[CamB]

Fair enough. I'd accept that the middle part of those wavering in their support would think that way (they're obviously the crucial ones).

It pains me a little because those further towards the other end (ie, those who thought the US had no place/right invading, and those with the "you break it, you buy it" view) were the ones who were right.

I dunno - I guess since I begin from a standpoint of avoiding war at all costs, I am always going to conflict with those who see it as a necessary part of peace. I cannot believe in a peaceful society at the point of a sword. My own life doesn't work that way.

Either way, I said it a week or two back - I think you/we need more troops over there (and that means a President, whether Bush or Kerry) successfully getting meaningful contributions from other nations. The place needs to be made secure and the infrastructure built. Think like an average Iraqi - they see American troops and (for many of them) not a lot of progress. This breeds antimosity (of which a small percentage turns into insurgency).

Len - sorry. If you had rebutted again, I was going to ask to agree to disagree. I get your point but disagree. Happy to leave it at that.