Deciding the fate of the 71 soft window

[mackgoo]

R Gruppe it.

[billwagnon]

I don't like targas - except soft windows.

Don't molest it - a LWB sportomatic soft window is pretty cool!

[724doorE]

If you plan to use it, drive it, and keep it for a while, then it is worth paying 18-20K to restore. Heres why.

You'll pay at least 25-30 K for a comparable "fun" new car if not more. In five years no matter how you take care of it it will be a five year old car subject to normal depreciation.

You restore the softie for 20K and its perfect. You LOVE the car and its unique. You keep it for five years and take the same or better care of it that you would a new car. Then todays 10-12K softie has appreciated some and is maybe woth 15 or more, ( who knows).

You get the idea.

So I say you may be surprised that you might be able to make your investment back and still have a whole lot of fun along the way.

If not, how much do you want for it..... I have this early T engine sitting in my garage just waiting for a project!

[Jdub]

Restore it to original. If not, give it to someone who will.

John

[BradH]

Values of open 356's vs. their coupe counterparts were dead even for a long time. I don't need to remind all of you of the huge delta in price between the two now.

I'm a confirmed coupe guy, but I can certainly see the value of early Targas rise over the coupes, just as the 356's have. If you look at nearly *any* collector grade sports car, regardless of original production numbers, the top down (or off) model is worth more than the coupe. It is only a matter of time for 911's, and I'd imagine that the soft-window cars will lead that charge due to their relative rarity.

Whether or not Mark's particular car will be in the absolute front of the price pack several years from now, I don't know. But I'd imagine that this is one of the more viable non-"S" longhood restoration projects in terms of future value.

I guess it all comes down to how much you realistically need to put in it to do it right and how long you see yourself keeping the car. If you get in the middle of the restoration and need/want to bail, you will probably get hurt just like bailing out on any restoration.

FWIW,

Dr. Brad
'83 SC Coupe
SCWDP member who digs longhood soft window Targas

[john walker's workshop]

you could invest $20k, or you could do it for $10K just as well, if you have the skills to do all the labor yourself. just buy wisely and take your time finding good deals. find a good running engine for cheap, that can just be cleaned up and used as is. the body prep and paint is the cash killer. but first, it needs to be totally stripped and scraped and prodded to be sure that it's solid enough to be worth restoring. it would be interesting to raise it on a rack to see if the doors can still be opened and closed. some of those old rusty targas sag so bad when lifted, that the rear door gap increases to an inch or more, and if you managed to open the door, you wouldn't be able to close it. from the looks of it, with the interior having been exposed to the weather for a long time, rust may be a major problem. but then it was in texas. does it rain a lot in texas? i've heard about the floods.

[targa80]

Sell it to someone who is looking for a Targa soft top to restore and is willing to put the money and time into it. If you gut it and use the parts for an SC something then you can claim to have been able to eliminate an older model that will eventually be extint.

[David Bahr]

The long hood soft window on a later chassis doesn't work. It will still FEEL like a later car, lacking the free-revving, nimble handling classic feel. Restore this chassis rather than cutting it up. Much better to source a used 3.0 liter with 915 tranny to drop in the current chassis if you need the power.

I think the question is, restore it to stock (even though the #s won't match) or do some upgrades. I REALLY like the idea of a lightweight spyder with roll hoop, very R Gruppe, with a hot 2.4 engine. Nice, lightweight magnesium case.

Another cool alternative would be more of a daily driver feel with a 2.7: still magnesium but more usable torque, good seats and carpets, nice stereo.

However, while a soft window it is still a targa and I think the leaks were a no-cost factory option on all targas. So it's probably more of a fair-weather fun car, so you won't miss the niceties.

I say, 2.4 liter R Gruppe!!!

[efhughes3]

I'd say that the combo new/old sounds great. You know that this car is not going to be viewed as a collectible due to missing engine, etc. So, if you're going to enjoy the project, and end up with a car that looks great and that you enjoy owning, carry on!

SCWDP member who digs longhood soft window Targas

Brad, I just barely caught that. Great sig line!!

These suggestions/ideas are exactly what I'm after. Keep them coming.
Thanks,
Mark

[efhughes3]

Mark:

One other thing: You might own the oldest Cab around if you cut the Targa bar off! I almost went that route with all of the grief I had to get my window back in.


(Just kidding about the Cab idea)

[Sarah]

I think if you are looking for a project to do that you will look forward to working on then go for it. And...if you love the way it turns out, feel great about the job you've done and never want to sell it...then you have only made gains...no losses.

[Bobboloo]

What was the reason for rescuing this particular car from that field?

I thought it was because this car has a unique niche in Porsche 911 history. Stray from that and this car is just another rusting hulk that makes a lousy investment of time and money.

So what does this talk of R Gruppe, 3.0 , 915 blah blah have to do with this car?

Don't get me wrong. I love a 911 Hot Rod. I'm building one myself. It's just that this car is a lousy starting point for one of those cars. The smart money would be to turn this car for a small profit and buy or trade for a better starting point for a Hot Rod. Thoughts of a 72' Silver T Coupe that just got a fresh coat of black paint come to mind.

P.S. As far as collectables go. Whether it's cars, antique furniture or whatever the most valuable items are always "bone stock" as someone put it to me. Matching numbers are nice but the history is what really makes a collectable valuable.

[Hetmann]

I see it as a passion thing. Either your gut is telling you to do it or it isn't. Economics ususally doesn't play too much in the decision.

My question is... What's the big deal with soft window Targa's anyway? Seems to me you can convert any Targa to a soft window by taking the glass out and getting a vinyl one put in. How come nobody's doing that?

[YTNUKLR]

Mark, you've got a car with a 3.0L engine and a 915. In Porsches (if I owned multiple car), I'd like something different in each one. The 3.0/915 has its character, just as much or possibly less than a 2.2T/Sporto drivetrain. I think it'd be fun to do that kind of restoration. Don't cut up the body and add flares-the early 911 Targas seem (to me) like a female bodybuilder when they do that. It looks like that car also had steel wheels when it was stock, so that would look more 356/912 than 911, which differentiates it further from your SC. It's just one off those rare occurrences of options (Targa/T/Sporto) for a year that didn't have but probably 50 SW targas. Let me know what you're going to do with it (hint, hint) but if you're going to keep it and are committed, pull through.

My 2C, Scott

[cegerer]

There's a 356 coupe sitting OUTSIDE of a barn a few miles from my house. It's been there for at least 15 years. I'm sure it's full of rust, but it looks good from the end of the 200 yard driveway. I've considered making an offer on it, disassembling it and reassembling it in my basement as a video game platform. Install some kind of widescreen monitor in the windshield, hook up the steering wheel and pedals electronically, Xbox it, Janis Joplin livery, etc .... Maybe an option for the 71? -- Curt

The entertainment center is one option. Or as a lady friend suggested, we could turn it in to a very cool planter box and set it by the pool.

[jtratza]

As a Targa owner (and someone who poured bucks into a 1954 MGTF basketcase restoration) I appreciate your problem. I always opt for saving a car as valued as a Porsche but I sure like the idea of a soft window Targa of any year. If the base car is past restoration why not a recreation? So what if the bumpers are a later style.

[real550A]

THIS BARN AVAILABLE!
612-722-1214

[cegerer]

"a very cool planter box and set it by the pool."

Well, the softwindow would make a nice greenhouse .... -- Curt