help! rear end noise
 

Hey all,

need some advice here... got a rear end noise in my '88 NA... sounds exactly like a bad CV joint, well I crawled underneath and I can't localize it, it's dark out, will jack up tomorrow and take a look, here's the deal - I *need* a car on Monday, if it's a CV I can handle it, but the tranny output flanges feel pretty sloppy, if I can't localize it I'm going to have to punt and borrow a car. Is it possible for the tranny to make a noise that sounds like a bad CV? It clicks rhythmically with wheel speed and amplitude is directly proportional to load. If it's not possible to fix tomorrow I need to get on a Greyhound to PA ASAP because my mom already has an old VW she wants to give me I just have to go get it, I can't wait for a tranny problem to be repaired and I don't have enough $$ to rent a car.

thanks,

nate

Sounds like a bad CV. What do you mean by the output flanges being sloppy? Is there free play in them? Evidence of fluid leakage?

AFJuvat

no evidence of leakage, but there is a good 1/16" or so of up/down play in them. I know the tranny has been living on borrowed time, it howls like a banshee, I was hoping to run it until it died. Unfortunately, I don't know if it died or not.

I do know where you're going with that line of questioning though, I had that happen to me on a Scirocco. I bought the car for like $900 and on the 20 mile drive home it went from fine to "CV going bye bye now." Post mortem revealed a CV boot full of gear oil and a toasted CV.

nate

well there is no place to get a halfshaft or CV joint on a Sunday around here, so I got a loan of an old F-150 for the week and will be dropping the car off at the repair shop.

I really hate it when I can't fix stuff myself, but I guess if it is a halfshaft I will have them fix the A/C at the same time.

If it's the tranny you guys may be offered a "parts car" for sale (not really, but I don't feel like buying a new tranny - it is my daily driver and the motor, suspension, etc. is good - a lot of new parts)

nate

Base on this statement, I would guess that the bearing for the differential carrier is shot and needs replacement. If you have let it go too long, you will either need to rebuild your trans (if you're lucky enough not do have damaged the case) or purchase a used or rebuilt trans.

gb

yeah George I know the tranny is the weak link in this car. I was hoping to nurse it along until I get another car (as soon as I can pick it up) and then get it fixed right but things don't always work out like you plan do they? It'll be in the hands of the pros tomorrow morning, I guess I will decide what I'm doing with it from there.

nate

Hey Nate, sorry to hear about your troubles. If you do end up parting it out, how much might you want for the old trans? It sounds like a perfect candidate for my rebuild learning experience.

Nate, you have a PM.

I don't want to part the car out, I would rather sell it whole as a parts car and let someone else do it. Mostly because I have nowhere to part out a car...

nate

Update: I called the shop this AM and they found the car and my note (I didn't think until after I dropped it off that they might be taking the week off for Xmas, fortunately that is not the case) unfortunately it snowed here last night (!?!?!?!?!) and their parking lot is frozen and they apparently are having trouble getting the cars out of the parking lot and into the shop. So who knows when I will even know if I'm right about what's wrong with the thing or when I'll get it back.

And, of course, I'm driving my friend's 2WD F-150. Joy. And I'm scheduled at a secure government site from 4 to midnight tonight. And I just realized that my friend has a "Veterans for Kerry" bumper sticker on his beater truck. This should be fun.

when it rains, it freezes apparently.

nate

how much are going to sell for if the tranny goes? Im down about an hour South of Waldorf so I might be interested

still haven't gotten an estimate from the shop yet, so I don't know whether I'm going to fix or not.

Send me an email with your contact info to njnagel at comcast dot net if you are really interested. I was thinking of asking 4K for the car before this happened just for reference.

nate

update: good news/bad news

good: they found that the racket the A/C was making was a busted bolt in a tensioner or something. Bill was silly cheap.

bad: they claim they couldn't hear the noise that sounded like a CV joint. Of course, after I picked the car up, it's blatantly obvious. Accelerating up a hill from a stop, it's pretty scary sounding. Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over? Are you guys so deaf from riding in aircooleds that you can't hear the car trying to rip itself apart?

I am ASSuming it's a CV joint... I sure hope so... going to try to find a cheap reman halfshaft and see if that makes the problem go away.

nate

I feel your pain, my Porsche brother.


"We didn't hear/feel the problem you described when we test drove the car, sir" = "We don't want to bother with that s%$t right now. Take it somewhere else".

I had a dealer do this with a power window problem once. I got the hint.


Regardless, it sounds like a bad CV. But you'll find out soon enough.

I don't think the shop has an attitude problem, I haven't been there in something like 6 months but they were totally cool and the mechanic remembered my '62 Daytona and asked me about it etc. etc. etc. I think they are just overwhelmed (their lot was PACKED today, I have seen swap meets with fewer Porsches show up) and probably took it for a 2 block test drive. My theory is that they threw the car up on the lift first and in the process of wiggling stuff around "set" the axle shaft so the CVs were a little out of their normal groove, so the noise didn't come back until I'd driven it a couple miles. They are cool, they actually offered to buy me a halfshaft so I could install it myself because I was having no luck finding a parts store that could get one for me - my usual source said that I'd have to give them mine to rebuild because their supplier was out of cores, that idea is a non-starter, but of course the P-car shop won't be open again until Monday...

Guess it's back to the borrowed pickup :( (sniffle)

nate

OK here's where I'm at now... Pelican has the CV joints for like $90 a piece, I'm thinking it might just be best to have them overnight me a pair of CV joints and break out the snap ring pliers. I really hate rebuilding axles... :(

Can anyone tell me what size cheesehead bit I'm going to need? I can't find my set to save my life right now... hope I can lay my hands on my Oetiker clamp pliers too... I really have to organize my tools one of these days (two roll cabinets and I still have crap in boxes in the shed...)

nate

thinking out loud again here... I'm fairly sure the loud joint is on the right side of the car. ISTR a, um, frugal old VW owner telling me once that he could get extra life out of his CV joints by swapping them side to side so they'd run backwards for half their life. They'd get REAL sloppy but could take more miles before they actually started to make noise.

So what does this have to do with Porsches you ask? well, I need a car to get around... there are zero local sources for parts for a Porsche that will be open over the holiday (and actually none to speak of at all) here's what I'm thinking, since the CV joints are all the same, why couldn't I just take the right axle out and then put it in backwards? Wouldn't even have to do the snap ring thing like my overly parsimonious friend. That should surely get me by until next weekend unless something is completely FUBAR? with any luck I should be able to do that in my driveway with a bare minimum of tools, no?

can someone tell me why this wouldn't work?

thanks

nate

I've done it on my car, bought me about an extra 6 months before the growl and clunking came back.
I swapped inside for outside when I switched my cv shafts, it made the bearings ride on a slightly different place, and got me quite a bit of time. However, on disassembly, they were absolutely shot.

The surprising part, is that the noise came from the right side, but it was in great shape, the left side was bad.

I bought a pair of rebuilt CV's for a VW T4 van, for about $160CDN for both, and just swapped the CV joints over to my shafts, and repacked with Mobil 1 synthetic cv grease.

They made a whine/growl for about a week, until the joints kind of broke in, and they've been whisper quiet for the 3000km's since.

thanks for the reply. I went ahead and swapped the right side axle end for end, and when I removed it I saw that it looked like water had gotten into the joints somehow. They both still had grease in them but the grease was streaked with red like something had rusted and then worn. I took some grease and just shoved it in the end of the joint and then installed the axle backwards from the way it was, test drive (fairly vigorous, I ran it up to about 85 on the highway and then when I got close to home did a full throttle run from a start up a steep hill) revealed no noise. Hopefully this will last me a week or two at least.

Just curious, why is it so hard to find rebuilt axle assemblies? Are the shafts themselves becoming scarce?

nate

just curious Zero10, were the VW CVs an exact interchange? do you have a part number for them? I have both ETKA and PET running on my computer so I can cross reference to shop for price.

thanks

nate