New Brake kit.... poll on brakes..

[DinFtown]

Jeremy

to answer you adapter question, the new calipers use a different caliper adapter but the same rotor adapter for the 309mm kit. So you could upgrade to the 6 piston billet caliper with the larger pad for only the cost of the calipers, pads, brake line, and caliper adapter. The setups both use the same rotors, and rotor adapters for the 309 X 32 mm kits. This makes it very easy to use the brake system in many different configurations without having to change many parts. Also keeps cost down on designing new systems if I use existing adapters for new kits.

As far as comparing the Wilwood HD to the 930 rotor, the Wilwood HD is better suited for racing. The main reason is the 930 rotor is drilled. You will hear me tell everyone time and time again that rotors are drilled to save weight not for cooling the rotor. The fact is a drilled rotor will run hotter than a flat face rotor (same size) under the same conditions. The drills in the rotor (whether drilled or cast) take away valuable surface area needed to stop the car. Your brakes dissipate the energy of stopping your car through friction converted to heat, the heat is designed (some ends up in the caliper via the pad) to all go into the rotor, and dissipated as a heat sink through radiation into the air. This is why directional veined rotors are so important. The drills take away valuable surface areas for the transfer to take place causing more pressure from the driver on the brake peddle than a car with flat face rotor. The more pressure creates more heat to do the same job. this is bad news for the drilled rotors because as you know it is easier to heat up the edge of a piece of metal then the center, so all the edges on the holes get hotter then the areas in between the holes on the rotors. The uneven heating cause the area around the holes to expand at a rate faster then the metal around it causing a lot of internal pressure in the rotor(again causing more heat). Once this happens when the rotor cools down it has a high chance of cracking around the holes, the more it heats up, and cools down the more likely it is to crack, causing hairline cracks connecting hole to hole. This is dangerous as it will eventually compromise the integrity of the rotor.

Like I said drilled rotors where drilled to save weight, the only other advantage, and the only condition I recommend a drilled rotor is in dirt track, or rally racing. The holes help with a place for water to go as well as helping to prevent a rock from embedding in your pad, and trashing you rotor. (So if you spend a lot of time off the track in the sand, then 930 brakes might be the why to go) What is the going rate on a new 930 brake setup??

Also the bleed screws will not be coated in the kits, we have taken that into consideration, also the calipers will not say Porsche on them, they will have the ProBraking label on them, or they also might have a distributors label on them as I am not selling the kits direct.

[DinFtown]

this is the final product, after a year of playing with it, and taking into cosideration every consern we possibly could, we finally have a final product.

[JonT]

looks good and nice follow up. How bout some specs and which model/years 911's these will fit? pricing?

[DinFtown]

The two setups you see here are for the 74-89 models with 3.5" front ear spacing. We use a custom Anodized Billet four piston caliper to do the job, it is very ridged and uses four 35mm pistons keeping the setup very close to your stock configuration allowing it to be a great economical upgrade since you do not need to upgrade your Master cylinder, or your rear brakes. Both kits are complete bolt on, and require no modification to your car. The calipers are also setup to use the very popular 7420 series pad, the pad type is made by most all pad manufactures(Hawk, Wilwood, Polymatrix, EBC, ect…) and has limitless compounds and the price is great since that pads are some common. The kits include a set of the new Polymatrix BP-10 SmartPad, a new street track pad that is state of the art as far as compounds go. All ProBraking kits only use the best in parts and hardware. All Hardware is Porsche OEM, with NAS grade rotor bolts standard not $100+ upgrade like in competitors kits. We do not offer Safety as an “Upgrade” it is always standard.

The main difference in the two kits you see here are the wheel application. The larger 309SL kit is a 309X32mm Directional vane rotor and will fit the 951 Fuchs only. It will fit most all aftermarket 16” and larger wheels, but as far as Fuchs go it will only fit inside the 7 and 8 inch 951 wheels. MSRP is $1499.

The Super kit fits all “911” Fuchs wheels from the 74-89 cars. Yes, all 15 and 16 inch 911 Fuchs. You must take note of your part number on your wheels. The part number must start with “911.” The kit uses a 286X32mm Directional vane rotor. This kit will need a spacer to work with any Fake Fuchs, or “901.” Part numbered wheels. MSRP is $1799.

Contact Pelican Parts and show your interest for them to start carrying the full line of ProBraking products.

[DinFtown]

Here is a follow up on Pad info. I have been getting a lot of pad questions. The pads are avalible in about every compound offered by the listed makers. If you have a pad brand you don't see and would like me to get a part number for just let me know, and I will add it to the list.

PAGID -------------------- 2555
Wilwood/Polymatrix-----7320
PFC ------------------------7751
Hawk --------------------- HB101.800
Raybestos ----------------- R700-20
AP ---------------------------43/4” Stockcar

[KTL]

Nice looking setup Dave. Are the calipers fitted directly to the strut ears or do these require adapter brackets? I assume these calipers are wider than the Brembo 993/S4 front caliper since they use wider pads (20mm) than the factory Brembo 17mm thick 447-type pad tracing?

Could you provide some additional information about the calipers? Dust seals? How is the caliper body set up for fluid supply? Flare nut or banjo fitting?

What among the pads you've listed is a comparable pad compound to the Porterfield R4 carbon kevlar?

Thanks,

[DinFtown]

Kevin,

You can get the Porterfield R4 pad the AP part number is for the Porterfield’s... the part number is a "4 3/4" Stockcar" pad(I know it sounds like a funny part number, but that is what you would order it as)... the 4 3/4" Stockcar R4 is $115 list, compared to the 993 R4 is $170 list, and yes the pads that go in my calipers are 20mm thick meaning longer pad life.

The calipers are machined from solid Billet Aluminum, and hard Anodized. They do not have dust seals. They are designed for the track, and like any race part you do need to inspect them. I have used a set for well over two years and have never had any problems. Rebuilding is under $50 for both calipers, and that’s a great price compared to well over $120 just for one 993 caliper.

The Brake line fitting is a NPT fitting, and comes with the adapter to a standard hard brake line.

[KTL]

Dave,

Thanks for the pad compound info. Much appreciated.

As far as the calipers, i'm always cleaning, inspecting stuff on my car, so not a big deal IMO since my car is mostly track only anyway.

What's a pair of calipers only cost? I would only need calipers (and the fluid adapter fitting) since I already have your rotor hats and hardware.

Thanks for the background on the rebuild prices and the pad prices. Hence the reason why I would be interested in substituting a set of these front calipers for my existing 993 setup.

[DinFtown]

Kevin,

The caliper with caliper adapter (uses a different adapter). The calipers you see are four pistons, and work as a Stock replacement, and are meant for no rear brake change, or master change. You have a full upgrade since your are running 993's, the swap for you would be to my six piston calipers. They are the same color and use the same pads, but look more like the GT2 calipers. The Six Piston swap with adapters would be about $1100, but you would have the best front setup available.

Dave

[KTL]

Dave,

Should have been more clear. I'm looking at removing the 993 brakes and the front upgrade/rear stock setup you offer is one I would consider. The 993 setup is a bit of overkill IMO. Many of the folks I run with use stock SC and Carrera brakes with race pads. They manage to get by with this setup on our tracks which are tough on brakes (Blackhawk Farms), although they typically must rebuild the calipers at the end of each driving season. I feel I should be able to get by with lesser than 993 brakes without a doubt. But I would like to have that extra margin of safety, as well as not have to bleed brakes regularly. That is one area the 993 setup shines (no bleeding at all in 7 track days) as well as pad wear.

The 993 setup with much bigger front pistons and rotors, larger boosted master cylinder and larger rear calipers with big rotors have proven to be tough to modulate on my car. I have no problem locking up R compound tires on many occasions. My next step was going to be disconnecting the brake booster to gain better modulation. But the cost of pads and rebuild kits still does not sit well with me, since i'm just doing DE and time trials on a tight budget.

[DinFtown]

Kevin sent you a PM.

[Spede]

Dave has awesome products and is a great guy. I got a set for my project and he helped me out beyond my expectations when I was having difficulty.

[Dadofour]

Steve,

I am very seriously considering the 309SL brake setup. Dave has been extremely responsive and helpful.

Which brake package did you install and on what car? What difficulties did you encounter?

Thanks

Than

[Spede]

Originally posted by Dadofour
Steve,

I am very seriously considering the 309SL brake setup. Dave has been extremely responsive and helpful.

Which brake package did you install and on what car? What difficulties did you encounter?

Thanks

Than

I got a 993 brake setup from him... my difficulties were my being a moron. I had a ton of questions for him and he was very patient and understanding with me.

[benzyne]

Dave, I'm interested in the 309SL kit, but Pelican seems to only have the Super kit listed. Where can I get the larger kit?

[99Coyote]

I have the Super kit on my '89 Carrera. My car is narrow body but has a turbo motor with about 400 RWHP. This car is very fast and requires very hard braking to haul down that speed into tight corners on track days. I replaced my stock Carrera front brakes with the Supers and I have yet to encounter a single issue with over heating or fade or fluid boil. Simply put, these things are fantastic. Email me for pictures if you're interested. I was adamant about keeping my stock fuchs look.

[boxsterman]

I, too, was interested in 309SL kit and even the 6 piston one. But it seems DinFtown(Probraking) is no longer around. I worked with one of his distributor (not Pelican) and they were unable to get response from him (email or voice) after several attempts; they have since discontinued selling their kits. I tried to PM DinFtown also and got no response. And obviously www.probraking.com no longer works. Perhaps, Wayne can get a hold of him if Pelican is still selling his kit.

[efhughes3]

Do a search on probraking, and you'll find some interesting threads from about 2 years ago. I bought some stuff from him, and while I ultimately got (almost) what I paid for, it wasn't fun.

[Joeaksa]

Reviving an old thread.

Anyone know what happened to www.probraking.com ?

Website is down...

Wondering if this brake upgrade worked or ?

[KTL]

A better choice IMO is the tried and true "993" setup. This setup consists of:

993 or 928S4 front calipers
993 or Big Red caliper adapters. TRG, Patrick Motorsports, Road & Race Supply and others make these
Wilwood HD or GT flavor 12.19" x 1.25" (309mm x 32mm) rotors with 8x7.00" bolt circle
1/4 " thick rotor hats. These are very simple fixed hats or you can get some really nice floating hats from Pro Systems Inc.

Rear setup is 993 or 965 rear calipers with 930 rotors. Caliper mount ears are redrilled to 3 in. on-center holes that are ~12mm below the pad box (bottom of pad box to center of hole)

Need to custom bend some hard lines to connect the calipers to the flex hoses. No big deal IMO. Also need a 23.8mm 930 master cylinder, just like the one I sold you!

I've run this 993 setup on a street car and two race cars. It's fantastic.