Phase 7- Recaro Seats

[Bill Verburg]

Along w/ the suspension work, I've been working at getting some Recaro Profi SPG XL seats installed. This is turning into a real project. It would have been easier if I was willing to use the supplied M6 hardware, but I want a really secure install, so M8s and double the bolts up

Parts list
Recaro Profi SPG XL x2
Recaro sliders x2 sets re 0.70.9NT

964.521.065.00 x2 964RS tunnel side buckle support for stock seat belt receptacle
999.025231.03 x8 964 RS spacer washer 8x27x3
996.521.933.90 x2 996GT3 sub strap cross member
M8-1.25 x20 grade 10.9 Button head bolts/washers/nuts x8 for the rear side mount to slider connection
M8-1.25 x20 grade 10.9 cap screws x12 for the front side mount to slider connection
M8-1.25x24 grade 10.9 cap screws x16 for the slider to chassis connection
BK Side mounts x2 R-9066
Schroth standard seat belt (7/16") plate and Schroth 22mm standard(7/16") eyebolt x2 ea


First mock-up of the sliders and side-mounts, you must use button heads in the rear positions to bolt the side-mounts to the sliders, M6 x4 are supplied by BK I'm using M8


964Rs tunnel side mount for the stock seat belt receptacle, the 6 point harness will bolt to the tunnel, I had to trim the stock carpet in the area where this travels and may end up shortening the full length stock console for additional clearance up top. To use these additional holes are needed in the sidemounts and slider rail.


Schroth standard seat belt (7/16") plate and Schroth 22mm standard(7/16") eyebolt


964Rs washers to space the sidemount up 3mm to accomodate the seat belt receptacle and GT3 sub mount


BK sidemounts, these get the seats as low as possible for helmet head room


Here's the tunnel side, if you look closely you can see where the bolt heads and sidemount flanges interfere w/ the bottom of the shell. I need to go back to the machinist and have the sidemount flange relieved further, ~3-4mm ought to do it but we'll see


The 996GT3 sub mount bar, this also has a 3mm end plate thickness and also requires that the BK sidemnount flange be machined down by ~3-4mm per side where it mounts. The sub straps want to be from 0* down to 20* back



The whole shebanh mocked up, still need some holes drilled and flanges milled but it looks like it will all work


Will continue this after the next trip to the machinist.

[jac1976]

I am sure the seats will work great, but I question the upholstery in the photos!

[Ag02M5]

I'd love to see some good pics of the Schroth plate install.

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by Ag02M5

I'd love to see some good pics of the Schroth plate install.

Here is the factory 964 to 964RS/Cup conversion procedure





And here is the tunnel w/ oem RS pieces

[Ag02M5]

Are you going to weld the plates inside the tunnel as shown?

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by Ag02M5

Are you going to weld the plates inside the tunnel as shown?

TBD, they will either be welded or glued. The only constraint is that they remain in place should the cabin eye have to be removed for any reason

[mjshira]

Another great Verburg thread.

[Bill Verburg]

Here's the final milled sidemount brackets, ~1/8" at each of the 4 spots on the flanges, they just need to be drilled for the submount bar.



When milled as above the seats bolt is in a minute. Just like they belong there.

[TT/T]

Can't wait to see the final install pics.

[Bill Verburg]

Well it's been awhile, all that work and I didn't like the way the seats sat in the car, soooo
lets try Recaro side mounts, these sit ~2mm higher in back than the BK9066 so there is less of an interference w/ the bottom of the seat bubble. I spent a while w/ a grider trimming off excess metal but all in all much easier to deal w/ than the BKs

here's the result











Maybe try to fit them in the car tomorrow

The other part of this is the pad eyes for the tunnel side harnessess
Of course the factory 964RS instructions cause the eyes to have to go where a 993 has a transmission brace, but there is a nice flat spot for the plate just behind it. Here the trans brace is out and a trial hole drilled.

[Bill Verburg]

Put one seat in the car today, the Recaro side mounts look like they will work great. Have to fiddle w/ the tunnel side receptacle a bit more to get full fore & aft travel. This is definitely a much better solution than the BKs

[Don Plumley]

Great information!

[Bill Verburg]

Some progress, I gave up on the BKs too much rocker that can't be eliminated. So back to the Recaro side mounts, they fit perfectly except the seat is too far forward for my long legs. However mount them backward and it's a good fit.








The rear seat belt reciptical through the side hole seems to be workable too, we'll see.

Purchased some Aluminum Recaro sidemounts which have the same config as the steel.

Biggest issue is the GT3 sub bar needs new holes drilled further back, its a shame because when mounted in the Recaro design orientation all the holes are perfectly placed for mounting the sidemounts and sub bar. May have to drill throught the floor as the best solution.

[917L]

Did you have to drill any extra holes in the Recaro sliders and side mounts to add the the tunnel side buckle support between the sliders and the side mounts?

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by 917L

Did you have to drill any extra holes in the Recaro sliders and side mounts to add the the tunnel side buckle support between the sliders and the side mounts?

Yes, there are 2 holes at each end of the Recaro sidemounts, 1x 8.5mm and 1x 6.75mm use the 8.75mm and then drill another 8.75mm for the seat belt mount, this second hole partially overlaps the existing 6.75mm hole

[917L]

Thanks, Bill, for the explanation. I'll be installing some Recaros in a 993 next week.

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by 917L

Thanks, Bill, for the explanation. I'll be installing some Recaros in a 993 next week.

Please report the details, I'm extremely disatisfied w/ the whole affair

It could be me, long legs

It could be the seats are just too ldeep,
SPG XL 430mm wide x 790mm deep x 880mm tall
PP 430mm wide x 710mm deep x 885mm tall

but certainly contributing factors are the available sidemonts
BKs too much rocker that can't be easily altered
Recaro not enough rear travel unless they are mounted backwards whuch causes other issues.

[917L]

I installed two Recaro SPGs in a 993 three years ago. The installation was virtually problem free (I sourced the seats, sliders, and sidemounts from PAR, which is no longer a Recaro retailer). I installed the tunnel side buckle supports with the seats, but I couldn't remember how much drilling I had to do to add the supports. You kindly shared some valuable information.

I used Recaro sidemounts which are different from those in your pictures and different from the aluminum sidemounts which you've ordered. Here's a representative picture with information on the Recaro sidemount 30687907:

http://www.northstarmotorsports.com/products/sfID1/Seats/sfID2/Seat+Tracks+%26+Side+Mt./manufacturer/Recaro/productID/115

I used the Recaro 0.70.9NT sliders that you have.

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by 917L

I installed two Recaro SPGs in a 993 three years ago. The installation was virtually problem free (I sourced the seats, sliders, and sidemounts from PAR, which is no longer a Recaro retailer). I installed the tunnel side buckle supports with the seats, but I couldn't remember how much drilling I had to do to add the supports. You kindly shared some valuable information.

I used Recaro sidemounts which are different from those in your pictures and different from the aluminum sidemounts which you've ordered. Here's a representative picture with information on the Recaro sidemount 30687907:

http://www.northstarmotorsports.com/products/sfID1/Seats/sfID2/Seat+Tracks+%26+Side+Mt./manufacturer/Recaro/productID/115

I used the Recaro 0.70.9NT sliders that you have.

The SPG is a much easier install, SPG is 50mm shorter and 35mm narrower than the SPG XL and requires it's own sidemount design that curves in, the XL and PP use mouts that are flat sided, unfortunately while I can fit in that seat it's not comfortable for more than 20min or so.

[917L]

Understood, Bill. I didn't know that the different dimensions of the SPG and SPG XL have an effect on the selection of a sidemount for each SPG version.

I'm surprised that the installation of the SPG XL has become so problematic for you--particularly since you've covered all of the installation criteria so thoroughly. Paul Resnick (paul@parcars.com) at PAR Porsche Specialists may have some insight about the installation of an SPG XL in a 993. Even though he's no longer selling Recaros, he recently answered several questions for me about a Recaro seat. I suspect that you know PAR and that the business is just down the road from you in New Rochelle.