NPC: What do you know about Ford Pinto engines?

[Alfred1]

I'm certainly not going to put one in my teener but I keep reading about them in a performance context. Anyone know anything about these motors? Is it a similar engine to what Ford used in the Merkur?

[tat2dphreak]

they're usually attached to a POS ford from the 70s...

[BigD9146gt]

Some people say they are the one of the best 4 cylinders ever built. For sand rails, turboing, nos, they work great. It might be similar to the Merkur, but definatly not the same.

[jamcleod]

wifey had a 1600 pushrod in a '71 and later, i got a '72 (IIRC) with a 2L OHC. father in law left us a 2.3L pinto wagon (OHC). learned some of my first wrenching on them. bought the 72 with a worn out cam (used wrong oil), replaced cam, drove many free miles. big repair for my skill back then (still big for my skills today!! ) 1.6L used in some british cars too i think

[jhs914]

There are Pinto 4 cyl. engine race series still around. One of the companies that sells speed parts galore for this engine is Racer Walsh in Jacksonville (http://racerwalsh.zoovy.com/) . It should be an easy engine to modify for reliable and cheap horsepower.

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

Grassroots Motorsports had an issue last year (I think) discussing the Pinto as a racer. It talked about the engines to at least some extent. Might be worth checking out as a back issue.

--DD

[schosh]

The pinto used the 1600/2000 block originaly used in the English Fords first the Anglica and later the Cortina.
This was a workhorse engine that was the basis performance cars such as the Lotus Morgans, ect. It was later used in the Mercury Capris here in the US.
I'm not sure if souping up the pinto version to put in a 914 would be worth the effort but it's an intersting concept.
In the early 70's I shared a house with three other sports car guys . 1 had a Lotus Cortina, 1 had an Alfa Spyder( he was way to rich ,1 had a 914 and I had a MGB. We all would "rat race" around the backroads of Central Florida, often times switching cars. That cortina, with its "pinto" engine ( with double overhead cams and webbers) was rocket fast off the line and in mid speed corners with lots of torgue. It also had the major advange of being almost invisible to cops.
If you would like more info on the pinto/ford engine check out http://www.team.net/www/morgan/history/kenteng.html

[3D914]

Schosh,

I think you're on the right track there with the Ford 1600/2000 engine. I talked to a gentlemen at a car show who had a Lotus Super Seven. It had a Ford 2000 inline 4 and made over 200hp. In a car that weighs just over 1000 lbs - thats one hell of a power to weight ratio.

The earlier Super 7's had a 1600cc engine. I wonder if it was the same basic block - developed into 2.0.

Enjoy!

[cary]

Pegasus has a catalog full of parts. I think they are the engines used in Formula Fords.

[lapuwali]

Another name for the basic engine is the Ford Kent, which is indeed the basis for all Formula Ford engines (1600). The 2000 version is used in some other open-wheel formulae, as well. It was originally a pushrod engine, but got an SOHC head at some point from Ford, prior to its use in the Pinto. Cosworth made a DOHC head for the 1600, drove the cams with rubber belts, and called it the BDA (belt-driven type A), which became the spec engine in Formula Atlantic for years before Toyota stepped in. This engine basically made Cosworth as a racing engine manufacturer. The DFV was still in the future (the DFV won more F1 races than ANY other engine, by a wide margin).

Ford, Lotus, and scads of specials builders used the basic Ford block with various heads for all kinds of racing vehicles, inluding title-winning rally cars, sports cars, open-wheelers, etc.

The Kent is nearly worshipped in the UK. And a number of Europe only cars were sold with very special versions on this engine. It's a bit sad the Pinto was such a dog, as it gave this engine a pretty bad rep in the US, undeservedly. In terms of the number of races won, I doubt this engine has any peer.

[unclerichy]

[Jason Porter]

For you guys using the KB 96mm's in your cars, they are actually made for a 2.3 Pinto engine, but are compatible for our purposes.

Kinda makes you wanna be careful of tossing around negative comments about a small car from the seventies that government regulations never gave a chance. Actually, wasn't that one of the things that killed the 914?!

[lapuwali]

I don't think the Pinto's problems had anything to do with '70s regulations...

[maf 914]

The Ford Kent is a pushrod four, 1600 cc, also called the cross-flow due to the head design. It is a very compact engine with great tuning potential. It was used in many British Fords and kit cars. The Caterham Seven used it for years. This engine was the original Formula Ford engine in near stock 1600 trim. Caterham and other engine tuners would bore it to 1700 and regularly get 140+ hp. Cosworth, Lotus and others used the block and internals and added new heads to build dual overhead cam engines, such as the Lotus Twin-Cam.

The 1600 Kent engine was used in the original Pinto models, until Ford brought out the 2.0L overhead cam four, which became known as the Pinto engine. It was quite a bit bigger, taller and heavier than the Kent engine. Side by side with a Kent engine it looks huge. This was a new design and not a developement of the Kent engine. It later grew to 2.3L and was used in many Ford models. The 2.0L version was used in Formula Ford 2000 and Sports 2000 class racing.

Mike

[Jason Porter]

Originally posted by lapuwali
I don't think the Pinto's problems had anything to do with '70s regulations...

Really?!? The same goverment that increased the size and weight of the 914 with bumpers and emissions control systems, did the exact same with the Pintos.

Mind you, I don't like any Fords, except their deisel trucks. I'm a Chevy "redneck".

The early 2.0 Pintos were solid cars, had advanced suspensions for their time, and were quick by the standards of the day for sport economy class vehicles. They were also one of the fastest selling cars in US history, for a few YEARS!

BTW, the Pinto has enjoyed tons of success in racing of various classes.

For more information about the Pintos racing and production, see the November 2003 edition of Grassroots Motorsports, pg. 101.

[Scooter311]

Anyone remember the movie "Top Secret"? Comedy/WWII spoof, mid 80s I think, maybe Val Kilmer lead character - There was a scene where a German truck skidded to a stop, just millimeters from rear-ending a Pinto. There was a light "tink" sound as the bumpers finally met, and then BOOM it blew up. That whole gas tank thing, remember? Very funny movie, lotsa good one liners.
In unclerichy's pic, even though the Pinto's ahead of the teener, at least they're both ahead of the 911.

[lapuwali]

Yes, the primary thing that killed the Pinto wasn't stronger bumper regulations (indeed, that would've HELPED it), but the fact that they gained a reputation for gas tank fires in rear-end accidents.

[unclerichy]

In unclerichy's pic, even though the Pinto's ahead of the teener, at least they're both ahead of the 911.

Could be that the Pinto was being lapped, we'll never know.

I loved the 72 Pinto I drove in school.

[campbellcj]

Back in 71/72, my dad was in the market for one of the new "economy" cars. He wanted to buy American so had a choice between the Pinto and the Vega.

He chose wrong

(POS Vega went thru 3 engines in 110K miles. Eventually we had to pay a guy $40 to haul it away.)

[Eddie Brown]

My first car outta high school (1988) was a white 72 Pinto wagon. Got it from the original owner. It was in great shape!. The first job I got outta high school was a paper route, and the pinto was fantastic for it. I should've kept it, but I decided to get a 74 Super Beetle with the Auto Stick. Again, I should've kept the Pinto. BTW, it had the 2000cc engine with an automatic. All I ever did to it was change the timing belt.


Eddie.