"Excellence" article values versus REALITY~

[Normy]

There is another thread started by harborman that talks about the annual fantasy article on the 928 in Excellence magazine. It is always fun to read, and it is neat to see that in the past few years my car has gone up in value about $1000.

But is that realistic?

Now, I know that the condition of a car makes a huge difference in its value, and the article's "condition" section is rather coarse: excellent, good, fair, poor, but it still makes me wonder what the general consensus is as to what percentage of the stated values is reality. For example, if his article rates my car as worth $11,000....what is the reality?

The answer I am interested in developing, from consensus....is an average percentage.

To start the debate, I'll add my personal opinioin: I suspect reality is between 85-90% of what the article states.

Again, there are plenty of variables that are not being brought into play here....such as ROW car versus USA car, which can make or break a deal, depending upon the buyer. We are just looking for a ballpark figure.

Thoughts?

N

[harborman]

Originally Posted by Normy

There is another thread started by harborman that talks about the annual fantasy article on the 928 in Excellence magazine. It is always fun to read, and it is neat to see that in the past few years my car has gone up in value about $1000.

But is that realistic?

Now, I know that the condition of a car makes a huge difference in its value, and the article's "condition" section is rather coarse: excellent, good, fair, poor, but it still makes me wonder what the general consensus is as to what percentage of the stated values is reality. For example, if his article rates my car as worth $11,000....what is the reality?

The answer I am interested in developing, from consensus....is an average percentage.

To start the debate, I'll add my personal opinioin: I suspect reality is between 85-90% of what the article states.

Again, there are plenty of variables that are not being brought into play here....such as ROW car versus USA car, which can make or break a deal, depending upon the buyer. We are just looking for a ballpark figure.

Thoughts?

N

Hope you read that article. Well it's all about demand and supply I guess. As time goes on fewer cars will be available in the market place. It would seem the bottom has hit on these for a good car, well maintained, original shape, well documented. I wish I had kept all the cars I owned, believe me!!!! So sorry I sold the Vette and Pantera way back when. Especially the Vette now worth $120K or more for the one I had. I fell into my 928S, just something I could not pass up. Such a deal I got and such a nice car. But, I like cars, always have.

[chuck z]

Don't even read the article any more. As far as values go; Fiction is a good word for them! Where do they come from? I've asked the question many times and NEVER gotten a straight answer! My guess is they GUESS....... If they actually tracked values they'd know that many cars, especially GTSs have sold for far more than the the values they've ever published. For example; the 6k 1994 GTS that sold for $92,500 or the 1995 GTS that sold for $102,500! There have been many other GTSs (mostly sold by Michael Willhoit) for far more then the values they report..... Michael tells me he has sent the info to Excellence and to Bruce Anderson and it NEVER gets published... Why not?

That article is good for the uninformed 928 enthusiast but anyone who follows values and keeps up with cars that have sold pretty much knows its bunk!

[chuck z]

N! You have a PM...........

[Landseer]

I don't know, Normy, not seeing your car.
But after living the 84,5,6 market for 2 years, I'd say that was pretty high.

We saw a bonafide 12,000 mile 85 auto sell for around $13K to a special afficiondo last summer after languishing for a year at higher prices.
Saw a 86.5 repaint (very nice_ with up to date maintenance but some interior wear, 130k Mi, 5 speed, go for $3700.
Both near my backyard.

My 86 auto came home to me, needing TB/WP/MM/ Brakes, but with 73K mi, last owner elderly/his for 22 years, for $2K delivered.
85, similar, one owner, less miles, but more deterioration from sitting, came for $1700 and the middleman made money. Both are rocket sleds.

These are drivers, all. Preserved, pampered, low mileage cars are a total different story I understand.

[dewolf]

928 prices here in Oz are starting their climb upwards. I think people are realizing that these were the flagship of the marque when new, for good reason. We are seeing 86's in very good condition go for AU$25k and 85's for between $20-25k. Good, and I mean good, 928's are becoming a very rare automotive commodity in Australia.
This one is of course overpriced but I expect he will get around $40k for it.

1980 PORSCHE 928 Private Cars For Sale in VIC - carsales.com.au

[Danglerb]

I think its kind of like coins, the mint 928's with low mileage and pristine condition are investment grade and trade with there own set of rules and prices.

I don't expect fixed up high mileage cars to change from the current money pit status anytime in the next couple of decades. We have rare cars, but buyers are even more rare for a bunch of VERY good reasons.

Corvettes had some unique model years, decades of thinning the herd, and that makes the remaining cars so valueable.

With a 928 we have 17 years of production that used the same chassis/body and almost everything is swapable, and pretty much every "unique" part is readily available, if not cheap.

*********************

Why not be happy that we can afford supercars, drive them and have fun, and ignore resale value?

[Normy]

I think one factor is WHERE it is marketed.

Marketed among us, or on eBay perhaps- a car like mine might do fairly well. Placed on a used car lot or parked at the local grocery store with a "For Sale" sign in the window? Probably not.

N

[MPDano]

Originally Posted by Normy

I think one factor is WHERE it is marketed.

Marketed among us, or on eBay perhaps- a car like mine might do fairly well. Placed on a used car lot or parked at the local grocery store with a "For Sale" sign in the window? Probably not.

N

I am thinking the opposite Normy. Marketed among us will bring you the lowest possible $$. eBay and a sign off the side of the road would fair better in my opinion. Most of us know better and we also know that we can always find the better deal. I can guarantee you that I an find a better $$ deal than what you want for your car right now. eBay and Grocery Market Parking Lot sales usually bring in those with not so much knowledge of the current market price. IMHO

[Landseer]

Good point, MP. I also paid $4500 for a max $1500 basket case. Impulse buy, local city newspaper, no research/knowledge of the subject.

[Normy]

Originally Posted by MPDano

I am thinking the opposite Normy. Marketed among us will bring you the lowest possible $$. eBay and a sign off the side of the road would fair better in my opinion. Most of us know better and we also know that we can always find the better deal. I can guarantee you that I an find a better $$ deal than what you want for your car right now. eBay and Grocery Market Parking Lot sales usually bring in those with not so much knowledge of the current market price. IMHO

You might be right, actually.

-About a month ago, I was getting in my car at [of all places, the Publix grocery store], and some guy with friend pulled up in a Mercedes and asked me what year the car was. "1985" I replied.

"Want to sell it?" He asked.

"Everything is for sale at the right price" I said, not too serious.

"What do you want for it?"

I thought for a second.

"I'd take $15,000" I said.

This is classic:

"Best I can do is $12,000"

What about that? That guy sounded serious, but the chances of a cashiers check for $12,000 showing up in my hand that afternoon? Come on! At the same time....an idiot like that that knew nothing about these cars, but saw something well-maintained and with fascinating lines and expensive name? You never know-

Nah. I'd never take advantage of someone like that~



N!

[Craig S.]

I agree with Danglerb about rare and in great condition. I think the Panamera will help drive interest in our old supercars. Is there any parallel to the 928s and Detroit's late 60s muscle cars?

[Mrmerlin]

dont forget the other part of the equation that is a lot of these cars are being grabbed up by people that have a tool box and are willing to open it .
when these cars were new most would just take it to the dealer and have it fixed, witness the 2,3 4 or 5K repair bills on the cars with records.
Now unless your willing to get your hands dirty most wouldnt own one

[Danglerb]

Originally Posted by Craig S.

I agree with Danglerb about rare and in great condition. I think the Panamera will help drive interest in our old supercars. Is there any parallel to the 928s and Detroit's late 60s muscle cars?

There is an overlap, and some did call the 928 a German Mustang or Camaro, but other than rough zero to sixty speed they have very little in common.

Muscle era cars are almost all pre 70's gas crisis cars, 1960 to 1973 or so, a good 12 years older than the bulk of 928's.

Huge factory and third party manufacturers support the old muscle cars, and we have Porsche high prices and a tiny handful of individuals that support the 928.

Typical is a 68 Camaro that belongs to a friend of Greg's and shows up in the shop from time to time. Purchase price was very good for what it was, but more than double what many similar condition early 928's go for. Its bonehead simple to work on this car, parts are cheap with many options, and it goes like stink even as a daily driver. OTOH the driving experience etc is nothing like a 928.

[tisilrad]

I can only see prices going up on the 928's with the possible 2 door panamera going on sale. There will probably be a lot of people who like the concept but will not be able to drop 120000$ for that car...the next best thing will be a 928 ..at 50000$. In any event we got a boost this weekend..the overall winner of the Dayton 24 hour race was a porsche...with a 5.0 liter v8!hahahahah...sound familiar.
For the record i paid 13500 for my 1987 928S4, but my car is a black on black 5 speed car with approx 85K miles...pretty much mint interior etc, but still a driver.

[harborman]

Originally Posted by tisilrad

I can only see prices going up on the 928's with the possible 2 door panamera going on sale. There will probably be a lot of people who like the concept but will not be able to drop 120000$ for that car...the next best thing will be a 928 ..at 50000$. In any event we got a boost this weekend..the overall winner of the Dayton 24 hour race was a porsche...with a 5.0 liter v8!hahahahah...sound familiar.
For the record i paid 13500 for my 1987 928S4, but my car is a black on black 5 speed car with approx 85K miles...pretty much mint interior etc, but still a driver.

I think they will go up in value. Keeping it as much stock and original I think will hold better value. I paid a lot less for mine but only because it was through a friend. I was very lucky to get it as the car is very, very clean and very low mileage and one owner. Not too many left with under 38,000 miles I would think for an 86.

[petrolblue83911]

Excellence I think get's their annual values from the prices they recieve paid during a given year, or prices they find that were paid during a given year.

[chuck z]

Originally Posted by petrolblue83911

Excellence I think get's their annual values from the prices they recieve paid during a given year, or prices they find that were paid during a given year.

Perhaps on the 911 models but, I don't think they get enough reports regarding 928 sales/purchases to provide them enough information on each year to know anything..... I see just a couple 928s in the magazine and most are junkers that are bought cheap.....

[Normy]

What is a car worth? It is worth what someone will pay for it.

-If Sheik Al Maktoum, the leader of Dubai suddenly decided that he ABSOLUTELY had to have the car that the Porsche internet personality known as "Normy" actually owns...then I would price the car at $10,000,000. That is ten million dollars. Since that is unlikely, I would probably tell him that there are plenty of GORGEOUS GTS's that are available at a song!

N!

[Landseer]

We've seen postings where some foreign oil baron cars with ridiculously low mileage trade for low money recently.