Getting Porsches Back Into My Life

Apache · 05-26-2003, 10:34 PM

As a previous 1979 924 owner (1981 - 1988) I have decided that it is time to get back into the game.

I have spent the last few days reading up all I can find but I still have a few more questions.

I have decided on a 1988 924-S with a 5 speed. Now here are my questions:

1. When I owned my earlier Porsche, I was ripped off by the three Porsche mechanics that I came in contact with as a byproduct of being naive and a bit young and stupid. Not wanting to repeat that process, how do you ensure that you do not get taken to the cleaners, if you are not doing your own work?

2. I used to have tools and a place to do maintenance, now I do not. If I ever have to do anything mechanical, I will have to do it in my driveway. Assuming that I can find a decent mechanic, can I live out my upcoming Porsche existence by having said mechanic do all of the upkeep or will that bleed me dry?

3. I have another car, so this will not be my primary means of transportation, but I want to drive the Porsche as much as circumstances will allow. In my world this translate into really wanting a reliable 924 and not a hanger queen like my '79 was. Is that possible with an '88 924-S if I spend a "reasonable" amount of time and money to keep it up?

4. I wont be racing at all if that will help some of your answers.

5. If I have to buy tools to do some work, what would you recommend? I guess I could spend no more than $500 if I had to. Is that enough or should I just skip that idea entirely?

6. Did they ever fix the rear hatch window frame seperation problem?

7. If I chose carefully, can I get a really cherry 924 for between $4,500 and $5,500 with the expectation of spending another $1,500 to bring it up to a high degree of perfection with EVERYTHING in order working reliably?
or
Should I buy a $2,500 car and spend another $4,500 - $5,000 to get the car right?

If you knew everything that you know now, what would you people have done differently when you got your 924-S?

85944na · 85944na's Garage

Buy the best one you can find/afford, for 4500-5500 you should be able to buy a REALLY nice 924s, they seem to be undervalued, and go for less than 944s. Good luck!

Apache · 05-26-2003, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 85944na
Buy the best one you can find/afford, for 4500-5500 you should be able to buy a REALLY nice 924s, they seem to be undervalued, and go for less than 944s. Good luck!

WOW! Thanks for the fast reply!

I'm assuming that at some point the car will need major work like all cars do. Do I save that much money by buying a car that has recently (within the last year or so) been majorly overhauled/rebuilt? How do I verify that the work was done correctly by the previous owner?

Thanks again!

AFJuvat · 11:22 PM

http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/944_buyers_guide/944_buyers_guide.htm

Written for the 944, but it applies to the 924S as well.

The 924S is significantly more reliable than the original 924 - it is essentially a 944 engine in a 924 body.

Before you become totally frightened, the repair prices listed are if you have a professional Porsche mechanic work on the car.

Many repairs can be done in the driveway for significantly less cost (some you will need a mechanic - repairs that require special tools etc). you will need a good set of metric wrenches and sockets. plus other various tools as things come up.

Get the best one you can afford, a "cherry" one for $4500 will save you a lot of pain in the wallet over a $1500.

In any case, have a prospective purchase inspected by a qualified Porsche mechanic before you buy. Hidden maintenance costs can double what you have invested in the car very quickly.

Welcome to the group

AFJuvat

scottmandue · 05-27-2003, 11:55 AM

I am also am somewhat mechanically challenged... well... okay I'm just plain lazy! But I'm not rich either, and after all mechanics got to eat too. After over two years of looking I think I finally found a shop close to me that is recommended by a fellow 944 owner.
Ask here if anyone knows a good wrench in your area, heck we even have mechanics that post here!

Personally I searched the internet, phone books, even chased people in parking lots who were driving 924/944's.
So ask, ask, ask then ask again... the lead I got to the Porsche shop came from a guy who saw a post I put out about getting some dings fixed, after I gave him the bodyshops I had looked at I gave him my usual "so where do you get your car worked on?"

Good Luck!

AaronM · 05-27-2003, 01:34 PM

1) Rennlist was an excellent resource for me when I needed to find a mechanic at school (250 miles from my normal mechanic). Ask other Porsche owners, especially other owners with about the same budget. They should be able to point you towards good shops. Don't be drawn in to a shop that is Porsche specific. While that's not a bad thing, there are plenty of generic "import" shops with excellent mechanics. My 914 and 924S go to a guy who works mainly on Japanese cars but who has been a German car nut all his life. He has always done excellent work. Be wary of any shop that won't take at least a little time to talk comfortably with you.

2) If you buy a car that is in good shape (I recommend a pre-purchase inspection), then yes. Granted those $600+ belt changes come up relatively fast at 30,000 miles and the clutch is $1,500 when it goes, but those are really the only terrible things and they don't come up often. On a per-month and averaged-out basis, the 924S/944 isn't much worse than a Honda of comparable age.

3) My 924S is a daily-driver. It handles surprisingly well in the winter, the heater is excellent and if there's no accident damage or paint chipping, then the cars just don't rust. As long as you are wary with the car in the winter, there is no reason that a 924S/944 cannot be every bit as reliable as a Honda of comparabl age.

4) Not on a track you mean.

5) Get a Craftsman "mechanic's" set. No sense not having the basics. A pair of Vise-Grips is also good to have. You don't "need" the tools, but it's always nice to be able to take care of the small stuff.

6) Not that I know of, but separation is _not_ inevitable. Just be sure to _never_ slam the hatch down and never lower/raise it by just one corner. Lift at both corners and lower the same way, gently pushing down above the latch-pins to secure it.

7) Buy the best that you can afford. You'll end up about the same money-wise, but buying a nice car will be a lot less hassle.

What would I have done differently? I would have not bought the one I did. All the good signs were there, but I had a bad vibe and I ignored it. The PO was a divorced woman who had only bought the car because she wanted to rub it in her ex-husband's face that his alimony bougt the red Porsche he had always wanted. My $3,000 924S is currently a $6,000 car and it's sitting while the clutch gets replaced. In contrast, I bought the 914 for $3,600 and so far I have only put about $500 into it with the $350 for my new Fuel Injection system being the majority of that.

Aaron

Roger Hall · 05-27-2003, 04:52 PM

The term ripped off is relitive, but if you plan on taking it to the mechanic often it gets expensive. If you are willing to work on the car youself buy one. If you plan on taking it to the mechanic often I might reconsider the purchase.

Apache · 05-27-2003, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Roger Hall
The term ripped off is relitive, but if you plan on taking it to the mechanic often it gets expensive. If you are willing to work on the car youself buy one. If you plan on taking it to the mechanic often I might reconsider the purchase.

In my case I will stick with the term "ripped off". Considering that I was charged for work that was not performed and random part replacements that did nothing to cure a specific problem, I don't know of any other term to use.

I want to thank everyone for their input and assistance. I will swing by Sears and pick up some decent "Craftsman" tools. I know that they are not Snap-Ons, but I'm sure they will do for my modest needs. Would springing for the official factory shop manuals be a waste of money?

I think I also have gotten a line on a Porsche mechanic as well. I started calling the for sale adds in my area for various model Porsches and started asking who does their service. Out of six people that I contacted, four were getting their Porsches serviced by a local mechanic named Matthias. Some of them had been going to him for many many years with their cars and everyone was very positive about him. Some did mention that his hourly rate was a bit high, but all of them said he was very competent and was quite honest. I guess that is about all you can ask of a mechanic.

Does anybody know what a fair rate would be for a Timing belt change or a clutch job so I can compare with his cost when I try to speak with him tomorrow?

Thank you again everybody. I REALLY appreciate the help!

Rot 911 · 05-27-2003, 06:38 PM

No matter what you get, 924 or 944, you will have purchased one of the best Audi's made at the time!

Apache · 05-27-2003, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kurt V
No matter what you get, 924 or 944, you will have purchased one of the best Audi's made at the time!

I guess they learned from the mistakes they made on the 911 series.

Nabeel · 05-27-2003, 07:58 PM

Hehe, its nice to see a newbie with a sense of humor. Welcome aboard!

AaronM · 05-27-2003, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Apache
I want to thank everyone for their input and assistance. I will swing by Sears and pick up some decent "Craftsman" tools. I know that they are not Snap-Ons, but I'm sure they will do for my modest needs. Would springing for the official factory shop manuals be a waste of money?

Does anybody know what a fair rate would be for a Timing belt change or a clutch job so I can compare with his cost when I try to speak with him tomorrow?

Thank you again everybody. I REALLY appreciate the help!

Actually, there really is not much of a difference between Craftsman and Snap-On. Sure Snap-On is better, but it's not better in proportion to the price difference. I've always had great luck with Craftsman, I've broken a few 1/4 inch drive rachets (you can't put any torque on those bloody things) and Sears has replaced them with new rachets no questions asked.

I've not had to do a timing belt yet (coming up in 20,000 miles) but I've heard from many people that it's in the neighborhood of $600. A little more if the water pump is changed at the same time.

The clutch I can definitely answer for. I spent about $550 on parts (clutch disc, pressure plate, throw-out bearing, pilot bearing, release lever shaft bearings, and flywheel seal) and the labor estimate is 12-16 hours. I attempted to do the job myself in a barn without much room under the car and I can tell you right now that I do not consider labor for a clutch job of about $1,000 to be at all excessive. Depending on the deal you can get on parts and on what ancillaries need to be replaced a clutch job could run between $1,300 (cheap, very cheap) to $1,700+.

Aaron

AaronM · 05-27-2003, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kurt V
No matter what you get, 924 or 944, you will have purchased one of the best Audi's made at the time!

I love my Audi 924S, it goes very well with my VW 914.

In all honesty, the 924S is too much of a Porsche. At least the 914 has VW prices for componants.

Aaron

AFJuvat · 05-27-2003, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kurt V
No matter what you get, 924 or 944, you will have purchased one of the best Audi's made at the time!

and actually, only the 924 used the Audi engine, the 944 was entirely Porsche design.

AFJuvat

Moneyguy1 · 05-27-2003, 11:13 PM

AF...

If I were Porsche, I would try to keep that last item our little secret

Seriously, I had a 1977 924 for close to ten years. Never had a problem I couldn't resolve in minutes. Gutless, yes...cheap to keep up, ditto. Great little car. When I finally bought the 944, I was not totally prepared for the special care the engine required. In the 924, coming home late one night I dropped a timing belt. Always carried a spare. Pushed the car into a plaza supermarket under a light and in less than an hour I was back on the road. Ain't gonna happen with the '44!! That engine was virtually indestructable. The only weak spot I found was a two wire connector to the rear placed distributor that was not available as a separate part and I had to fabricate one when the original fell apart from years of heat cycling. It is only my opinion, but there are a number of things Porsche could have done with the 944 engine/transmission design to make the owner's life a little easier...For a list of these changes, all we have to do is look at the last 100 or so postings.

But, we love 'em despite their flaws......

Apache · 05-27-2003, 11:53 PM

These posts are pretty educational (for me anyways), please keep 'em coming.

Rot 911 · 05-28-2003, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Nabeel
Hehe, its nice to see a newbie with a sense of humor. Welcome aboard!

I agree! Welcome back to the Porsche Family. My first Porsche was a 924 that got more abuse from me than any car had a right to put up with. I agree with what the other posters have said regarding learning to do as much work as you can yourself. While Snap On is a great brand, my Craftsman tools have held up very well. Some are over 20 years old and still going strong.

fty · 05-28-2003, 10:57 AM

WELCOME BACK.....!!!!!!!