Help! Black Beauty has a problem

[Jack Olsen]

It's Sunday evening. I've got a track day tomorrow, and I just volunteered to make a run to the grocery store. Turned the key, starter cranks the engine, but nothing.

I seem to remember a fuel pump sound, when the key is in position one or two, but now don't hear that. Then again, it could be a number of things.

Any suggestions for a few simple things to check?

A lot of you know the basics of the car already, but it's a 73 with a 964 engine in it. I'll keep checking back for input. Thanks.

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Jack Olsen
My Rennlist page • My Pelican Gallery page • My Porsche Owners Gallery page

[1.2gees]

Check for power at the fuel pump while the engine is being cranked. If there is no power, check fuse. Actually I'd check the fuse before checking for power.
Ahmet

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It's all the driver...
My page over1g@hotmail.com
Porsche owners Gallery.../My 944

[speeder]

Don't know if your fuel pump engages with starter or "on" position, but it's definitely one or the other. Have someone try both key pos. while you listen near pump; if no pump, check fuse first, then relay, if you have test light you can check for juice at pump. No juice- relay my guess.

[Matt Smith]

Check the bank of round rubber connectors below the ignition (up and under the dash). They can come loose. I use my far right one as an engine demobiliser- just pull it out a bit but leave it in place. It shuts the thing down.
BTW, the 996 model Black Beauty has stuck in my head too.

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'72 911 TE

[Jack Olsen]

Thanks. Anyone know where the fuse is for the fuel pump? I've gone through the whole set in the front trunk, and none is labeled for it.

[Jandrews]

Jack,

Has it been raining? Any chance you have built up some moisture/condensation inside your distributor cap?


JA

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John
70/73 RS Spec Coupe

[Jack Olsen]

No rain. Can anyone give me the location of the fuel pump fuse and the fuel pump on a 73?

[cabman]

A bad or missing fuel pump relay will cause the same problem.

[Jack Olsen]

I've also got three round relays up front, which all appear to be the same. I've swapped them around, without luck. Can anyone tell me which one controls the fuel pump?

[Jack Olsen]

JAndrews, no rain, but it did sit out in the cold last night. You're thinking the distributor?

[This message has been edited by JackOlsen (edited 10-14-2001).]

[cabman]

if the engine is turning, either you're not getting a spark, or fuel, or both.

i would check all ignition wires are plugged in all the way, make sure the ignition coil wire is all the way in, check to see if the distributor cap accidentally dislodged.

when you turn the key, i suppose you should hear the faint whine of the fuel pump. if not, either it's not getting power, the fuse is out, or its the fuel pump relay at fault.

in my 83c, the fuel pump relay is the one all the way to the right as you're face the fuse panel head on.

once I removed the relay for safety reasons (I was in a unfamiliar neighborhood) and the engine would turn but not start.

[Early_S_Man]

Where's your DME unit, Jack? There's got to be a DME relay next to it ... there's the first thing to remove, check for corrosion, clean spades with ink eraser and retry! Testing will maybe tell you if you need a new one (where's your spare?) but won't get her starterd tonight !

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa
1992 Dodge Dakota 5.2 4X4 parts hauler

[Jack Olsen]

DME is under the seat. I'll take it out and check.

Am I correct that my fuel pump is back on the driver's side of the transaxle?

[Early_S_Man]

That's where the fuel pump was originally -- can't think of a good reason to move it!

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa
1992 Dodge Dakota 5.2 4X4 parts hauler

[Jack Olsen]

All right. DME relay is out. I don't have a spare, yet. (No better teacher than a Sunday night before a race.). It is clicking, when the key is turned.

Where's the fuse for the fuel pump?

Any way to easily troubleshoot the fuel pump?

[Early_S_Man]

Jack,

Early cars -- before about '77, didn't have a fuel pump fuse, so, unless it was added as part of the DME wiring harness, you don't have one.

No easy way to troubleshoot the pump -- pull off outlet line & plug with M8 bolt ... hook up short 24" length of new fuel line ... run it into large glass container and run pump for 30 seconds. Output should be at least 850 cc, based on 3.2 specs.

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa
1992 Dodge Dakota 5.2 4X4 parts hauler

[Jack Olsen]

Which is the fuel pump relay, then?

When the wife cranks the engine, I can not hear or feel any movement in the fuel pump.

[cabman]

Originally posted by JackOlsen:
Which is the fuel pump relay, then?

When the wife cranks the engine, I can not hear or feel any movement in the fuel pump.

it should be in the manual

[Early_S_Man]

The DME relay IS the fuel pump for 3.2 cars ... don't know about 964's.

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa
1992 Dodge Dakota 5.2 4X4 parts hauler

[campbellcj]

Jack - Per the Haynes manual wiring diagrams, I don't even see a fuel pump relay originally for a 73 car. There is also no dedicated fuse that I can see; however, it appears that the fuel pump circuit runs through fuse #7 which is the fresh air fan fuse. (This makes no sense to me, but it's how the diagram is shown.) Black wire, to fuse box #1 terminal #7.

I hope it turns out to be something simple!

(The car does have gas in it, right? )

Good luck,

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Chris C.
73 914 2.0
70 911E Targa
campbell.chris@gte.net