Type 4 In A 911 Targa?

FenderGuy · 10-10-2003, 11:13 AM

Ok heres a thought ever since my 914 1.8 got totaled i have wanted another fun porsche. I have always wanted the classic porsche targa, but fearing the porsche engine i never bought one. Ok heres a thought, How much mods would it take to put a type 4 enegine in a 1977-1980 911 targa body? I dont want a 912e i want a open air car. Also the car would need ac due to me living in arizona and i would like at least some guts in the engine. any thoughts would be helpful thanks

James in SA · 10-10-2003, 09:09 PM

I guess you could put a Type IV in a later targa body just the same as you can put one in a 912, although the arrangements for the engine mounting bar would be slightly different. For the specific mods you'd need, have a trawl through the archives and check out the websites listed in Morrie's thread.

As for cost, it's the classic 'speed costs ...' equation. The conversion to my car, 12 years ago by the previous owner, cost little more than the price of a rusted-out 411. But if you want the car to go like a Porsche, not just look like a Porsche, be prepared to spend some $$ on your engine.

hth

James

jess p · 10-14-2003, 07:40 PM

First, you would need to weld in different motor mounts. Second,
a type 4 engine in a 914 sits in front of the trans, (mid-engine)
If you tried to install a type 4 in a 911 it would turn the other
way. It would be very difficult to install a 914 tranny in a 911.
Not only would there be issues with the shifter linkage but
the tranny mounts as well. I believe you would have to flip
the ring gear. Best to go with a 1.6 vw engine enlarged to
2.3 liters, turbo. You could adapt it to the existing 915 trans.
Check out this months issue of vw magazine. Competition
engineering based in Tempe Arizona built such a motor. Puts
out close to 300 hp. Imagine that in a 911!

76 911S
66 912 V8
68 912 2.2 with nitrous

atlporsche · 10-15-2003, 03:08 AM

yep, you'd have to flip the ring gear, if you're really looking to put your old 1.8 in a body shell.

don't get a flared car...get as narrow a body as you can.

the swap would really be fairly straight forward...turbo it while you're at it...

sjd

Griznant · Griznant's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by jess p
First, you would need to weld in different motor mounts. Second,
a type 4 engine in a 914 sits in front of the trans, (mid-engine)
If you tried to install a type 4 in a 911 it would turn the other
way. It would be very difficult to install a 914 tranny in a 911.
Not only would there be issues with the shifter linkage but
the tranny mounts as well. I believe you would have to flip
the ring gear. Best to go with a 1.6 vw engine enlarged to
2.3 liters, turbo. You could adapt it to the existing 915 trans.
Check out this months issue of vw magazine. Competition
engineering based in Tempe Arizona built such a motor. Puts
out close to 300 hp. Imagine that in a 911!

Maybe I am misunderstanding, but there is no problem bolting a T4 to a 911. The engine itself does not turn the opposite direction, so whether it is in a 914, 911, 912, etc. it doesn't matter. The wheel rotation is handled in the ring gear in all models.

The problem you'll have is in regard to the T4 fitting the later model 915 transmission since the input shaft is different and there was never a T4 bolted to a standard 915 gearbox (the 923 box in the 912E had a 901 input shaft).

I don't' think you'd ever be able to get a 914 gearbox in a 911, nor should you even try. Just use an earlier 911/912 901-based box and call it good, which is essentially the same box as the 914 minus the funky nose cone. You get the dogleg 1st gear, but it should fit without too much trouble.

Putting a big bore, big stroke, turbo Type1 engine in any type of a daily driving vehicle is a bad idea. Not only are you pushing the envelope of performance with this engine, but then you are expecting it to live in traffic, day after day, and on pump gas, all the while pushing a car that weighs 500 pounds more than a bug. I'd avoid this.

If the car is already a 911, it's probably best to find a good 911 engine and put it back in. It's already setup for it, and the cost to buy a good used flat six is roughly the cost to buildup a hi-po T4, and you don't have to modify anything.

Later,

G

atlporsche · 10-15-2003, 08:39 AM

you get my e-mail G???

sorry it's taken all year to get that thing boxed up...

let me know if you still want that heater.

sjd
back to your regularly scheduled thread

FenderGuy · 10-16-2003, 04:46 PM

I think some of you misunderstood my post...i said ever since my 914 got wrecked that was back in 1998, i dont have any parts of that car...i dont even have a 911 shell, my post was intended to get information for this type of conversion, i drive a lets just say american car now(once you go german you always want to go back). well i am ready to own another porsche. i dont want a flat six for the cost of maintaince is too high for me, i liked working on my 914 when i had it, my mind is set on the 2.0 engine, i really dont care for power(ok now that is a lie) now, maybe later a turbo or something into a type 4 , i would never get a type 1, ive heard to many bad things about those types. but thanks for the posts and yes you can do it, too many people say you cant and thats not true.

atlporsche · 10-16-2003, 04:58 PM

just get a '76 912 E...

I hear there were a few targas??? not sure.

yes, it's doable. yes it'd be easy. yes, you'd have better balance and weight distribution.

sjd

FenderGuy · 10-16-2003, 05:18 PM

912e targa? that is so rare and there were supposed to 2 made, but i think its a myth. get a 912e? yeah i know i have debated this, should i get a 912e? i think the main reason i dont want to get a 912e is cause its a coupe, i like the feel of a open air car. For me i would like to have a 911 open air look and the horsepower is not a issue. i am pretty set on a 911 targa with a type 4 engine. I posted here to get thoughts and ideas and have gotten them

atlporsche · 10-16-2003, 05:58 PM

so cut it.

like the one on EBAY.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=6429&item=2437376841

hell, just buy that one.

James in SA · 10-16-2003, 09:00 PM

FenderGuy, are you wedded to the 'Impact Bumper' look of the 912E? If not, seems to m you'd be better off starting with a 912 targa and putting a Type IV in that. ???

Cheers

James

FenderGuy · 10-17-2003, 10:13 AM

pretty much set on the 74 and up look, looks more modern not saying the 73s and under dont look good, i just prefer the 74s and up

eki912 · 10-17-2003, 02:06 PM

You have to find a 911 targa , with a blown or bad engine.Get the price down , because nobody is gonna buy a 911 with a bad engine.

Then go to e-bay , check item 2438100676.Get that home too.... then all you need is time..... and a good BIG garage ....and some tools....and some money.... and understanding wife/girlfriend....

e k i

FenderGuy · 10-18-2003, 11:09 AM

eki912 thanks for the post, thats a possiability, i have found a 77 targa with a bad engine in california the person wants $2500 obo but i havent called yet...i am currently emailing someone that already has a 911 targa set up with a type 4 engine in it, i am hoping we can come to a mutal agreement at the price, since it does require a engine rebuild. I hope to soon own a 911 or my version of it.

FenderGuy · 10-18-2003, 11:12 AM

ps only bad thing about that 912e its in dc and the person says local pickup , i am in arizona

atlporsche · 10-18-2003, 02:22 PM

There's a couple guys out that way on the 912 board...I'm sure one would be willing to pick it up...or even go look at it...

goto bbs912.org

look for Dave Lovato or Howard Beard in the SE forum.

avsarinana · 10-18-2003, 07:57 PM

The 1978 thru 1989 911 is one of the best motors porsche ever built,it's capable of produciing 250,000 miles,plus awesome performance.I think it would be a mistake in many aspects

consider the cost of building a motor of equal performance,plus the modification!?Also consider you would have to rebuild the type 4 motor 2 or 3 times before the 1978 thru 1989 original motor will need a rebuild.

Art

FenderGuy · 10-19-2003, 03:26 PM

I think both engines have thier good points, but to say a 3.0 will last 250,000 is kinda luck, theres so many things that can happen if that 3.0 is not taken care of the right way. Everybody has a favorite engine, personal i am more into the 911 look and horsepower is the least of my worries for now. Yeah it would be nice to have that performance from the 3.0 but for me i really dont need it. I personally enjoyed my 914 when i had it and yeah sometimes i wanted more power but for the formost the 1.8 enough for me to have fun with it. Another thing that i enjoyed that i was able to work on my own engine without having to worry if did something wrong.

avsarinana · 10-19-2003, 06:51 PM

taken care of it the right way, comes with the territory At least for me. I have a friend that has a 79 911SC that has 250,000 documented miles And still going strong.A 1.8 type 4 won't get you up your drive way in a 911.Try a 912.

Art

FenderGuy · 10-19-2003, 08:39 PM

well once again i guess you have misunderstood, the 1.8 was in my 914 and i had fun with it. as for the 911 with a type 4, it works. no thanks i think i will stick with a 911. i am amazed how people think this idea wont work, hmmm i guess proof has to be shown to the unbelievers