Installing oil trap (tuna can)

sd_73_914 · 02-27-2002, 03:44 PM

I just received my Weltmeister Oil Trap (Pelican part number: PEL-OT-914). Anyone out there know how to install this. There were no instructions with the part.

Any lessons learned installing this? Any other parts (gaskets etc) I may need ?

Thanks in advance.

Fernando

campbellcj · 04:43 PM

Jeez, it's been a while but I really thought a little instruction sheet came in the package.

It is pretty simple. Obviously you have to drain the oil (duh) and remove the sump plate and screen. The pickup tube then "plugs in" to the shaft in the tuna can. My memory is very fuzzy but it is pretty simple to figure out when you're looking at it up close under the car. You don't use the sump screen anymore with the tuna can - I don't think there's any way to fit it on.

If you get stuck, I'm sure Don or Dave or one of the Pelican guys who's done it before can help out.

Dave at Pelican Parts · Dave at Pelican Parts's Garage

The O-ring goes inside the pickup extension--the silver part with the "cross" cut into the end. Put a little oil on the O-ring. Slide the extension onto the oil pickup tube. It probably won't slide on all that easily... Push it until it stops moving.

Then put one gasket between the "can" and the crankcase--the stock setup uses two gaskets, but the tuna can only one. Put the "can" on, then slide the crush washer over the retaining nut (which looks like a bolt), and screw that on. Torque to 9.4 lb-ft, no more or you'll risk breaking part of the inside of the crankcase.

--DD

Special K · 02-28-2002, 08:52 AM

Wouldn't having one of thoses 'tuna cans' make changing your oil rather messy (albeit 'superfast') since the can is essentially the drain plug now? And, how hazardous to your crankcase is it to have the can hanging down there (i.e. curbs, road debris)?

piperpilotduane · 02-28-2002, 12:25 PM

Quote Special K:
Wouldn't having one of thoses 'tuna cans' make changing your oil rather messy.

No. You never have to remove the tuna can. You use the drain plug beside it.

pbanders · pbanders's Garage

Personally, I always remove the tuna can when doing oil changes to get all of the old oil out. I pull the drain plug first, drain as much as I can, then pull off the tuna can to get the last bit. To make it more exciting, I usually do my oil changes when the motor is warm for better flow, which can get interesting when you loosen the bolt on the can and the oil starts coming out.

As far as worring about it hanging down from the bottom of the engine, well, it's between the wheels and shielded by the engine bar (e.g something coming from the front will hit the engine bar first before whacking the can), so it's about as safe as it can get.

sd_73_914 · 03-04-2002, 11:41 AM

Thank you all for your help.

The oil trap is now installed and what a difference!

My oil pressure light use to come on while cornering hard at PCA events. Now it does not! Big releaf.

Fernando

David Bahr · 03-08-2002, 06:02 PM

My Weltmeister "tuna can" did not stop my oil starvation problem. I lose oil pressure in sustained left turns, like turn 3 at Heartland Park. I re-installed, but no difference.

Dave?

Zeke · 03-08-2002, 06:26 PM

David, do you have an external oil cooler? Is your windage tray in place w/ seals? If all is well in these areas and stlll no pressure in corners, you might install an Accusump.

SteveStromberg · 03-08-2002, 06:37 PM

Try adding an extra half quart of oil to the sump. Steve

Zeke · 03-08-2002, 06:38 PM

David, I just read in the other thread that you do have an oil cooler. The Mocal thermostat adapter is supposed to be a good piece. What I was wondering though, was about the location of the cooler in relation to the bottom of the engine. Is oil runnig back into the engine when stopped and being pumped out while driving starving the pickup. In other words, is it possible to get false readings off the dipstick because the oil is somewhere else when running instead of having enough "in the can?" If the cooler is higher, did the system come w/ a check valve?

David Bahr · 03-08-2002, 06:53 PM

Zeke -
The system comes with a sandwich plate with integral thermostat, but I pulled the MOCAL catalog and see nothing about a check-valve.

You may have it, though, on the false oil level reading concept. I have always added an extra half a quart, even prior to the tuna can installation. Maybe my real question is, given a tuna can and the exterior oil cooler, how much oil should I run in the crankcase? And, if I end up adding a bunch more oil, with no check valve so it is all in the sump at start-up, will I break a crank or something?

Thanks for your good thoughts!

Zeke · 03-08-2002, 07:07 PM

Well, I think you are looking for a good balance. You have added extra capacity and need a little extra oil to make up the difference. But, you don't want it all in the crankcase when cold, or after sitting for a while. That would show up as too much oil when really you have the right amount. Some oil has to stay in the cooler and lines. I just wondered if it did.

AS far as breaking a crank, I shouldn't say my opinion, because I don't know. But overall, calculate the volume added to the original capacity for the total. Put it in, run it, rest it and check it. IF it shows too full, then you found the problem.

I still like the Accusump. It knows when there is no pressure including starting and shoots oil in to maintain the pressure.

maf 914 · 03-09-2002, 06:58 AM

Milt, Good point about oil flowing back into the crankcase. I have wondered about the same thing with oil cooler installations. It seems to me that the best location would be below the oil fill level. That way the cooler and lines would always be full of oil and the crankcase would be filled to the proper oil level. Instead of the usual 4 quarts you would have 4 + 1 (or whatever the cooler system volume is) quarts. With the cooler mounted on the engine lid per the BAT kit (sounds like it comes from a cartoon series!) arrangement, the oil will flow back to the engine. I would suggest disconnecting the cooler lines and filling these lines and the cooler with oil to determine the volume of the cooler system. Knowing this volume will let you determine what your total system volume is and make a better judgement whether putting this volume in your crankcase will possibly cause problems. If you have access to an empty engine case you could fill the crankcase and determine the volume of oil the engine could hold before spilling into the cylinders. Maybe some experienced engine guys can comment on the max acceptable volume.

Good topic. Good luck.

Mike

SteveStromberg · 03-09-2002, 09:28 AM

The Jensen Healey I used to own, the owner's manual said to check the oil after driving the car because of the amount of oil that would be in the top end of the 907 Lotus motor was about 1 qt. If you check the oil cold, the dip stick would indicate full yet you would be 1 qt low while running. The best time to check the oil, when you have installed external oil cooler or remote filter, is after the car has been run that way you get a true reading on the dip stick. I found that running an extra 1/2 qt of oil in the Type4 is OK as the cam shaft sits well above the oil level and does not beat the oil causing foaming as an American V8. JP's car is a 6cyl with dry sump so the oil pressure loss due to friction in the lines is not the same as using an oil bypass plate on the filter and running it to the front of the car. The stock pump is only meant to push that oil a few inches from the sump to the oil cooler into the case, not 16ft of hose from the front to the engine and back. OTTO, you use the front cooler setup...what oil pump do you recommend for the Type4? Steve

kuch · 03-10-2002, 10:58 AM

Why would you install the oil trap without the sump screen (oil strainer) ? Why not cut out the center of the aluminum base on the oil sump screen and install it in between the engine and the oil trap with two gaskets.

Porsche 930's, 911's, 914's, 356's, even type one bug engines all use a oil sump screen, it is there for a reason. It will stop debris from clogging your oil engine's passages and robbing oil pressure/flow. The factory operators manual recommends that the oil strainer be removed and cleaned every 20,000 miles as part of a regular oil change.

Use the Weltmeister Oil Trap to ensure oil flow during hard cornering, with the modified factory oil sump to prevent clogging the engines oil passages. Use both as insurance for extended engine life.

TGM · 03-11-2002, 09:46 AM

This post is very pertinent to me right now. I have an external cooler mounted below the trunk floor and am having oil pressure loss under hard braking. I also figured that the cold dipstick readings are too high once the oil fills the lines and the cooler. Is there any chance to get an accurate reading on the dipstick with the engine running? Anyone have an answer to the previous question of how high can the oil level in the sump be without damaging anything? After springing for the Raby 2270, sure don't want to have any lubrication problems.

maf 914 · 03-11-2002, 09:56 AM

Check with Jake about oil volume. He wrote in a post some time ago that he ran three oil coolers to cool a 2.6L (I think) in his beetle. He has probably dealt with the volume and cooler elevation issues.

Mike

Zeke · 03-11-2002, 05:40 PM

I thought I put this in here, but i don't see it. Maybe another thread. According to my mentor and racing friend, the thermostat (he uses an inline model) helps prevent oil running back into the engine after shut down. I not sure I understand that because the thermostat would stay open due to the presence of hot oil, unless its a solenoid that needs voltage to open. I don't like that either; what if the electrical connection failed? Somebody has to know how to maintain the proper oil level and have another quart or so in the cooling system when the engine is static.

David Bahr · 03-12-2002, 08:20 PM

Regarding adding oil to compensate for tuna can and external oil cooler:

My tuna can instructions have the gasket imprint= 8.0 cm diameter; I'm guessing (this was years ago) that the interior depth was 4 cm, for a volume of .21 quarts.

I called BAT and was told the oil capacity of the 914 MOCAL cooler kit was approximately 1.5 quarts. I tried to measure this...

Using a measurement for then AN-10 fitting my Aeroquip lines to the cooler use of 0.87" ID (at best a close approximation) and guesstimating 78" of oil line, and straining my conversion factors, I calculate the volume of the oil lines to be .80 US quarts. To this would have to be added the capacity of the cooler and the thermostat. The 1.5 quarts seems slightly high to me, but in the range.

I'm going to assume the added capacity is 1.5 quarts. I think it is still 914 conventional wisdom, in a stock engine, to run an extra 0.5 quarts of oil plus the specified 3.7 quarts (with filter), or 4.2 quarts. With an additional 1.5 quarts added capacity, that makes 5.7 quarts, theoretically.

My thought is, I'll try 5.5 quarts and see what happens at the track. [Unfortunately, I lose pressure in left turns, not right, otherwise the nearest interstate cloverleaf could answer this. Darn!]

I will call BAT again and check on capacity of the cooler (it's a 25-row MOCAL) and whether the thermostat also acts as a check-valve.