944 Rear Wing

[Don Fulano]

Anyone knows what brand or where to find this rear wing?

[FrenchToast]

I thought it was IFC but it looks different:



IFC makes another version too. Kogntion also makes one.

I don't know who makes the one you found, sorry!

Take care,

[333pg333]

Bit hard to tell from only the one pic. I suspect that the uprights might have been custom cnc'd like ours. Hope it's attached to something else apart from that small number plate sized mount though!! We go through the bodywork onto cage pipe that is mounted between the chassis rails.

Not sure about the actual wing. Don't think it would be too hard to find. As Frenchie has mentioned, Mike at IFC has something similar. He's a great guy to deal with which is a bonus. Also there is Good Aero's version.

[FrenchToast]

Yes, as 333 said - it needs to mount to a structural part of the car. Otherwise, you'll probably just rip the license plate panel right off!

Patrick - I know you've done extensive aero testing. What is the purpose of the raised center section of both the IFC wing and the wing in the OP's photo? It seems it would just create additional drag.

[333pg333]

FT my understanding is that the raised centre section was meant to account for fastback or coupe shaped vehicles...like ours. As you imagine, the air going across our cars with the sloping back glass (which also slopes downwards at the sides) would hit the wing at different angles. That's why these designs have cropped up. So it is probably not a bad design for our cars but not neccessarily perfect as it's a generic shape, not custom designed by an Aero person with wind tunnel.

Aero work is truly a Black Art like they say about suspension. I only have a small understanding but have had contact with two of the top guys in their field and both have had major impact on my car. Fascinating stuff!

[DannoXYZ]

Originally Posted by FrenchToast

Yes, as 333 said - it needs to mount to a structural part of the car. Otherwise, you'll probably just rip the license plate panel right off!

Patrick - I know you've done extensive aero testing. What is the purpose of the raised center section of both the IFC wing and the wing in the OP's photo? It seems it would just create additional drag.

As Patrick said, more even air-flow across the wing-surface given the shape of the top & back of the car. Also to generate more vortices at the tips/ends. Slightly less drag for the same downforce. Similar to the up-turned wing-tips on aeroplanes nowadays. Of course the optimization will be different for each body-shape. Have you checked out the cost of CFD software lately?

[333pg333]

As we're all just hoping for the best when selecting a wing, by going with a known brand that has spent some money on CFD you 'should' be ok with one of these as a starting point. Ours is from DJ engineering in the UK and it was designed by Simon McBeath who is a well known and published Aerodynamicist. We're also dealing directly with Andrew Brilliant who did a two day consultation on our car and thought our wing was a good option. Via the shock pots he found that we saw over 1000kgs of rear downforce with this wing! Unfortunately our frontal aero wasn't up to scratch at that point in time and we've undergone some significant changes to rectify it. As you can see in the pic taken at last year's WTAC we were seeing obvious front end lift. This is something that everyone needs to be aware of when they put on a large rear wing. You will more than likely increase your front lift which isn't good. So you should deal with major changes in a balanced approach. Slapping on some diveplanes is pure guesswork and can be counter productive. Well worth doing some research before committing to a big rear wing imho. Also, don't assume that we are running soft springs to allow it to squat like that. 1486ft/lb in the rear.

[FrenchToast]

Originally Posted by 333pg333

FT my understanding is that the raised centre section was meant to account for fastback or coupe shaped vehicles...like ours. As you imagine, the air going across our cars with the sloping back glass (which also slopes downwards at the sides) would hit the wing at different angles. That's why these designs have cropped up. So it is probably not a bad design for our cars but not neccessarily perfect as it's a generic shape, not custom designed by an Aero person with wind tunnel.

Aero work is truly a Black Art like they say about suspension. I only have a small understanding but have had contact with two of the top guys in their field and both have had major impact on my car. Fascinating stuff!

Thanks for the synopsis. Fascinating is an understatement!

I can't believe you're making 1000kg of downforce, WOW! What are you producing in the front?

Did you guys ever put a stock-bodied car in the tunnel as a control/comparison?

Originally Posted by DannoXYZ

As Patrick said, more even air-flow across the wing-surface given the shape of the top & back of the car. Also to generate more vortices at the tips/ends. Slightly less drag for the same downforce. Similar to the up-turned wing-tips on aeroplanes nowadays. Of course the optimization will be different for each body-shape. Have you checked out the cost of CFD software lately?

Thanks for the addition. Great stuff.

I'm assuming CFD is Coefficient of Drag? And, no, I haven't checked the price. And I imagine I probably don't want to! :P

[333pg333]

No tunnels for us. All the CFD has been done by the Aero guys previously. Would love to spend a day at a wind tunnel but there are very few Down Under and very high costs to rent. When that pic was taken (Oct 2013) we were actually seeing front end lift at the end of the main straight. That's why the nose is rising up as shown. We didn't actually know this until some months later as our front Aero package was pretty much all guesswork. Now that we have had Andrew Brilliant cast his eye over the car for 2 days and we've gradually implemented all the changes on his list, we are now seeing downforce at the front. Don't have an actual figure but the car is definitely getting better and better (faster) each time we go to the track.

Oh, CFD is Computational Fluid Dynamics. Takes a LOT of Computer power to run a decent program but this is where many people who don't have the money or access to Wind Tunnels are turning to.