Advice on buying first 928 (Please)

wannaownone · 03-29-2009, 08:34 AM

Hey - I am looking to buy my first Porsche and I am interested in a 928. After looking around (in Toronto, Canada) I have found a few that seem to be in good condition. I am not a mechanic so I am looking for a good condition car that I can drive every day. The one that seems to interest me the most so far is:

1988 Porsche 928 S4 Automatic
132K KM
no accident - it has new tires , Radiator , steering Bump , Brakes New Timing Belt & Water Pump.

They are asking $13,750 CDN for it.

I'm wondering:
1) sound like a decent deal?
2) What should I be most concerned about checking out on this car before buying.

Thanks,

Danglerb · 03-29-2009, 09:14 AM

If I lived in Canada I would buy a Japanese import, very often low mileage very nice cars. (but like all 928, may need a fair investment to bring maintenance up to date)

OTOH when buying a used 928 in Canada, watch out for someone selling a Japanese market 928. Not that its bad, but much of the resale value for a Canadian market car is that it can easily be sold and imported to the USA, and a Japanese market car cannot, so the price should be less.

Two things are most important when shopping for a 928;

Find the car you really want, drive a few, look at the colors and interiors, compare auto and 5 spd, and chances are good you will have some strong preferences. Best to find them out prior to buying.

Have a PPI done. Pre purchase inspection, by someone very knowledgeable not just in Porsche, but with LOTS of experience with the 928. Proper inspection take a good mechanic 2 or 3 hours, but I would not recommend buying a 928 without one, and discussion of value is also a bit meaningless prior to the PPI.

Given todays market, it was have to be an exceptional car at that price.

wannaownone · 03-29-2009, 11:13 AM

Thanks Danglerb,

I have found a good mechanic who services a number 928's - his client love him so that's a good sign. I would absolutely have a PPI done.

Regarding mileage, does this really matter as much as the condition of the car. This one is 132k KM (82k miles). I suspect the engine is good for hundreds of k's? From the cars I have looked into, the low KM cars at low prices are all in rough shape and the low KM cars in good shape are really expensive collector/show cars (GTS types). Being in Canada seems to mean a fairly limited selection of cars.

Looking on line, it seems that $10,000 - $15,000 is the range for well maintained 928's? Am I looking in the wrong place ;-)

Danglerb · 03-29-2009, 04:39 PM

Post your mechanics name and maybe he will get more love?

Price on a 928 isn't fair, the car if maintained lasts a VERY long time especially the motors, and the wrong owner can beat one to death in 20K miles. Never the less, mileage hits the price hard.

The market for 928's is TINY, so prices vary a huge amount, some from mileage or conditon, others for lack of marketing skills, or bad and good luck. $10k to $15k is the range, but only as the ASKING price, which few cars sell at. Someone asking $15k doesn't make $12k a good deal.

All that said, once you find the car you really want, its pointless to require more than a ok deal, maybe even a bad deal is good if the car you want is a bit on the rare side, unique color etc.

wannaownone · 03-29-2009, 06:03 PM

Thanks again Darnglerb,

The mechanic is Tweaks Performance 68 Chauncey in south Etobicoke (Toronto). Seem to have quite a loyal following.

I hope to be able to check out a few more cars this week. Is there a place that you know of to look for stock of 928's?

rhjames · rhjames's Garage

stock of 928's would be a singular entity.

eBay, autotrader, craig'slist, Hemming's, the 928 forums (for sale) are some of the places you can look.

Your price for that particular S4 is probably 6 g's high, maybe more--maybe less.

--Russ

Danglerb · 03-29-2009, 09:30 PM

If you can swing it, one of the up coming big regional things like SITM, Sharks in the mountains, link to video below.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sbql2OaKyBo

Do you have an idea of what you are looking for?

Daily driver, weekend fun car, insane weekend fun (aka track car), luxury night our ride, concourse entry, endowment for mechanics's college fund (aka project car, or track car).

Any sort of budget?

Favorite color?

Whats your dream 928?

Dean_Fuller · 03-30-2009, 06:02 AM

wannaownone,
My I ask a couple questions? You say you want one as a DD...will this be your only car? If so I truly think over time you will be very frustrated with being without a car while at the shop. Don't get me wrong...these are great cars but they are also 20 years old. Problem arises...take car to shop...problem diagnosed...3 or 4 days for parts to show up...another day or 2 for install. You maybe car less for a week on a simple problem. If thats okay with you then go for it!!! Main thing is don't wait for something to break. Preventative maintenance is a lot easier to schedule and budget plus its better for the car in the long run.

wannaownone · 03-30-2009, 07:00 AM

Danglerb and Dean_Fuller - similar questions you ask (to be read in a Yoda voice)

I don't have my heart set on one particular model year or colour. I just like the car and though it would be fun to start my introduction to my dream of owing a Porsche here with a 928 (ultimately I would like a 911 but too expensive right now and I do really like the 928 - always have).

I am interested in a car I can drive every day. I currently drive a 1991 LS400. It's pretty bullet proof but I do know the realities of having the car in the shop a bit more than a new car. My wife has a 'normal' car that we can share if needed although the novelty of that may wear off for her quickly.

I drive about 6km a day on a normal weekday. Weekends maybe 30km. Low mileage user. But I would really like to get into a Black or silver 928 when I do head out on my short trips!

I'd like to keep the budget to the $10k range but only if that will get me a car that is in good working condition. I don't want a project on the first one. Rather learn via regular maintenance.

Thanks again guys,

Danglerb · 03-30-2009, 10:08 AM

Buying a 928 because its the cheaper nice Porsche is the highway to oblivion. $10k will buy a nice S4, it will taking some sifting through the bad one, and skipping the higher asking prices, but its a doable thing. Expect to put another $5k in during the first year to bring maintenance up to date.

I think if you look at 5 year cost of ownership, buying, driving 5 years and selling, you may find a 911 is cheaper.

This may sound off the wall, but I'm going to suggest you consider the most reliable lowest cost model, a 1984 automatic. Purchase price will be half that of an S4, and you can spend the rest of your budget making it perfect interior etc.

SolReaver · 03-30-2009, 12:20 PM

You will also find better prices on the earlier models and auto T's. The 16V engines are less likely to smash valves due to timing belt failure. How much power do you really need? Some people are real happy with the OB's and love the K jet. The thing is there are several flavors of 928 to choose from and they all need some kind of work. Research it for a while. Take a look at a few of em. Please don't consider it a DD, at least for a while as there may be a few bugs to work out. Also...Sorry to point this out but the mileage is pretty poor. You would be better off with a more economical DD. Besides, you need to drive SOMETHING to and from the parts store.

I second the earlier, like an 84-85 model. They can be pretty dependable if maintained properly.

MPDano · MPDano's Garage

My Advice. Don't get a Euro if your in a state that requires smog. There are way too many US 928's that will eliminate any headaches I am currently going through with my 81 Euro in California. Don't get me wrong, I love my OB but if I can't drive it on the road than whats the point. And I don't need a track car.

wannaownone · 03-30-2009, 06:20 PM

You guys almost have me convinced on the Ford Taurus.

Sounds like a 928 as a daily driver is not a solid plan huh?

Aside from universal health care, lots of fresh water and low crime, what have we go up here in Canada. Not a huge selection of Porsche's to choose from!

Danglerb · 03-30-2009, 06:32 PM

Daily driver actually works best, you tend to keep it really well maintained, but that spare car for the times it tests your love make for a lasting relationship. Not sure a 928 would be my snow car either.

After owning a 928 for a few years you may develop a different point of view on a cheap late model car like the Taurus.

As a daily driver, do you have a safe place to park a 928?

DMRK · 03-30-2009, 07:42 PM

I think most Porsches make great daily drivers, as long as you maintain them. If you have the ability to do this yourself its not that bad. It is not good for your only mode of transportation however. I drive over 40 miles each way to work and I like it

. I even use the 944 in the winter as long as its not plowing snow. Alot better heaters than the air cooled cars IMO.

keep us updated on what you decide.

SolReaver · 08:13 PM

There are also places you don't want to go with a 928 and a DD gives you options. Mall parking lots, Places with lots of speed bumps, bad roads, bad neighborhoods. These are flagship Porsche cars from the 80's. They cannot haul a load of hay or take 4 adults in comfort. 928 owners are a fringe element amongst Porsche owners, and we all know what THOSE people are like...

You might want to "ease" into it with a 924 or 944. Sure, they aren't quite so neat, but, they are good training. Once you want more...you can go from half an engine to a full engine.

What do you like to do? I mean...What do you want to spend time fixing? Sooner or later you will have to do pretty much everything. How much time do you have? Garage space? Tools? What is your favorite Fuel infestation system? AT or stick? what is your favorite engine? 16 v 32 v? Displacement? Does AC really mean a lot to you? How much time do you have to devote to the car? (please note the word "devote", it is NOT accidental) will you be looking for a great paint job, or crawling under the car and looking at the engine first?

DMRK: I just did the HCore on my 924S, Darn that heat is good! The AC is Ice cold too! But, we are talking 928 here. Twice the engine, twice to 10 times the cost, twice to 8 times the difficulty, and about 3 to 6 times the Porsche reverse economic ratio (PRER). YMMV.

wannaownone · 03-31-2009, 05:42 PM

I live in the city and have a garage but not enough space for an extra car. I think I need to mull this over now that I am waking up in a cold sweat worrying that I am going to end up with a full time repair job on my hands if I don't vet the car properly.

Maybe I'll spend some weekends checking out cars and reading the forum to really educate myself. Thanks everyone for the valuable info!

SolReaver · 03-31-2009, 08:07 PM

Only room for one car? Worried about down time? Yea...you should probably run for cover. However, there are dependable ones out there. You would want to have all documents and such and have the hook ups to a good pro wrench.

911blex · 03-31-2009, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danglerb

This may sound off the wall, but I'm going to suggest you consider the most reliable lowest cost model, a 1984 automatic. Purchase price will be half that of an S4, and you can spend the rest of your budget making it perfect interior etc.

I agree with you 100% that a 1984 automatic is the most reliable and lowest operating cost 928 that exists as they had a lot of nice improvements over the early cars, but do not have the overly complex electronics or the dreaded interference motors that the later cars do. In my opinion, a 1984 automatic is the best of both worlds.

Cosmo Kramer · 04-09-2009, 07:40 AM

I have seen that car for sale for a while now, I think it is priced a little high. Are you set on an S4 or will an OB do you? Manual or auto? There are a few for sale around the GTA. There has been an 85 in Burlington that is a 5 speed one owner original with 69000 kms for about the same price. You can also keep an eye on Rennlist to see who is selling if you don't mind taking a trip to the US. Most of the cars there are enthusiast owned and well maintained. There are also lots of threads pointing to good deals that people see out there.

Other then that, if you do decide on this car, check for documentation for any repairs. When the TB and water pump were done, the tensioner should have been rebuilt as well. Check to see if the motor mounts are worn and listen for noise in the torque tube (whirring or tapping noise that increases with RPM). Check to make sure the heat and A/C work properly as it can be a bit of a bear to troubleshoot (ask me how I know)!