New Owner and Newbie to Porsche

[Tressa]

I bought a 1984 944 about three weeks ago. It runs great, and no problems until yesterday. In 90+ degree weather I filled the tank, and immediately smelled gas, sill smells some, but is dissipating. Also after returning from work(about 20 mi) several med sized spots on the driveway directly underneath, and toward the front middle.
I am not a under the hood savvy girl, but have a friend who can help, or should I take it to a shop?
The PO is a friend of my helper, and took very good care of the car, but I was intrigued at the fact that this started on the two hottest most humid days, or is this coincidence?

[mikepellegrini]

Welcome to the world of 944 ownership! They really are great, fun cars.

The gas tanks on the early 944's had a weakness - when they stamped the top sheetmetal portion of the tank, they were a little too rough and as a result, many of the early tanks leak - kinda in the top, center,

Your car may or may not have this exact problem - there are other possibilities. But this is the most likely. Basically it's a relatively common manufacturing defect.

Here's a picture of the tank from my 83 NA:



The red circle shows the area of the leak; the arrows show the path of the gas as it dripped.

Another link with a great explanation of the problem: http://www.944online.com/cgi-bin/forum/forum.cgi?board=944tech;action=display;num=1227634 866

There is no easy fix. The only way is to take the tank out and to do that, you have to first take out the transaxle.

I took mine out myself and got a radiator shop to weld it for $100. If you had a shop do the whole job, I'd think it would be relatively big bucks.

Here are the pertinent part from Clark's Manual: Transaxle Removal and Installation Once the transxle is removed, you have to disconnect the fuel filler tube and venting hoses and gauge wires; then undo the two straps and the tank can come out. A 2-3 hour job for someone who is inexperienced; a shop with knowledgeable personnel and the proper tools could probably halve that time.

It's more likely to smell bad on hot days probably because gas is highly volatile.

A temporary (and not very safe) solution is to run with your tank close to empty.

[Endat]

Couldnt you try coating the tank with rubberized car undercoat stuff? I know its not a good fix but wouldnt it at least stop the leaks?

[James Chimney]

Welcome Tressa and good luck with your 944, you will find some great suggestions here as I too am new to Porsche 944 owner ship 7 weeks. I use to work in a radiator shop and they can weld the tank (In most cases) but you have to take it out. if you are going that way maybe a used tank and just swap them out?
I like doing my own work but a gas tank removal might be a bit much for even most, shade tree mechanics. try a regular mechanic It does not need to be a Porsche shop or if you friend feels up to it. try to run the tank down to empty before doing this, as a full tank will make this very hard.

[ddbach]

Here's one on Craig's list:
ORIGINAL PORSCHE 944 GAS TANK
You could have the welding done on this one and then swap them.

Now's the time to learn to do at least some of the basics of car care or the 944 will become increasingly expensive and less fun. My brother is helping me relearn my forgotten skills and add new ones (at a faster rate than either of us had planned). It's very satisfiying to fix something yourself. The guys here are a great resource.

[Tressa]

Thanks for the info and the welcome. To be honest, I've never had a previously owned vehicle, and am somewhat of a girlie girl, but after buying this car, I want to learn. I am inspired to restore this car as much as possible, and I have good bones to work with. My friend is a muscle car fanatic, and has a custom garage decked out for his own use, so I am going to "persuade" him to teach me.
I am an artist by profession, and for some reason, in this car, I saw the beauty.

[John_AZ]

Originally Posted by Endat

Couldnt you try coating the tank with rubberized car undercoat stuff? I know its not a good fix but wouldnt it at least stop the leaks?

NO.

The gas will act as a solvent and the undercoating and gas will drip on the garage floor when the car is parked with a full tank.

The gas leak could ignite if the fumes or raw gas comes in contact with a spark or hot exhaust.

John

[rporzio]

Welcome Tressa...! I've belonged to this group for awhile and have found the people to be extremely helpful, and have made some real nice friends here in Florida. Ralph

[Tressa]

Ok, no igniting pleeze, lol.
I have driven the car quite a bit, and filled the tank a couple of times, but this is the first time the smell appeared. I did read somewhere on here the key lock gas cap is not too reliable, and could it be a bit too much went in the tank?

I also am puzzled why the oil leak appeared, as there was none before. We are going to check it out this weekend.

[rrwebster]

Welcome Tressa,

you did find a real beauty there. I like it. the oil leaks could be because the PO had an additive in the oil to slow them down and it's broken down a bit. I know with mine it was leaking horribly when I first bought it. I added some stop leak and it slowed them down a lot but it's not a lasting fix.

Good luck!

Robert

[mikepellegrini]

Originally Posted by John_AZ

NO.

The gas will act as a solvent and the undercoating and gas will drip on the garage floor when the car is parked with a full tank.

The gas leak could ignite if the fumes or raw gas comes in contact with a spark or hot exhaust.

John

They do make somewhat similar stuff specifically for gas tanks - I've seen my dad do that to a bike tank. I found a site that sells the stuff - I'll see if I can find the links.

The problem is that to properly coat the tank you have to roll it and roll it and roll it all around to coat the inside evenly and on something like this, that'd be tough.

The stuff was also pretty expensive - sells in pints when you'd need a gallon perhaps for one of these tanks.

[John_AZ]

Yes and Permatex makes a putty for holes in gas tanks--sold in a tube. It is THE best I have found that will stick to the tank and stop the leak. It would last a couple of years.

BUT, the tank has to be removed to get at the weak spot with either material.

So no matter what fix is used, it may as well be the brazing weld for a permanent fix.

With the tank removed, you can replace all of the rubber gas and vapor lines at the same time.

GL
John

[rickharrison]

Did you say gas was leaking or just oil?

Gas fumes can come from a faulty breather/ventilation hose near the filler neck. (under rear carpet)

[ernie9944]

Originally Posted by Tressa

I bought a 1984 944 about three weeks ago. It runs great, and no problems until yesterday. In 90+ degree weather I filled the tank, and immediately smelled gas, sill smells some, but is dissipating. Also after returning from work(about 20 mi) several med sized spots on the driveway directly underneath, and toward the front middle.
I am not a under the hood savvy girl, but have a friend who can help, or should I take it to a shop?
The PO is a friend of my helper, and took very good care of the car, but I was intrigued at the fact that this started on the two hottest most humid days, or is this coincidence?

.

BUT, the tank has to be removed to get at the weak spot with either material.

So no matter what fix is used, it may as well be the brazing weld for a permanent fix.

With the tank removed, you can replace all of the rubber gas and vapor lines at the same time.

GL
John[/QUOTE] ______________________Welcome the the crazy world of P cars owners & congrats on your car Tressa,having own an 83 for 26 years I feel close to you ,early car when well sort out are one of the most pleasurable Porsche to drive around, having a manual steering migth be a little hard on the arms muscles but road feeling is fantastic,I'm with John for the braze weld like he said it will be a permanent fix.Sending an example of a weld done on an early 944 tank, John should remember that one & migth be able to link to this tread.

[mikepellegrini]

The Eastwood company makes a lot of good stuff including gas tank sealers. But like you said, the tank still has to come out. And welding is really easier and more permanent.

Eastwood Company: Search Results for gas tank

Btw, that's a really great looking car, Tressa. My favorite color by a landslide. Congrats!

[AA_Ezra]

Used a gas tank kit from permatex i belive and it was basicaly a fiberglass and resin and it worked great and was black so it matched my tank....but my tank had a nose half the size of a pea because of an amp instalation ( done before i had the car)

[ERAU944]

beautiful car! Gemini grey is a fantastic color.

everyone is spot on with the gas tank repairs - get your friend to help you tear into it and take the tank to a radiator shop and get the repair done properly.

what's your location? i'm sure there'd be more than a few on the board willing to help out with the repairs.

one other thing you might want to look into:

your car has wheels that are two different sizes. 7" wide wheels for the front, and 8" wide wheels for the rear, and they are all 15" in diameter. that picture of the driver's side shows the 8" wide wheel on the front and the 7" wide on the rear. this is a common occurrence when people take their cars to the shop, and the mechanics don't know there are two different sizes (and sometimes the owner's don't either). you can see an extra ridge in the lip of the 8" wheel.

i was p*ssed when my dad got new tires on his car, and the shop made this mistake. not such a big deal if you don't have directional tires, but his did, and they installed both 8" wheels on the left.

[John_AZ]

Not sure if this is the thread earnie9944 was referring to:

Gas fumes? Tank leaks? Read this.

It could just be the fuel sender seal??
928 AUSTRALIA - Tech Tips - Fuel smell in the car

GL
John

[ernie9944]

^^You nail it rigth on the head John that the one ,thanks

[James Chimney]

Teresa, If you do not have a spot of gas on the ground/garage floor then as stated it might be the over flow hose that came off (same on my car but it got water down into the passenger side rear wheel well), lift out the rear cargo matt and the remove the rug buttons (go slow and use some thing that gets under both sides of these buttons) and one phillips screw and remove the passenger side carpet. Once the rug is off the side wall you will see a plastic hose running from the bottom up to a "Y", one goes to the sun roof drain (if you have a sun roof) and the other is to the gas over flow, follow it up by running your hand gently along the hose and make sure the hose is connected, (maybe pour 1/2 cup of water into the over flow of the gas fill area and make sure it flows out under neath and not into the trunk area), if it is disconnected or holds water the metal tube might be clogged (as mine was), I had a hard time re installing this metal 90 degree tube back into the rubber flange that is the base/start of the over flow system, every time I tried to put it in it pushed the rubber base/start down into the truck area (I started the tube and hooked up the 1st piece of down tube and then gave it a little bit of WD-40 and it will snap, more like seal/seat into a grove in the rubber base) once in, I reconnected the hose to the "Y", problem fixed, this was on my 85.5 944 but it might be the same on yours which is beautiful,
these cars have a beautiful/classic appeal to a lot of people, I started looking for muscle cars (I love the old Mopar's) then thought an older 911 but 944's kept coming up on my used car search and when I took my first look and drive I was hooked I come from a 25 year back round in sport bike motorcycle riding and we had a saying "no one rides a motor cycle because they have to" that is more true here as "no one owns a 944 because they have to" It's love, if every time you step back and look at your car and others like it and you smile, you will be happy for a very long time