Electronic ignition conversion anyone?

[brcacti]

I would love to know how many of you would consider the electronic ignition in the auto Atlanta cataloge page 131? Any opinions I would love to hear.

[dr914]

the pertronix causes the 914 to start easier, to idle more smoothly, keeps the dwell and timing steady and is easy to install. The DOWNSIDE, is that since the air cooled engine runs a lot hotter at times than its water cooled equivalent, the unit has failed at times. When it first came out we thought it the answer to the points condenser. Now we carry an extra set of points condenser in the car when we go somewhere! Too bad, really works well until it fails! (LOL)

[brcacti]

Thanks again Dr. 914, I usually use my 914 in the spring, fall, winter in S. AZ because of the heat, no summer driving. Any opinions on the electronic Ignition with my use schedule? Also when it fails how long would it fail for, does it start right up when the engine has cooled some?

[dr914]

chances are it may never fail with the limited use, so as long as you have points and condenser in the glove box you are fine.

[911pcars]

To further muddy the waters, there are other pointless conversion kits out there, including those offered by Crane and MSD, among others. FWIW, I ran Crane’s pointless module and spark box in my 2.7 for 10+ years w/o issues.

I recall Pertronix did have a run of short-life units awhile back, but i’ve not read of any current issues. Anecdotally, a friend uses MSD’s distributor w/an integral MSD pointless module in a V8 ponycar with mixed results (must have a backup unit when the first one dies), FWIW.

Sherwood

[brcacti]

Originally Posted by dr914

chances are it may never fail with the limited use, so as long as you have points and condenser in the glove box you are fine.

I am still learning all about this stuff so If I ask dumb questions it is because I am ignorant of a lot of the mechanics. Do I need to get a special distributor 123 so I can use the electronic ignition?

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

No, you do not.

There are several different types of electronic ignition. The simplest is what I refer to as a points-replacement device. Pertronix, Compufire, Crane, and others make those. They get installed into your existing distributor in place of the points and trigger the ignition system to make sparks. They use solid-state devices to make and break the connection to ground instead of a spring-loaded switch.

Another type is a Capacitive Discharge Ignition, or CDI. This is a device that more or less sits between your distributor and your coil, and takes over handling most of the current that goes to the coil. It reduces the current flowing through the points by a lot and helps them last much longer. It also can produce a more consistent spark, especially at high RPMs, though that's very rarely needed for our engines. Some versions of this produce multiple sparks over a short period of time, which can in theory help promote more complete combustion or help clean off the spark plugs.

The 123 distributor is a brand-new distributor with an electronic points-replacement already installed. Some versions also have electronic replacements for the FI trigger points used by the 1.7 and 2.0 engines' D-jetronic FI. They have a variety of spark advance curves built in, and you can easily select which one you use. And it's new, so the parts haven't spent 50 years wearing against each other.

Finally, you can go with a distributorless setup. This is often called crank-triggered ignition, because there is a sensor on the crankshaft pulley (or flywheel, or on some other cars on the cam pulley) that a computer uses to figure out when to trigger the spark. This pretty much eliminates any mechanical slop or wear, which produces a more consistent spark. It can also, depending on how many sensors are used and how much dyno time you want to use, trigger the spark optimally based on a whole ton of different factors instead of just on RPM and/or vacuum signal.

--DD

[brcacti]

Thanks Dave this seems like such valuable information, will refer back to it often

[Charles Freeborn]

My race 914 has a Electro-Motiv crank fire. It has extensive tuning capabilities & at least 3 separate advance settings depending on rpm, plus rpm limiter. Very accurate rig. Does require installing the trigger wheel on the crank end, so depending on how your pulleys, etc are configured it'll take some doing. Also needs a sensor bracket. Will post some pics later today.

[911pcars]

A crank fire ignition system, as versatile and consistent as it is, may be considered slight overkill just to eliminate breaker point wear.

A pointless conversion kit is pretty affordable:
https://www.jegs.com/c/Distributors_Conversion-Kits-Points-to-Electronic/11577/10002/-1

.... while a crank fire system is.....n't in the same ballpark:
https://www.clewett.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_13_14_18

Sherwood
(no affiliation)

[76-914]

Originally Posted by dr914

the pertronix causes the 914 to start easier, to idle more smoothly, keeps the dwell and timing steady and is easy to install. The DOWNSIDE, is that since the air cooled engine runs a lot hotter at times than its water cooled equivalent, the unit has failed at times. When it first came out we thought it the answer to the points condenser. Now we carry an extra set of points condenser in the car when we go somewhere! Too bad, really works well until it fails! (LOL)

I don't subscribe to this method for 2 reasons. One; why would I choose to replace the newer electronic system with the old points & condenser? Two;. I don't think I would want to carry around a timing light and dwell meter in the trunk. I carry an additional set of Petronix in the glove box. Haven't ever needed them but they are there in an emergency.

[brcacti]

Thanks to all, I pretty much have my mind made up on the crane fireball xr700, have not yet decided WHEN to do it.

[jess p]

I installed the pertronix on my 2 L. The installation was so simple. Drove the car everyday in 115 deg heat in Arizona and no problems. I noticed the car started and ran much better.

[brcacti]

Originally Posted by jess p

I installed the pertronix on my 2 L. The installation was so simple. Drove the car everyday in 115 deg heat in Arizona and no problems. I noticed the car started and ran much better.

WOW.......................you really drove it in that heat?, I live between PHX and Tucson and don't drive it in the summer months, far too hot, no AC in car and I thought it would be too hard on air cooled car.

[ken burge]

On my way from the West coast rendezous 68 miles from home (Lake Havasu Az.) 108 F in the middle of the desert the Pertronix died on me. I would not recommend Pertronix if you drive in hot weather. The idea of having a extra dizy ready to change out(or points to install) is a good idea. In this case I would have sat there for hours letting the motor cool down before I could change parts out. Just sayin

[brcacti]

Thanks to all who contributed information, I'm pretty much set on the crane fireball

[TitanMZ3]

Originally Posted by 76-914

I don't subscribe to this method for 2 reasons. One; why would I choose to replace the newer electronic system with the old points & condenser? Two;. I don't think I would want to carry around a timing light and dwell meter in the trunk. I carry an additional set of Petronix in the glove box. Haven't ever needed them but they are there in an emergency.

I think the point is that you can easily convert back to points and cheaply. Also, you can set the points "good enough" to get home. $14 for a backup set of points and condenser is a lot cheaper than buying 2 sets of a $90 Pertronix kit.

[911pcars]

Originally Posted by TitanMZ3

I think the point is that you can easily convert back to points and cheaply. Also, you can set the points "good enough" to get home. $14 for a backup set of points and condenser is a lot cheaper than buying 2 sets of a $90 Pertronix kit.

The backup points and condenser is just that, an emergency backup system if and when the pointless module takes a dive. A feeler gauge and timing light isn't necessary to properly set up. However, one is free to purchase a backup system.... just in case, but plan accordingly and fabricate the wiring for quick connect/disconnect.

Sherwood