. It cranks, I smell gas, like I flooded it but it fails to catch or start. I have never put dry gas in or octane booster in for the winter. For the Last four years she has always started in the Spring.


So what gives? And where do I start to check?

Thanks

[Ayles]

Make sure the ground up front is tight... When i put mine in i forgot to snug it down and the car wouldnt start.

[rwest]

Did you forget about your first post? Couple suggestions there already.

Car won't start

[dale914]

My car just shut off and won't turn back on and it was just after replacing the headlights too. This can be related? The clips were loose the first time and the headlights were intermittent, I tightened the clip and now it won't start. Could there really be a connection??

[theiceman]

Originally Posted by dale914

My car just shut off and won't turn back on and it was just after replacing the headlights too. This can be related? The clips were loose the first time and the headlights were intermittent, I tightened the clip and now it won't start. Could there really be a connection??

I suggest starting your own thread rather than hijack this one, otherwise it gets very confusing who is responding to who.

[dale914]

Beg your pardon the iceman. I starred one a few weeks ago and thought it was the same thing going on in this instance, I'll ask the same thing about possibly the same thing somewhere else. I didn't mean to step on anybody's toes at all. Excuse me please

[rekstein1]

Ok here's the update
battery 12.50 volts
Jumped the fuel pump at #6 fuse and heard the full pump whirl
checked the DME relay as per sugar woods testing method all seemed fine.
Bought a new relay anyway and put it in

Car started and a ton of white smoke came out

I decided to let the car run for a few minutes/ 5 minutes but the idle never seemed to smooth out.
Smoke dissaapated and I turned the car off.

Tried to restart the car and no catching of the engine occurred. It turned and never caught. Tried to pump fuel into the situation by jumping the fuel pump a few times and trying to restart.
Did not want to catching. Tried this as my thoughts where maybe its the fuel pump.

Thoughts as to where to go now? resolder the DME or send it out to be sure? Send it where. Who is the DME guru?

Anybody got a spare?

Help!!!! Spring is around the corned.

[TibetanT]

Hello There:

Did you try the method Steve R suggested from your other post?

Steve is very good at this and, if it were I trying to start this type of Motronic system, I would be looking at the speed and reference sensors which has a BIG role in starting and running the car.

CHT sensor would be the following troubleshooting advise if what Steve R suggested is not the culprit.

Good luck

[rekstein1]

I have been looking for this for threads for about an hour in this forum to try to determine where the speed and reference sensors are and have had no luck. Let alone how to test them. Can someone give me a clue DRACO, Tippy anyone?

[rekstein1]

Took your advice and tested the speed and reference marks sensors as per the u tube video that i found

speed sensor 1000 ohms voltage 1.6
reference mark sensor 1000 ohms .1 volts

Does CHT mean cylinder head temp sensor?
The number 13 pin checked out open. Even checked the 13 pin against two other grounds just to be sure.

SO what does this mean?

[ischmitz]

Can you clarify if you have spark and fuel at this point. From your original posts the chain of events isn't clear. First you say engine ran with lots of smoke. Was this after you replaced the DME relay?

In general your sensors seem to check out fine. Next check spark (old plug grounded to engine while cranking or timing light). Same thing Steve suggested.

If you don't have spark but are getting fuel it could be the DME or issues with coil/distributor. If this is an intermittent behavior maybe the DME is faulty.

Ingo

[ischmitz]

Any update? Did you get my PM? I know the email notifications didn't work and you might have missed it.

Ingo

[ischmitz]

Originally Posted by rekstein1

Does CHT mean cylinder head temp sensor?
The number 13 pin checked out open. Even checked the 13 pin against two other grounds just to be sure.

SO what does this mean?

totally missed this. Yes CHT is the head temperature sensor and needs to read 1.4 kohm - 3.6 kohm when engine is cold. And 90 ohm when at operating temperature. If it's open the DME will richen the mixture like crazy. Maybe it'll work for starting when stone-cold but once it's warmed up it'll run like crap due to being overly rich. And re-starts just flood the engine.

You might have the older 1-wirke style that relies on GND from the head. And corriosion makes it fail open. Replace it. To test start the engine and let it warm up. Then shut it down, disconnect the sensor in the engine bay and short the pins in the DME harness connector and start the engine. This simulates a fully warm engine. If it starts and idles fine you have confirmed your issue.

[rekstein1]

Okay here is the Sunday update.

Yes there is spark. Pulled one spark plug wire as directed placed in spare spark plug in and had wife start car.
Spark was present. Funny thing is car started fully in this situation. Shut car off and and reconnected spark plug wire.

Started car and again a lot of smoke. which got less at time proceeded Idle was still rough. Stepped on gas to warm up the car and the car stumbled. Press gas again the car choked and died. Tried to restart car and no start.

Thoughts? ECU or CHT issue?

outside temp is 45 degrees farhenhiet

[ischmitz]

DID YOU READ my last post. Disconnect the CHT and put a paper clip into the harness connector. It'll run fine if at operating temperatures and you prove it's the CHT

[rekstein1]

Dear Ischmitz just read your post Sounds like i should replace the CHT Sensor at this point. DO you agree before I order the part?. And where do you recommend I order it from? I have read some posts and see there is cheaper alternatives.

Thanks for your help. Its truly appreciated

[rekstein1]

Car will not start after that lucky start with the wife. Its seems it has sit for a few days and then get a get lucky situation. Can you clarify where the paper clip is stuck. Which harness connector? I have yet to get to see where the CHT is plugged into in the engine compartment any Pictures would help.

[ischmitz]

Try the paper clip into the harness connector. Real cheap and confirms the issue before ordering parts. If that doesn't work you need to check for an open on the harness.

Honestly, I would order from here since you are supporting this forum. It pays back on many levels. Yes, you might be able to pinch a few buck from other sites but in the end Pelican is very competitive when it comes to pricing.

Ingo

[ischmitz]

There is a tower at the left rear of the engine with three connectors. The CHT is the upper one. See here for a picture (not mine). It is the white plug on the top. Once you disconnect the plug stick the paper clip into the plug you took off.

[rekstein1]

Just a follow up to this thread. Apparently the CHT was not fully plugged in as indication in the last photo by the location. I was checking it and push it and then heard a click. Of course the care started right up. Cleaned all the contacts and tightened up the snaps .

To reflect,if there is a no start issue as most of the experts had suggested. Check spark, check to see if the fuel pump is working and then if all those two are correct the sensors are the next to look at. Hard to imagine that the CHT could cause a no start issue but apparently it is a key sensor in the starting sequence

To everyone who contributed thanks for getting me back on the road