Help: removing top hex nut on starter
 

Please help; would greatly appreciate your suggestions for removing the top 10 mm hex nut on the starter in my 1984 911.

Yesterday, I jacked up car and have jack stand on passenger side and removed passenger-side rear wheel. I've disconnected the battery ground, and the two red wires and the yellow wire at the starter. The lower 10 mm hex nut is readily accessible. When I crawl under car with my head facing front, I can touch the top 10 mm hex nut with my fingers on my left hand. I have two 10 mm hex sockets, a standard one about 1.5 inches long with a flat end and an extended one about 3 - 4 inches long with a rounded end. I can engage the top hex nut with the extended hex socket, but am having difficulties with fitting within the cramped space, the further extension(s) and socket wrench need to turn and remove the nut.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks. Steve

Hey steve,

Not sure how different your starter mounting is compared to a 69 911 but my bokt was a also a pita to unbolt.

My suggestion is this: if you have an iPhone or smartphone that has a flash built into the camera, record a video with the flash on and use this as a guide to getting the socket on and backing it out.

I basically was laying in the ground, and watching my pone screen to see what I was doing with my other hand completely around the transmission. Might have to start it with a crescent wrench since there is a notch where the bokt sits in. Slowly but surely.

Good luck!!

6" allen socket and a fine toothed ratchet, worked from the driver's side of the trans, over the top with your right hand.

or drop the motor about 3-4 inches and see if that opens things up

And a round end allen socket would help.

If you raise the car and place on jack stands on chassis or T-bar end caps, it will allow the engine to drop just enough to gain access. Easy Peasy :p

Wear eye protection, lots of debris will fall on your face :eek:

A Pelican coined this feat "The Bear Hug" a while ago. When I did mine I understood why.

LOL, yeah. I was thinking the same. I am actually hugging her. LOL :D

You spend way too much time under your car, it seems... :D

Thank you all for your helpful suggestions. Tonight, I bought a fine tooth ratchet and upon fiddling with it, I see the mechanical benefit it will provide in this application. I checked at Sears and Home Depot, and neither had the 6 inch hex socket. I checked the HF website and they have it, I'll swing by the local HF and see if it's in stock. Thanks again for the helpful suggestions. I'll let you know if I get the starter out. Steve

For me I ended up having to do partial drop...MUCH easier when that's done.

John Walker: thanks again for your suggestions. I was able to get the starter out today following your instructions.http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1466356398.jpg


I do have another question: is there anything I need to know, or are there any complications, regarding alignment of the gear teeth on the starter and the flywheel, when I install the new starter? Thanks. Steve

Also, I now understand and agree with the other posters' comments about the bear hug.

installation is far easier, just slap it in and attach the wires....glad you discovered the bear hug....done it many times.

I thought of mine as the dirty bear hug. For some reason my transmission get dirty when I drive it. I liked like I had been wrestling a pig when I was done.

A long sleeve job for sure. It's easier to do lying on a creeper than standing.

Thanks again for all the help. I finally found the time to finish installing the Bosch rebuilt starter and engine started right up.

Can you post a picture of the socket & ratchet you used for future reference?

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon....BallEnd-lg.jpg
10MM

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1467645456.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1467645488.jpg

You got lucky using the ball end allen socket. They tend to round out the hole when they can't go in deep enough. Those top nuts are bittchin' tight sometimes, so the straight flute allen socket is recommended.

Thanks for taking the time to post the diagram/pics, guys. Now what size is that hex? And that's a 3/8" ratchet, right?
Have a happy 4th!

Thanks to all for the great tips and especially John Walker for putting the fear of using a ball end allen. Someone in the line of POs buggered up the nuts pretty well. Here's a pic of the worst one:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1470520489.jpg

Repeating John's words of caution in my head, I began the search through my tools on hand. Not having a straight (non-ball) allen socket, I found the perfect solution (albeit from Harbor Freight) sitting right out in the open, on top of my workbench:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1470520552.jpg

Using the short end, I had plenty of clearance and the needed torque to get both nuts moving and finished off with the ball allen socket. One thing to note on the clearance, is that I have a factory wide body, so not sure if that gives me any more/less clearance than on a non-turbo.

Hope that helps someone else in the future. Total time using the HF "T-allen" was just over an hour for the swap (not including jacking/lowering the car).

Not sure why the internal hex? why not a basic hex nut? just changed the starter on our 911, pita until the bearhug is used

Is changing the starter on a G50 any easier than the 915? Any particular advice out there for the G50/ starter removal?

Be sure you keep the starter receipt. Unless it was locally rebuilt there are a LOT of early failures due to substandard parts and labor on the builds.....good luck.

More difficult from what I've read. Either a partial engine drop or slave cylinder removal.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/611179-porsche-911-g50-starter-removal-tips.html

Ouch. Thanks for the link. I've got an intermittent problem w/ the starter... turn key to start: nothing; turn it off then to start again & it starts right up! Has happened only about 6 times, but may be a warning of impending disaster. Cleaned up the starter connections yesterday so we'll see what happens.

jlex - also check your ignition. I originally thought my issue (915 trans) was ignition related, as I had similar issues initially. If you have a jump cable you can get turn your ignition on and use the jump cable to spin your starter to hopefully narrow down the no-start to ignition or starter.

A trick for the G50 is to remove the solenoid from the old starter.

Thanks. That was going to be my next point of focus if the cleaning didn't help. Problem is it happens so rarely & always starts on the second try, so tracking it down may be a problem. If I have to throw parts at it, a new ignition switch at $130 may be cheaper than a new starter at $250...
If I could experience a continuous fail I'd be able to track down the problem.

That would be a cool trick.... how is the solenoid fastened to the starter & are the fasteners accessible?

Pardon my ignorance. What does this do for you?

It would give you extra room to be able to remove the bolts holding the starter.

Considering the intermittent nature of the issue is start by cleaning all connections and the ground strap from the gearbox to the chassis.

Then I'd consider replacing the electrical portion of the ignition switch. The easy test would be to try supplying +12v (via a jumper wire) to the yellow wire at the ignition switch the next time you have a no-start condition.