968 springs

[mueller944s2]

Ok so I've complained a lot about how my S2 rides like a rock..well I test drove a 968 yesterday and it was MUCH smoother! I read that it has softer springs which made it a more comfortable ride. My question, can they bolt on to my S2? I'm already running Koni's. And where would I find them?

[J1NX3D]

how new was the suspension in the 968 :P

[flash968]

nope - the 968 and S2 both use the same 160# springs on the Turbo, shorter 160# springs on the M030, and 125# springs on the earlier ones.

ride feel is determined by the strut. sounds to me like you have your struts cranked up too high. people do that all the time. for stock S2 springs, you should not be much beyond about half way on the strut adjuster

contrary to popular misconception, struts and shocks do NOT make the suspension stiffer. they only dampen the motion of the spring. if you crank them up beyond what the spring wants, you get "jacking". it may "feel" stiffer, but in reality you have taken away the ability of the spring to do its job.

[mueller944s2]

Are you sure? The book was saying something about softer springs. So same thing?

Now about the strut adjustment, I have it turned all the way over to what's supposed to be its softest setting. Are you saying that if it's midway it'll ride softer?

nope - the 968 and S2 both use the same 160# springs on the Turbo, shorter 160# springs on the M030, and 125# springs on the earlier ones.



ride feel is determined by the strut. sounds to me like you have your struts cranked up too high. people do that all the time. for stock S2 springs, you should not be much beyond about half way on the strut adjuster



contrary to popular misconception, struts and shocks do NOT make the suspension stiffer. they only dampen the motion of the spring. if you crank them up beyond what the spring wants, you get "jacking". it may "feel" stiffer, but in reality you have taken away the ability of the spring to do its job.

[ernie9944]

The 968s Struts/Springs will fit both S2 & 951,the springs alone won't fit on a 951 but will on a S2.The 968s springs are smaller in diameter then the 951 probably to allow for wider front wheels. When the first owner of my car bougth it brand new with a very low mileage on it he decided to beef her up with VA 968 springs & adjustable Bilstein Struts couple to a M030 front Stab bar, rear was also beef up with M030 stab bar & HD Bilstein.So the OEM springs/shocks are almost brand new & still around and has been store in my garage for the pass three years,just to say _mueller944S2_ if you were not so far from me I'll gladly drop them on your door steps since I don't think I'll ever have any use for them.

[flash968]

are you sure you have it on the soft setting? the strut adjuster turns backwards.

re the spring fitment, the 944S2 turbo uses the same part number as the 968. the M030 version of both the 968 and the S2 use the same progressive spring, which is different than the standard version. the early S2 uses a softer, thinner, and longer spring. these are all US versions. the club sports are shorter.

[ernie9944]

Lol never mine me just dropping them on your door steps, I just check the price on those suckers Struts alone range from $260.00/$295.00 each,springs I could not find a replacement OEM 968 spring.The only one available in my search are here on Pelican it's a 1" lowering spring quote at $183.00 each.

[ernie9944]

Originally Posted by flash968

are you sure you have it on the soft setting? the strut adjuster turns backwards.

re the spring fitment, the 944S2 turbo uses the same part number as the 968. the M030 version of both the 968 and the S2 use the same progressive spring, which is different than the standard version. the early S2 uses a softer, thinner, and longer spring. these are all US versions. ( the club sports are shorter.)

+1 mine with CS springs.

[mueller944s2]

So one of y'all said they're different and the other said they're the same. I'm lost.

Watcha mean it turns backwards? Turned one way it's stiff the other it's soft, unless I'm missing something. Mines turn as far as it can go in the soft direction.

Thank goodness I don't need new struts! I think mine are warrantied so I'll just get them rebuilt, they're 10 years old now.

[ernie9944]

[QUOTE=mueller944s2;7321249]So one of y'all said they're different and the other said they're the same. I'm lost.

Like you I was lost so and went ask knowledgable peoples & the 968 OEM front Struts/Springs combo will fit your S2, not that it matter since you have adjustable struts,now if your springs rate was change to adapt to those struts no way you gone to have the smooth ride of an 968 OEM combo don't matter what you do.This is one thing peoples should understand,when you start fooling around with ajustable front suspension-coil over rear -bigger stabs & lowering so that the car will have more grip/less lean ect ect they pretty well have given away the ride quality which the OEM suspension was design for.So it a give up either you suffer a harsher ride or you go back OEM you can't have both

[flash968]

the part numbers are in both the workshop manual, and the PET. i checked both before posting to be sure i was right.

by backwards i mean that normally you turn things clockwise to tighten or stiffen them. koni struts turn counterclockwise to stiffen (though oddly their yellow shocks turn clockwise). if they are indeed on full soft, and you still find them jarring, then they are likely jammed.

as a side note, i read that last post 3 times, and i tried, but i STILL couldn't quite make heads or tails of it. i don't pretend to read or write french because i would do a piss poor job and make no sense. i think a better translator is needed. i'm pretty sure ernie was trying to say that everything works together, and shock and strut settings need to be made for the springs chosen, and that the rule of thumb is that you give up some ride comfort to gain handling improvement.

[J1NX3D]

Originally Posted by ernie9944

The only one available in my search are here on Pelican it's a 1" lowering spring quote at $183.00 each.

i asked Pelican about these awile ago. they are unable to say what the spring rate is.

[ernie9944]

Originally Posted by flash968

as a side note, i read that last post 3 times, and i tried, but i STILL couldn't quite make heads or tails of it. i don't pretend to read or write french because i would do a piss poor job and make no sense. i think a better translator is needed. i'm pretty sure ernie was trying to say that everything works together, and shock and strut settings need to be made for the springs chosen, and that the rule of thumb is that you give up some ride comfort to gain handling improvement.

Once more as in the past sorry I got you confuse with my Moliere language,but it's exactly what I mean all suspension parts install should work together including wheels/ tires & by installing a different suspension than the OEM one you are loosing ride (quality/comfort in order to gain handling improvement).Simple you can't have both, notice that I use your own words so that your grey matter will be able to absorbe more easily what I'm saying.

[flash968]

no worries - like i said, your english is a lot better than my french.

it's things like you used "loosing" when it's "losing". loosing would be to make something less tight. losing would indicate a loss. i'm surprised the translator did that.

it's bad enough that people here constantly use the wrong "too", "two" or "to", or "there", "they're", or "their", and i've come to expect a general lack of education of the masses, but i really had a problem with that post. maybe i was just really tired last night.

by the way, you can have both ride quality and performance. you just can't use koni yellows, or any gas shock or strut for that matter. it's going to cost you a fair amount of money, but it can be done. i've lost little to no ride quality, but dramatically improved the handling and cornering. i've easily got $20k into my suspension though.

[Gawernator]

Fuch it dude, Koni yellow gas dampers feel great when you're young. Soon though I will become old like flash968 and spend thousands on double adjustable hydraulic struts LOL

[flash968]

funny how that happens. for 20 years, i drove an mgb with 750# coils and 630# leafs. i just put up with the ride. now though, at least with this car, i don't have to do that. i tried the koni yellows, and didn't hate them. i just found stuff that is better.

[Grandad#3]

Ernie, I made out just fine what you were trying to get across, but then I read all your write-ups. To butt or not to butt. All I care about now is how my back feels after I get out of my car. Even that is sometimes a struggle getting out of these low riders.

Cheers,
Larry

[ernie9944]

Originally Posted by Grandad#3

Ernie, I made out just fine what you were trying to get across, but then I read all your write-ups. To butt or not to butt. All I care about now is how my back feels after I get out of my car. Even that is sometimes a struggle getting out of these low riders.

Cheers,
Larry

Well Larry that is exactly what I meant,it all depend what you want from your car.If ride quality is your priority then keep the suspension stock if not then go & mods the hell out of it, but it's something you'll have to live with on a daily basis.Yes I agree with Flash that you can improve handling & cornering while keeping a certain kind of comfort,but at which cost. Peoples here that can afford a $20k suspension let say you can count them on your fingers(and you can cut nine of them off so there is only one left ) doesn't make any sense due to our cars value.Btw hope I didn't make any spelling mistakes in this reply lol.

[mueller944s2]

Here's where I'm at. I think I need new shocks because it's bouncing a few times when I bounce it with my knee. I'll buy 951 shocks instead of S2 because they're a direct fit and 1/3 the price. I did the trailing arm bushings and spring plate bushings last summer as well as raised it back to stock height. I think the control arm rubber is roughly 10 years old as well as the Konis, but I talked to my dad and he said they really weren't much different at all from the OEM. I'm 22 so I really don't mind a harsh ride, but I know my car does and these frequent rattles popping up are driving me nuts! I put on yokohamas which helped the ride a lot, but still it's riding like a rock. My dad's 911s (as well as that 968) feel like cadillacs with an air ride compared to mine. I know it can't be normal for 951s/S2s because if it were there wouldn't be any left on the road due to the fact that they would've all been shaken to pieces.

[mueller944s2]

Flash, would you mind listing what all you've done to your suspension? I'm curious.