911 Suspension Install

dyw914 · 07-10-2002, 10:01 AM

I recently purchased a 911 front suspension (w/ steering rack, aluminum cross member and sway bar) for my 914. Everything looks like a straight forward substitution except for the sway bar. The 911 suspension is supposedly from an 84 911 which has the sway bar that does not go underneath the gas tank. Does anyone have or know where I can get instructions to install this sway bar?

And with the 911 calipers in front, a 19mm master cylinder, and stock 914 calipers in the rear, would I be safe in not using the brake proportioning valve and replace with the "T" junction that I read about. Where can I go to get one of these T adapters. I'm in Los Angeles, CA. Thanks.

JWest · 07-10-2002, 10:09 AM

I'm sure in LA you can find a local VW bug shop. They will have the T for $5 new (any VW bug has it).

Jeroen · 07-10-2002, 12:04 PM

The newer 911 swaybar mounts to the crossmember (two mounting points) and is pushed into the tabs on the a-arms

If you'd like to keep the "through body" style swaybar, you'd have grind of the swaybar tabs that are on the a-arms now and weld up new (different) ones to accept the droplinks

HTH,

Jeroen

Zeke · 07-10-2002, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jeroen
The newer 911 swaybar mounts to the crossmember (two mounting points) and is pushed into the tabs on the a-arms

If you'd like to keep the "through body" style swaybar, you'd have grind of the swaybar tabs that are on the a-arms now and weld up new (different) ones to accept the droplinks

HTH,

Jeroen

It's called an underbody sway bar and its not adjustable nor are there polyurethane bushings avialable for it. It should work OK unless you are going to do all out racing.

Jeroen · 07-10-2002, 02:35 PM

Hi Milt,

Check this site for the (underbody) swaybar bushings:

http://www.racecar.co.uk/superflex/index.html

Got 'em on my '87 Carrera...

Cheers,

Jeroen

Zeke · 07-10-2002, 05:03 PM

Wow! thanks! Pelican doesn't know about this, me thinks. What kind of hassle can I expect ordering something from England?

dyw914 · 07-10-2002, 05:10 PM

Thanks for the replies. I don't plan to do any racing yet so the rubber bushings should be fine for now.

anthony · 07-10-2002, 05:20 PM

I think I'm going to do this same upgrade ('86 Carrera suspension). Will there be any problems fitting 15" wheels over the calipers?

I want to go with 911 Fuchs. I'm also wondering what sizes/offsets are compatible with a 914. Right now I have 195-60s with room to spare next to the fenders. I was thinking of 205-60s with 15x6 rims or 205-55s with 16x6 rims. What do you guys think?

Also, are there any offset differences between the different Fuchs? I notice that some 15x6 Fuchs come start with a 901 part number and others with a 911 part number.

Jeroen · 07-11-2002, 02:25 AM

Hey Milt,

I had no trouble ordering them.
I initially faxed them my order and creditcard info.
They called me back for more specifics and send me the parts.
The parts are light and small, so shipping won't cost you an arm or a leg

I just saw they added a lot of Porsche bushings since I ordered (they have a complete set of motor/tranny mounts for about $65 as well as bushings for the rear swaybar now)

Heck, they will even make you custom bushings if you like

Cheers,

Jeroen

Jeroen · 07-11-2002, 02:27 AM

Hey Anthony,

Fitting 15" Fuchs shouldn't be a problem, cause they were standard wheels for the Carrera 3.2

Dunno if the early and late Fuchs have different backspacing / offset...

Cheers,

Jeroen

Dave at Pelican Parts · Dave at Pelican Parts's Garage

You might try calling up the guys in Sales (888/280-7799) and asking about bushings for a Carrrera sway bar. I'd be surprised if we couldn't get them.

--DD

maf 914 · 07-11-2002, 09:28 AM

Milt,

I regularly do mail order business with a couple of English companies and have had no problems with shipping, customs or credit card transactions. I can't vouch for the company Jereon mentioned, but I've been happy with the service received. If it's a decent company business should go fine.

Mike

Zeke · 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave at Pelican Parts
You might try calling up the guys in Sales (888/280-7799) and asking about bushings for a Carrrera sway bar. I'd be surprised if we couldn't get them.

--DD

My info came via Darren. Maybe it's changed. I'll call him again. Thanks.

Anthony, look for rims with 4 7/8" offset (backset, I forget which, dave will have to explain that one to us one more time) measured from the mounting face to the backside lip. 15 x 7s will probably be the max w/o serious flares. 205/60s should be good on that wheel. ( I have 205/50s on that setup lowered 2 inches).

anthony · 07-11-2002, 01:26 PM

I have one 6x15 thrasher Fuch at home and I measured it this morning. It has a 4 3/4" back spacing. A 914 Fuch seems to have the same back spacing.

A buddy loaned me "Porsche 911 Performance Handbood" which lists all the offsets for various Fuchs. It seems that the early 901 and later 911 part numbered Fuchs have the same exact offset and back spacing. Even the 6x16 Fuchs have the same back spacing. The only ones that are different are the rare 7x15 911R rims.

The easiest fitment would probably be 5.5x15" Fuchs but with the same tire on a 6x15" wheel the tire shouldn't stick out much more.

campbellcj · 07-11-2002, 01:44 PM

I'm about to 5-lug my car as well. 15x6's with the proper offset do fit OK on virtually all 914's. I'm going to go for 16x7's and roll the lips as needed (I will also be running 2-3 degs neg camber; track car).

The main difference between the early 901. "deep" Fuchs and the late-style 911. version is that the early style was designed for tube tires. It does not have the same safety beading for tubeless tires that the later wheels have. For that reason the early Fuchs are often considered less desirable for very aggressive driving, or track use, with today's super sticky rubber. However, I'm not sure that I've heard of a real-world failure so this may just be a paranoid urban myth kind of thing.

Cheers,

anthony · 07-11-2002, 05:35 PM

What's the going rate for 15x6 Fuchs? I can get the set below for $475 locally. They need to be repainted but look pretty nice otherwise and I don't have to pay shipping.

http://www.well.com/user/siino/fuchs.jpg

Here's my other 911 suspension question. So I'm going to buy an '86 Carrera front suspension. It supposed include everything hub to hub as it unbolts from the car. I'm wondering if I should just use the struts and then sell off the other parts or go with the complete Carrera setup.

From the 911 Performance Handbook, 'the Carreras now had Boge, double tube, low pressure gas shocks. The front sway bar size increased from 20 to 22mm'. I'm guess that the stock Carrera front torsion bar is 19mm but I'm not sure. It sounds like a lot of spring rate for a 914. I wonder if I should go with the stock 914 sway bars and replace the Boge strut inserts with the Bilstein inserts I currently have on the 914.

Brad Roberts · 07-12-2002, 12:26 PM

Anthony,

I see your in the Golden Gate region for PCA.

Do you plan to autoX or time trial this car ??

B

anthony · 07-12-2002, 01:05 PM

I joined the PCA a few months ago and they put me in the Diablo region. I don't really have any plans for extensive autocrossing. I might do one or two per year for fun.

Zeke · 07-12-2002, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Here's my other 911 suspension question. So I'm going to buy an '86 Carrera front suspension. It supposed include everything hub to hub as it unbolts from the car. I'm wondering if I should just use the struts and then sell off the other parts or go with the complete Carrera setup.

From the 911 Performance Handbook, 'the Carreras now had Boge, double tube, low pressure gas shocks. The front sway bar size increased from 20 to 22mm'. I'm guess that the stock Carrera front torsion bar is 19mm but I'm not sure. It sounds like a lot of spring rate for a 914. I wonder if I should go with the stock 914 sway bars and replace the Boge strut inserts with the Bilstein inserts I currently have on the 914.

Yes, you probably have 19mm torsion bars on the carrera front suspension. That will tighten up the front of your 914 and require a sport shock. It will also require you to stiffen up the rear a little, say 140lb springs. And with that 22mm sway bar, the thing ought to corner pretty good. You'd have to do some high speed racing on a smooth track to want anything stiffer than that.

Remember that the 911 control arm uses a different spline than the 914 and I haven't seen the variety of torsion bars avialable that you can get for the 911. Me, I'd go for the whole 911 set up. More options. Those Boges will take a Koni adjustable insert.

Brad Roberts · 07-12-2002, 02:35 PM

I wasnt sure what your intentions where with the car.

My point is: watch the rules. Dont put late model carrera suspension under the car and plan on TT'ing or AutoX the car in a improved or stock class. It throws you into some heavy modded classes.

PCA allows you to run 914/6 brakes for 5 lug (911T) this is a tad smaller caliper but keeps you in the stock/improved classes.

SCCA allows this also.

Good luck. See you at the next fun run.

B