Porsche 912 VIN is this suspicious?

[K. Roman]

I believe it a 1965, but am not sure.

What number is this VIN? Is it 461584?
Has it been changed or is this the mistake of the manufacturer?

Thanks!

[haycait911]

looks to be a '67 karmann coupe.



912 Registry | VIN Table

[haycait911]

it doesn't really look altered, it looks more like Hans had a couple too many lagers at lunch.

[ratpiper71T]

Looks like a "4" stamped over the "2" to me. I've heard of this happening to some early cars -being overstamped by the factory, but you'd better check it more closely.

[ratpiper71T]

It also is visibly deeper on that last number as though it were done more forcefully!?!? Could be nothing.

[Grady Clay]

K. Roman,

A 1967 Karmann 912 has the VIN additionally stamped alongside the shift adjustment access panel at the rear of the tunnel.

Remove the cover (four Philips screws).
Inspect to the rear, on the passenger side, looking straight down.
Please post images of the number there.

Best,
Grady

[K. Roman]

Hi Grady,
That is where I took the picture. Around the shift tunnel.
Where would another be? There isn't a placard on the door jamb either.

Originally Posted by Grady Clay

K. Roman,

A 1967 Karmann 912 has the VIN additionally stamped alongside the shift adjustment access panel at the rear of the tunnel.

Remove the cover (four Philips screws).
Inspect to the rear, on the passenger side, looking straight down.
Please post images of the number there.

Best,
Grady

[RatBox]

Grady,

Is this a Karmann body only thing . What other years followed this procedure ?

[Grady Clay]

K. Roman,

The ‘main’ VIN is in the trunk, between the gas tank and the cover for the gas hearer compartment (“smuggler’s box”), to the right side. It is stamped ‘down’ on a slightly raised boss.

With a flashlight and mirror, you can inspect the back-side of both of these numbers. Many times the back-side will reveal the original number.


What is the history of the car?
What does the title/registration say?

Best,
Grady

[K. Roman]

Ok, so this is getting weird.

[K. Roman]

451 896

[ossiblue]

I, too, am curious about the VIN stamped by the smuggler's box. Just an observation for the sake of discussion but several numbers in the post look to be double struck, though the last digit is a real disaster. I can see what looks like a bit of movement during a heavy strike on the 4, and definite ghosts by the 6 and 8. If the numbers match the trunk VIN and that one looks unaltered, I'd chalk it up to early Happy Hour back in '65.

EDIT: Whoa, OP just posted the trunk VIN as I was typing--not even close! Grady, could the numbers originally posted (by the access port in the tunnel) be production numbers? If not, maybe a search for signs of a front clip/body graft is in order.

[Grady Clay]

K. Roman,

VIN 451896 is a 1966 Karmann 912 built in late 1965.

VIN 461584 or 461582 is a 1967 Karmann 912 built in 1967.

First, I would start looking if two cars were grafted together.
That is commonly done across the seat mounting, between the fore & aft mounting holes.
It can be elsewhere, including in the trunk aft of the VIN.

Get images of the back-side of the numbers.

Look for the build number under the knee pad, in the center.

Check this current thread:
Changing VIN
Can you get to the metal under the dash pad?

Best,
Grady

[K. Roman]

Grady,
I can't seem to find any welds that appear to be suspicious. Looks like they must've done a good job.
I can't take any pictures underneath the two VINs. I don't think my camera fits underneath the VINs.
Also, I can't find any VIN on the kneepad. The car has multi layers of paint, everything from green, red, ivory, black and blue!

[ossiblue]

K.Roman,

Is this the car you mention in another thread as being a "Frankenstein?" If so, the grafting seems not only logical but somehow poetic. Regardless, the production numbers Grady mentioned are found on the metal that the knee pads are bolted to, so you need to remove them. It wasn't clear in your reply that you understood that so I hope I'm not offending you. They would be approximately under the area where the radio would be located. You may need to use paint stripper of sand down the layers of paint you mentioned to read them.

[ossiblue]

Here's a picture of what a production number should look like, and its location behind the knee pad:

[K. Roman]

I checked there and couldn't find anything. I used a stainless steel scrubber on it and found that it had been GROUND OFF. I tried to take a picture of the stamp from the back but my camera died and I can't find the charger. To be continued...

[ossiblue]

Originally Posted by K. Roman

I checked there and couldn't find anything. I used a stainless steel scrubber on it and found that it had been GROUND OFF. I tried to take a picture of the stamp from the back but my camera died and I can't find the charger. To be continued...

Wow! Looking more and more like shady dealings. What about the paperwork on the car, as Grady asked? How is it titled? I think it's time for a very close look for welding and grafting evidence. As stated in many threads, it's legitimate to combine parts of different cars but there needs to be a paper trail and, with the case of VIN's, approval by state authorities. Very interesting...

[Embraer]

Just don't get drunk and crash this one too.

[K. Roman]

Wow, is that really necessary?

Anyhow, I'll try and find the title and see what it says. I do know that the car was owned by someone who worked at EASY in Oakland.