Early 911 Production Dates- Building a Spreadsheet

[hailey198]

Like many of us on this board, I find a nice early long-hood Porsche 911 and buy it, and there is no production date on it (sticker removed or painted over/damaged etc..). I have searched several forums to try to get bearings on dates and VINs for the cars I own, either to verify the current stickers as authentic (because there are some "reproductions" out there), or to find the production date that Porsche says they don't have available for the $100 COA paid. I have decided to build a production date spreadsheet for 69-74 911 cars with everyone's help- but only if you have verifiable prod. dates. Some COA's came with production dates (I would qualify that as verifiable), most of the recent ones don't? Is Porsche just not looking or....? Anyway, if you have a date code of production that plays into any of these sequences -please help. Thanks!
Looking for birthdays for my kids:
70 Karmann coupe T 2293
73 Porsche built T coupe 0923
70 Porsche 911E coupe 0200
74 Carrera Targa 0035

[Matt Monson]

You might reach out to Dave Pateman before you go to the trouble...

[hailey198]

Here is a recent post from the only Dave Pateman I can find Matt.


"David Pateman"
Post subject: Re: Obtaining a real KardexPost Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 9:39 pm

"I am able to assist you getting the Kardex for cars up through 1969; not for 1970 model year or later
Email me for details. Generally available in 3 working days."

Is Dave working on a 70 and later cars like mine for a database now and if so let me know if you know how to contact him. Thanks for your help.
- Henry

[Allen_70S]

Hailey:

I'm lucky enough to have paperwork from the day the original owner of my '70S picked up the car at the factory. I'm betting most forum members have never seen this document for a longhood. The COA shows "Production completion date is unavailable."
Its only one car, but its guaranteed to be authentic.

Al

[hailey198]

Thanks Al, this is great! What a great document to have with your car 70 S. I think in the case of owners who know they have an original production date information like this, including the sticker on the door jam (i.e. old, chipped up with a bit of overpaint on it), then that works as well and hopefully we can start to build a database of production. For example my 1970 911E (0200) is a 12-69 build date, although that was not on the COA. I BELIEVE my Carrera 74 targa (0035) is a 9/73 production date (I have seen one other Carrera targa with a number 10 units below mine) but that does not guarantee anything. The more examples the better. Thanks again! BTW Porsche got back to me today to confirm they don't have any of this information.

[grizzfan]

This doesn't completely answer your question but the new Porsche Red Book (2015) has a wealth of production information, exact birthdates no, but lots of interesting stuff. It might be a start point.

Tom

[djpateman]

Yes, I do collect information on the 1970 and later cars in addition to all earlier Porsche. The most accurate information is the Compliance decal on the doorjamb. This decal should have the correct month for the date the car was completed on the assembly line. Almost every other document such as MSO (above) or invoice is very likely to have a date later than the assembly date.
Dave

[RNajarian]

I'm collecting this data for 1975 Targas, let me know if you want that info/data. To date I gave verified production dates of 22 cars.

I check eBay for cars for sale and see if they have a photo of the production sticker.

Alex Manos of Beverley Hills Car Club sells a lot of early 911's but typically those cars are pretty rough with bad paint jobs and missing stickers.

On occasion I see a car here on Pelican that shows the sticker. Those cars are understandably in much better condition.

Good Luck

[hailey198]

Thanks for the help, and at the point just looking for 69-74 cars but it would make sense to build it out beyond that and happy to share what I get when completed. It seems Porsche already has on file cars up to 69 but then something happened and perhaps (Kardex) production date records ceased to exist? The production/VIN stickers in the driver's door jam IS the best way, BUT, in many cases has been removed or restored with an inaccurate replacment sticker. If everyone with one of these cars on PP who has a valid original sticker with a 69-74 car, I am guessing we could "triangulate" production dates for other VIN's and owners ands share for those who are continuing to search the month their car was built. I can post what I have if that is helpful but was hoping to get more input from those who have dates, and the last four digits of a VIN and year type from fellow Pelicans

FOR EXAMPLE: 1970 Karmann coupe last four VIN: 2299- valid sticker on door jam: listed production date 12/69.

[RNajarian]

Exactly. If you can verify both vehicle #0003 and #0050 were built in June '68 for example, it would be safe to assume the cars in between (#0004-0049) were also built the same month.

Hopefully people will start to help you fill out the database

Good luck

[hailey198]

This is kind of what I was thinking about. Can add more with everyone's help and start to gauge production by month for each model, type and whether Karmann or Porsche built for some models. Have two Karmann's in one month already with a 300 unit variance....

[Cook&Dunning]

When they say Cabriolet, does that mean Targa? Otherwise you have a very rare beast!

[hailey198]

OK- Heard from Porsche COA group today and it turns out my 70 Karmann built 911T is also a 12-69 build/prod date! This interesting as it is number 0924 and it now will be alongside 1642 and 1901 12-69 production dates I have verified! I think this is physically impossible to build that many units in one month, but perhaps they all came to Porsche at once and they were given those production dates (stickers)?
So, if anyone out there has a 1970 Karmann coupe or targa with an original sticker on the door jam or a COA verifying production month please let me know. The plot thickens as they say.

[djpateman]

Originally Posted by hailey198

it now will be alongside 1642 and 1901 12-69 production dates I have verified!

Still working 0n the problem for you, I can say 1901 is 12/69 but 1642 and 924 cannot be. Some data I have:
9110120033 1969 07
9110120244 1969 09
9110120581 1969 09
9110120642 1969 09
9110121697 1969 11
9110121752 1969 11
9110121901 1969 12
9110122021 1969 12
9110122223 1969 12
9110122784 1970 03
9110123137 1970 04
9110123423 1970 05
9110123962 1970 07

[hailey198]

I am just estimating here but in the event of 300-500 cars per month or so at the Karmann factory and some of the data here...my 70 Karmann T 0924 is an October build date. I still think something is uniquely strange about the December 1969 date for Porsche. They seem to gravitate on COA's for Karmann's to the 12/69 date for some reason. Maybe every car built prior to 1/70 is recorded as 12/69 I don't know. The ORIGINAL sticker on the door jam to Dave's point is the real production date (if you have it). Thank you Dave for the info. I will continue to compile information as I find it as well, not relying just on Porsche COA's but instead the original stickers (or a combination of the two).
Still looking for help on the other VINs as well....

- Henry