whats the deal with relays

[mayoman]

I need to get a new fuel pump relay. when I removed it during cleaning one of the pins is loose/ broken inside. I went to my local advanced auto parts store to inquire about it. they list 3 options for my 84 928 s. two of them are $30 to $40 and a third one is $94!!!! Any Recommendations?

Dan

[uBoat Commander]

Your host here at Pelican Forums has the Knowledge, the resources, and the relays you need. They are highly recommended.

[Alan in AZ]

Originally Posted by mayoman

I need to get a new fuel pump relay. when I removed it during cleaning one of the pins is loose/ broken inside. I went to my local advanced auto parts store to inquire about it. they list 3 options for my 84 928 s. two of them are $30 to $40 and a third one is $94!!!! Any Recommendations?

Dan

Advice is don't buy specialized relays from a generic shop - use someone who knows 928's

928 fuel pump relays are quite complicated - you won't get one new retail for $30-$40 that works properly... At that price it is either a totally wrong relay - or at best a relay that doesn't do pre-start priming. Assuming you want it to work properly - get the right relay.

Symptoms of the wrong relay will be slow starting (e.g. longer cranking). They are generally reliable so a cheaper option could be a used one...

Alan

[mayoman]

good advice! strange how there can be such a wide gap in prices (and probably quality)with these items. thanks for the quick replies!

[MPDano]

Originally Posted by mayoman

good advice! strange how there can be such a wide gap in prices (and probably quality)with these items. thanks for the quick replies!

Alan is our resident electrical guru when it comes to the 928. I've opened some relays that are just mechanical and some with circuit boards in them. I pretty much decided to no longer mess with them and buy from only Pelican, 928 Intl and Roger. Disastrous things can happen with wrong electrical parts. Save a few bucks and spend quadruple that fixing what it broke.

[curtisr]

I solved a no-start after swapping out a generic relay installed by a PO for the real thing.

[SanDiego928]

Nice tip. Could be why I have a slow start. Need to check that relay. I found a few in the door when I bought mine.

[aluminum]

I Bought a Fuel Pump relay from Pelican and although it works fine it is so Cheaply constructed that the Plastic ( Rather then Metal ) Cover Pops right off if you try to remove it after installing it . Has 2 very small " Plastic " Clip Tangs to keep the cover on then when compressed as you grab and pull on the Relay is just comes off.
So Then you must Pry the Relay out with no cover on it or replace the cover to discover it well just pull off again on the next try . Basic Bad Engineering of the Relay Body
All in all the entire Relay set up is Bad . The Prongs Rust to the Connections and the Socket slots gets filled up with this rust. Then they brake off when you try to remove them. Always use dialectic grease on all the Relays good for Conductivity ,insertions and removal . The Original Relays are constructed much better however the Prongs on most of them still rust . The Best one is the Cooling Fan Relay the Prongs are bigger at least in my "80 "
Sockets Pop out the Front of the Board , Wires out the back . Often you can swap unused Sockets for Damaged Sockets that that get ruined.
Label the wires or you might get them in wrong
Basically the entire Panel requires regular Maintenance and a Cotton Cloth well absorb moisture and may help under the Cover Board .

[syoo8]

Dielectric grease is not "good" for conductivity. Dielectric means "insulator."

If you want something that will enhance conductivity, there are good products out there, like Stabilant 22 and Caig Deoxit. I use the Deoxit first, then brush lightly with a brass brush, or use a pencil eraser. Then I apply diluted Stabilant 22. It has helped matters tremendously in both of my cars- fewer electrical problems.

The reason people use dielectric grease is to keep water out. The blades of the relays push the dielectric grease out of the way, and the dielectric grease keeps out the water.

[Alan in AZ]

The message here is - don't pull on the relay cans at all if you can avoid it and don't remove relays unless you have to.

e.g. Some people talk about removing all the relays and fuses once per year to clean everthing - honestly I think thats a stupid idea... I'll bet that nobody who has done that has succeeded in not damaging something. The sockets for relays and fuses are not designed for routine repetitive use. Every time you use them you are making them a little looser - this is not a good thing. Clean what clearly needs to be cleaned or seems to have a problem. If you need to remove fuses - use a fuse puller and pull them straight out parallel - don't wiggle side to side by hand. For relays - ideally use leverage under the base rather than the can (with the battery disconnected). You can buy relay pliers that hook under the base from opposite sides - you could also use a paint can opener (or 2). Don't lever up too much on one side before equalizing on the other side (1-2mm)

If you must pull on the can - try to break the initial connection loose with a little under base leverage then use special relay pliers to hold the can near the base and don't put too much of an angle on it if you need to wiggle it.

Dielectric grease is not at all good for conductivity (look up dielectric) - the only good it will do is (as a grease) to prevent future corrosion. Any that remains on the contact blade is an insulator...

Better to use a high quality contact cleaner and protectant (and keep the panel dry). Stabilant is quite excellent but very expensive - DeOxit D5/G5 are also good.

If you need to clean relay contact do it gently - if you reduce the thickness or remove the plating - the contact will be poorer on reinsertion and you may create degradation on the panel contacts - better to just replace corroded generic ('53B) relays (cheap). Always just replace fuses with any terminal degradation (cheap). And buy only high quality fuses & relay replacements. Blade ATC fuses from Littlefuse/Bussman, Generic (53B) relays from Bosch/Tyco/Hella (or OEM). If your fuse bades are a nice shiny gold color - they are probably crap fuses - get better ones with clean but dull looking blades. Do fuse brands really matter? - much more than you would think... for literally just a few dollars saved on no brand poor quality Chinese fuses you can create significant future costs & reliability issues... so don't.

Alan

[curtisr]

In the event this is new...

[Alan in AZ]

Yes like those - works well on all the short can single relays. You can get the same style with slightly longer arms (those pictured may be the long arm ones in fact) that also work on the double wides (with some difficulty) however some of the longest cans (e.g. intermittent wipers) won't work with either size - just too long.

You can also get this style of corner can grippers - if you can get low down on the relay they work pretty well... Also no good on long cans (or doubles of course)



On mine I added grip paper to the jaw surface - helps.

Alan

[Danglerb]

Originally Posted by curtisr

In the event this is new...

I have those, but seems like most relays need careful prying from the bottom, like the nylon trim tools from Harbor Freight. Disconnect the battery first.

My actual plan is to remove the CE panel and go over the whole thing in a more comfortable location.

[curtisr]

Originally Posted by uBoat Commander

Your host here at Pelican Forums has the Knowledge, the resources, and the relays you need. They are highly recommended.

Agreed. Hmm, maybe their mission statement should go something like this:

Porsche: a car. A car barely alive. Gentlemen, we can rebuild her. We have the technology including relays, pistons and really cool t-shirts. We have the capability to build the world's best car. Your Porsche will be that car. Better than she was before. Better, stronger, faster.

Sorry, I couldn't resist...