Oil viscosity question- rebuilt engine

[alexp2468]

Hey, I've been reading through a few threads and have thoroughly confused myself in terms of which oil to use.

I just rebuilt my 87' turbo, complete with new bearings, rings, seals, the works.... What oil would you recommend I use to get her broken in, then for routine use? I assume the higher weight oils i've been reading about are to help with leaks/ looser engines.


TIA

[nize]

i've been doing some research on this as well, and it seems that the porsche factory has what is probably the most demanding specifications for oil to meet their approval. the only porsche factory approved oil that i have been able to find so far is the mobile 1 european formula. note that this is different from the generic us version of mobile 1. only the european mobile 1 has 'porsche approved' on the back in the fine print.

the mobile1 euro formula is 0w40

read more here;
http://www.wrightune.co.uk/downloads/approved_oils.pdf

and here;
http://www.roadrunner-region-pca.org/Porsche_engine_oil_article.pdf

[adrian1]

Right now im running GTX syntec 5w-50.

[nize]

do you know if that's porsche factory approved? if it is, it should say so on the container.

and it turns out the mobile1 european formula is 0w40;
http://www.v8sho.com/SHO/Mobil10W40.htm

[nize]

from;
http://www.mobil.com/Australia-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENPVLMOMobil_1_0W-40.asp

Mobil 1 0W-40 has the following builder approvals:
BMW LL-01
Daimler Chrysler 229.3/229.5
Opel Long Life Service Fill GM-LL-A-025
Opel Diesel Service Fill GM-LL-B-025
Porsche Approved
Volkswagen 502.00/505.00,503.01

[Flitzr951]

I've been told that you should use conventional oil when breaking in an engine that was designed for conventional oil. Due to the excessive lubrication ability of synthetics, the ring/bearings etc. will take longer to set and therefor cause problems. And then once the engine is broken in, you can switch to Mobil 1. Has anyone else hearding anything along these lines?

[nize]

keep in mind that all mobile 1 are not the same. only mobile 1 european formula is porsche approved.

[Flitzr951]

I had never known that there were different types of Mobil 1, something to keep an eye on. I'm guessing the euro stuff is not readily available?

[nize]

this is the mobile 1 you want;
http://mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Mobil_1_0W-40.aspx

$39/6 = $6.50/quart
http://www.avlube.com/bfoncolfacar.html

it looks like napa also sells them, but the price isn't listed.

schuck's has it for $5.99/quart (the picture is incorrect though)
http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductDetail.aspx?MfrCode=MBI&MfrPartNumber=98HC6 4

[nize]

[alexp2468]

Interesting, thanks for all the information. Never seen the euro formula Mobil 1. This is my first 944, I'm a huge VW junkie, and have always run Amsoil European car 5w40, absolutely fantastic oil! I much preferred it to the standard formulation of Mobil 1, as it provided significantly less wear in my VW R32 engine (via blackstone oil analysis).

I was thinking of running dyno oil for the first 50 or so miles to both give the rings a chance to seat nicely, as well as clear out whatever particulate matter may have fallen in the engine during assembly (hopefully not much...)

if a 5w40 is a suitable weight, I may go ahead and try the Amsoil, since i have a few cases of it in my garage. I am however tempted to give the Mobil 1 euro formula a shot as well.....

[2Tight]

I would be careful assuming that a Porsche approved oil is approved for their engines going back 20+ years. If you are comfortable running a 0-40W in your car, more power to you. That's like mouthwash to a 951.

[myskyon]

Originally Posted by 2Tight

I would be careful assuming that a Porsche approved oil is approved for their engines going back 20+ years. If you are comfortable running a 0-40W in your car, more power to you. That's like mouthwash to a 951.

well i can tell you didnt read anything that NIZE posted. the approved list is for 1984 cars on. that means all 951's.

[2Tight]

Originally Posted by myskyon

well i can tell you didnt read anything that NIZE posted. the approved list is for 1984 cars on. that means all 951's.

Actually I did read most of it and more. I also read just a few years ago that the post Exxon Mobil 1 was better than the original and I'm not the only one who disagrees. So I have read some about oils thank you. If you are comfortable with using it then go for it and I'm sure it's fine. In the hot climate that I live in I think any 40W would be too little on hot days, maybe not but even good 50W's are taxed. Personally I stick with what has worked for me Valvoline Racing VR-1 20-50...yeah old school stuff for sure but I'm old!

I'm sure the Mobile Euro will work well for you. I'm sure you'll also let us know how it performs. No disrespect intended OK?

[myskyon]

Originally Posted by 2Tight

Actually I did read most of it and more. I also read just a few years ago that the post Exxon Mobil 1 was better than the original and I'm not the only one who disagrees. So I have read some about oils thank you. If you are comfortable with using it then go for it and I'm sure it's fine. In the hot climate that I live in I think any 40W would be too little on hot days, maybe not but even good 50W's are taxed. Personally I stick with what has worked for me Valvoline Racing VR-1 20-50...yeah old school stuff for sure but I'm old!

I'm sure the Mobile Euro will work well for you. I'm sure you'll also let us know how it performs. No disrespect intended OK?

none taken. it just seemed to me that you man have not read any of it. i hope it didnt sound like i was disrespecting you ether.

[pk951]

If I were rebuilding my engine when breaking in the engine I would use straight 30-weight din oil for the frist 150 miles or so. Then change oil filter run din oil 15-40 for the next 300 miles or so. Once you reach 500 miles the rings well have seated comptley. Change oil again filter fill with mobile-1 15-50.
Just my 2cents.

[myskyon]

ok now why does everyone want such a thick startup oil? i understand the think oil for when its warmed up but for when its cold why do you want it think it is creating ultra high pressure and not getting to the parts it needs to fast enough.

[nize]

here's an excerpt since it seems people aren't reading the links i've posted above. note that this porsche oil specification goes back to 1973;

Porsche 996FL Engine test. This test will last 203 hours. The engine, and the oil, will go through:
- 4 times the simulation of 35 hours of summer driving,
- 4 times the simulation of 13.5 hours of winter driving,
- 40 cold starts,
- 5 times the simulation of 1-hour sessions on the Nurburgring racetrack,
- 3.5 hours of running-in program
Measurements on the engine and on the oil will be done at regular intervals, and the following parameter will be taken into account to grant the approval or not:
- torque curve (internal friction),
- oxidation of the oil,
- Piston cleanliness and ring sticking,
- Valve train wear protection. Cam & tappet wear must be less than 10 μm.
- Engine cleanliness and sludge: after 203 hours, no deposits must be visible.
- Bearing wear protection: visual rating according to Porsche in-house method.

Several mechanics told me that they were relying on “their own testing” to choose an oil. None of these mechanics showed me that their method came close to matching what Porsche does: running dozens of oils through the same 203-hour test, and comparing the results.
This test has been designed by Porsche to guarantee the availability of test-proven oils for all Porsche since model year 1973: the letter (attached) given to oil manufacturers specifies that date.
This oil testing procedure exists specifically to avoid the wear cam problems created by the fiasco of ILSAC GF-4 being recommended in Porsche by some distributors. Why not use the Porsche testing to choose your oil?

All the large oil companies, including Mobil 1 of course, and many smaller companies, have one or several formulas that successfully passed this test. The “Porsche recommends Mobil 1” advertising is confusing: the most available Mobil 1 products found at Wal-mart or Jiffy Lube meet the ILSAC GF-4 spec and are NOT approved by Porsche. A clearer advertising statement would say “Mobil 1 0W40 passed the Porsche engine test”.

[bleu951]

Nize:

Great article and thanks for the education. Funny how few read it. I wonder who else has approved oils for Porsche since 1973?

I am currently running mobil 1 0w-40 in my 951. I have not read the back of the bottle yet, but the advertising of "Mobil 1 approved by Porsche" fooled me in the past.

I did not know Elf was even available in the US. Anyone know if there is an ELF distributor in the SE?

[2Tight]

It's odd that the original post was for break-in oil recommendations and most of the thread is about Mobil 1 0W-40. I wouldn't think it would be well suited for the task like most synthetics but maybe that's just another car myth. It all depends on what builder you talk to I suppose. I'm also interested in what oils others have used during break-in and 'how' they drive the car during this time. The opinions on just break-in driving styles are even more diverse than what oil to use.