type-4 in an '80 Vanagon?

cfranklin · 09-23-2003, 04:41 PM

Hey guys,
I'm looking at a type-4 transplant into a '66 912 (stock motor will only rotate about 340-degrees, then stops as if it's hitting a valve)... I have a line on an '80 vanagon that runs well for a pretty good price, but I want to make sure I'm not getting into something I can never make work quite right... with a daughter in college and another right on her heels I'm looking for something that'll get my baby back on the road quickly and relatively cheaply that won't leave me feeling disappointed with the ride while I nurse my stock motor back to health.

I also considered a v8 transplant, but I'm not sure I'd be happy with that...

_curt

tronman · 09-24-2003, 08:49 AM

From everything I've read a T4 transplant is pretty simple, requires a different flywheel and the T4 rear mount...but no cutting or welding and can be put back to original quickly. Course if it's fuel injected...may be some wiring issues...

Anybody else wanna chime in?

Morrie · 09-24-2003, 10:14 AM

I posted a similar question recently.....Search for a thread called "What Type Type IV?" Some good insights there.... all Type IVs are not created equal.....

cfranklin · 09-24-2003, 10:25 AM

Thanks Morrie,
I'll check out that thread as soon as I can- I've done some additional digging in the meantime as I read on Tom Slider's site (http://www.tunacan.net/t4/tech/ct-cz.shtml) that some of the early Vanagons were delivered with an odd engine code that identified them as CT or CZ engines- more of a variant on the type 1 format that didn't sound so good. Also, I'm trying to find out if the old donor van might have had A/C- (the girlfriend thinks that would be a good thing... contrary to popular belief, it does get toasty in Oregon from time-to-time!)

From what I've also been able to discern, some of the 2.0 type 4's powering the vans had smallish valves and some valve seat problems?

Overall, it seems like this engine might be a good place to start, but I still consider myself to be a bit "under-informed"

thanks for the help- you guys are the greatest!

_c

cfranklin · 09-24-2003, 01:26 PM

geez, now I'm embarassed! The "What Type Type IV?" thread pretty much answered all my questions!

I got some more specific info on variations of the t-4 motor I've been looking at as I dove deeper into the http://tunacan.net/t4 site- it's a great resource!

_curt

Griznant · Griznant's Garage

Typically, and this of course is based on generalizations, the Vanagon engine is not a good choice as a donor core.

A couple of things:

The heads suck. Not just a little, a LOT. The valves are small, the castings are not as good, and they have square exhaust ports. This requires the use of custom exhaust manifolds, and you won't be able to run earlier bus heater boxes because they won't bolt up. This will be a bigger stumbling block than what you have.

Also, this engine has been lugging around a bread-box its whole life, and not a lightweight one either. T4s are strong, but you'd be better off finding one that came from a lighter usually less-abused car.

Also, the pistons are dished so they have low compression, the case castings are "not as good" as earlier ones, and the rear engine hanger is very different which will require a different approach from most other conversions. In addition, the fan shroud is different from earlier busses/914/411 motors and the alternator hangs WAY off to one side via a completely different mount. It won't fit in a 912 very easily.

Now, this doesn't mean that all is lost, but the 67hp these things put out are pretty damned pathetic and to top it off, they run hot. You would need to tear into it and redo the whole thing to make something that was worth your time to convert. I won't even get into the EFI aspects of it.

That said, I AM running a Vanagon crank and rods in my 2056 because I got a killer deal on a freshly rebuilt core engine and all those parts were brand spankin' new. Still, that's as far as the similarities go with mine.

Later,

G

'69 912 with 2056ccs of stompin' T4 power!

cfranklin · 09-25-2003, 07:55 AM

yeh, I think I may pass on this deal- at first glance it seems pretty good, but it's beginning to sound like there's a lot more to worry about with this engine even if it were in perfect condition. Thanks for the benefit of your experience- I think I'll keep my eyes open for a 412 instead.

_c