I hope this is not too much!!!!

[Mpierick]

I finally pulled the oil pan off. What do you think? Too much wear? I hope not!!!




What does everyone think?

I tried to measure the end play and it is .006 inches.

Thanks for your help.

[Pete R]

Obviously your thrust bearing is shot. You have to see if it's spun or damaged the block. It's gotta totally come a part. Once it's out you can have a machine shop take some measurements. If every thing checks out, it should go back together fine. What I'm seeing there is probably ok, it is whats hidden that could be bad

[Mpierick]

Thanks for looking at this.

When I took the pan off and looked at the oil I did not see any metal flakes. Is that a good sign?

[laneyamps]

Originally Posted by Mpierick

Thanks for looking at this.

When I took the pan off and looked at the oil I did not see any metal flakes. Is that a good sign?

Yeah, it could be a good sign....It could mean that you caught the problem in time... BUT.... don't "assume" anything right now.

As Pete mentions, you really have to take that engine apart to check for any more damage that may not be visible. Sure, you might be lucky, and there may only be minimal damage, but, just because you don't see anything in the oil pan, doesn't mean everything is OK. Basically, you just don't want to "guess" or "assume" anything....Especially with a 928 engine.

[Mpierick]

Would you go from the bottom up right now just to ID the problem?

[Mpierick]

What is the general cause of the scraping of the walls? Thrust bearings?

[AirtekHVAC]

mike,

Don't know much about this...but did some reading, looks like this affects automatics...there is a device to prevent this in the future....I can't remember what it's called, but someone will pop in with it...Pelican probably sells one...

Oh..found an article...

928 Motorsports - Porsche® Performance Parts - Improved Auto Driveshaft Clamp for Porsche® 928 Equipped with Automatic Transmission - Porsche® 928 World record Holder 216.63537 mph

[Pete R]

Originally Posted by Mpierick

What is the general cause of the scraping of the walls? Thrust bearings?

yes, the middle main bearing comes up and has like 1" tall bearing side that keeps the crank moving fore and aft.. His are long gone

[tmpusfugit]

From the photos it appears as if the TBF had just started, so there is some hope the block can be saved, but not easily saved. As others have suggested it will be necessary to pull the entire girdle to inspect all the bearings, both rod and mains, as well as the condition of the crank itself. If the crank is not damaged already, and the block itself is not "machined" past the edge of the thrust bearing into block, there is hope it can be saved. If the front of the girdle and the block itself where the thrust bearing seats are both undamaged it could be a new set of bearings....but, and a big but, I suspect any reputable engine builder would require a complete teardown to completely flush the block of residual aluminum particles, disassembly of all the lifters to ultrasonically clean them, replace all bearings, replace all gaskets, and possible rebuild the heads…they would require complete cleaning also…. You may get by with less but I would not recommend it….

[Mpierick]

Thanks for all the input. Does anyone have pictures of a block that is not damaged? Please post them.

Thanks.

[Pete R]

It looks just like your block but without the circular scrapes

[MarkRobinson]

can you feel it rubbing?? I've seen some machine marks on the thrust bearing bridge, but don't recall them being that deep: you hear/feel it correct?

Mark

[tmpusfugit]

Here is one that is worse, Don Carter's photo and car...

[Mrmerlin]

you may be panicking for nothing, do you know what your looking at?

What has to be looked at is the #3 web,
thats where the thrust bearing sits,
from the pictures you posted it looks like factory machining to me.

I do not see thrust bearing damage till better pictures are taken.
Whats the crankend play?
If not in spec then removal of the girdle is next to see what the remaing thrust bearing looks like and also the condition of the faces on the crank these can sometimes get grooved and need to be repaired as well.


Post 13 has thrust bearing damage

Note how the grinding is compared to the first photos.

If you dont find lots of metallic particles in the oil then you might not have a thrust bearing failure.
Also cut open the oil filter and rinse the filter media with brake cleaner let it drip into a clear catch pan and look for metal

[Mrmerlin]

If you look carefully in the second picture posted you can clearly see the thrust bearing face is actually quite thick, so it might ba e deal where you RnR the main bearings and the rod bearing get the crank polished

NOTE ( clean out the crank with atleast 3 cans of brake cleaner to clear out the dirt throws then rinse with hot water and simple green then spray down with WD40).
When the crank gets polished the oil pathways will fill with grinding compound if this isnt removed then it will quickly fry the new bearings
NOTE I said Polished for the crank thats minimal cutting on the surfaces

[Mrmerlin]

What does everyone think?

I tried to measure the end play and it is .006 inches.

Thanks for your help.

OOPS just saw this ,
normal clearance is .008in. to .016in. max so your reading indicated a slightly tight thrust bearing

[Mpierick]

Thank you for your time. I will take some better pictures of each section. I will be able to post them when I get home.

Mrmerlin--I guess you are suggesting to tear down the bottom half and clean and polish everything. Also go ahead and replace all the bearings. Anything else while I have the engine out.

Thanks

[Mrmerlin]

before you do anything what was the reason your taking the engine apart?
splitting the girdle isnt for the faint of heart it has to be perfectly done to insure positive results, oil pump is removed the installed then the girdle is tightened.

[SeanR]

Leave that alone, I see nothing there that would concern me. Like Stan said, if those measurements are correct then you have a very tight fitting crank and it's not a bad thing. A lot of these came out of the factory with worse machine marks than you are showing.

[Mpierick]

I rescued the car from a salvage yard. The body and inside were in very good shape. I knew the engine was bad. I have some experience in changing out motors but nothing like a Porsche. So far it is not that much difference except the size of the motor.

I purchased this motor to replace the bad one. I pulled the pan just to see if it had any problems. The original motor looked like the second set of pictures on this thread.

I am hoping I will not have to tear it down. It is a bit more involved that a SAAB.



I have always wanted a 928 and when I saw this it followed me home.