I want to turbo my 3.2L carrera

[wjfk32]

Did you see the one for sale on Pelican Forums:--Blue Mexico Color..Turbo...

Personally- I did my turbo-top end-1994 in my 20's and worked on it with my wrench.

Today--I would be in panic mode if I was not at shop, keeping an eye on everything. Just my 2cents. I don't want some intern or helper doing my cams.ETC..ETC..
You are paying big $$$$$$$. You here stories of big money laid out for subpar work. The old school mechanics are moving on and workmanship/detail isn't there. YES-THERE ARE FEW GREAT SHOPS OUT THERE-BUT AT WHAT COST. $$$$$$, Just not worth it INMOP. Unless you have the funds. Then there isn't a problem.

Walt


Walt

[DDDD]

Originally Posted by polizei

+1

Steve, I imagine you're in the PHX area since your sig reads "AZ". Chris from Turbo Kraft in Tempe is the turbo king. He has a reputation for not cutting corners and being a perfectionist - exactly the guy I'd like to do my turbo conversion, except that I can't quite afford him. And I'm on the wrong side of the country. You'd have a shop that you know is going to be there when you wake up tomorrow and knows how to service your turbo conversion. Read Tom's thread on this forum - "2010: An EFI Hot Rod Odyssey". Chris is building his car.

One correction from the above post is that Protomotive does customize chips. The problem is that this is a "ballpark" and not an exact science. If you were in Protomotive's neck of the woods, you could probably get Todd to properly dyno and tune your car with great reliability. Todd's approach is to maintain as many stock components (including the ECU) as possible. This keeps installation time and cost to a minimum, plus he's got a niche market on turbo kits. Chris' approach is much different. I think it's the difference between "How can I maintain stock components to achieve X horsepower?" and "What components does this car need to achieve X horsepower?".

Unless you send your car to Protomotive, they send you a mass produced chip. The real issue however is that the newer EFIs are much better than the old school 1985 Bosch technology.

In the end, it is best to explore all options is what I wanted to say. I am sure that some guys will swear by Protomotive, they have done a ton of builds. I just question any company that sells a $4500 intercooler...

[polizei]

Originally Posted by DDDD

Unless you send your car to Protomotive, they send you a mass produced chip.

Not exactly. I've had Todd reprogram a few chips based on corresponding changes in my set up. He does have the mass produced Stage 1 - 3 chips, but he'll modify any of those for you sight unseen. The problem is that these mods are just a ballpark, and that actual dyno time is needed to make it right.

Originally Posted by DDDD

The real issue however is that the newer EFIs are much better than the old school 1985 Bosch technology.

For those who are looking to add more than just .5-.7 BAR, I totally agree. That's why I'm swapping my protomotive setup for an aftermarket EFI!

Originally Posted by DDDD

In the end, it is best to explore all options is what I wanted to say. I am sure that some guys will swear by Protomotive, they have done a ton of builds. I just question any company that sells a $4500 intercooler...

Couldn't have said it better. The real danger with going the Protomotive route is that it is SO much more expensive in the long run if you decide you want to upgrade.

[Tippy]

My car is a Protomotive car and actually had one chip burned differently after some parts changes before I bought it from a friend. My friend just told Todd what was different and he sent him the new chip - no dyno time.

The car had been DD for years and boosted to 1.2 bar over and over again without any signs of damage when I tore it down.

[torresmd]

Just a quick update. I did speak with Chris Carroll at TurboKraft and he was very helpful. He will be helping with advice and products throughout this build. I bought some Turbo P&C's, used but in very good shape. Here are some pics of my progress. I dropped off my heads to Chris and he will work his magic on them. Next weak I will give him all the other parts that need machining.

[gsmith660]

wow the inside of that case looks clean! how many miles? What oil?

[torresmd]

The odometer reads 48K. I too was surprised how clean the internals looked. As far as the oil, I have no idea. I have only owned the car for a few weeks now.

[mikedsilva]

Just started looking into this.. seems prices are much much higher today!
Option 1 shows as $8k for parts only on his website.

Originally Posted by polizei

Hey Steve, welcome to the insanity. Though it looks like you are no novice to forced induction from your signature!

There are a few different paths that folks on this forum have taken to turbo charge their 3.2 Carreras:

1. 325 RWHP @ .5 bar for $3-5k. No top end or bottom end changes. Replace Carrera Catalytic Converter with 930 J pipe, add a turbo, replace carrera muffler with 930 muffler & cat or go with an M&K or Rarly8 muffler, fab a charge pipe from the turbo to the Air Flow Meter (w/ a Blow Off Valve), fab plumbing from the turbo to the rear wheel well or into the engine bay for an air filter (how much rain your car will see should determine this), add a tial 46 mm waste gate with a .5 bar spring, add an oil drain canister and scavenge pump for the turbo, add a BEGI rising rate fuel pressure regulator (rrfpr - i've got one for sale) or a Protomotive rrpr, swap your stock ECU for a Protomotive Stage 1 ECU, and install an Innovate LM-1 for tuning. This is the most economic route and will give you approximately 325 rwhp. This can be done for $3-5k depending mostly on the headers, muffler & turbo you choose. Not advisable to run any more boost without lowering compression.

2. 375 RWHP @ .7 bar for $8-10k. Do #1 above, rebuild the top end of your engine, replace your Carrera pistons and cylinders with 3.3 L half finned cylinders (fully finned are better and more expensive) and no more than 8.5:1 compression pistons (a lot of different options here), replace stock rod bolts with ARP rod bolts, replace stock head studs with ARP or Supertech head studs, add a .7 bar waste gate spring & replace stock ECU with custom Protomtive chip. I ran this setup and had trouble keeping the stock rubber elbow connected from the throttle body to the AFM. Not advisable to run any more boost without cooling the intake charge.

3. 400 RWHP @ .8 bar for $11-12k. Do #2 above, add an air-to-air or water-to-air intercooler or even water/methanol injection, add a .8 bar waste gate spring & replace stock ECU with custom Protomtive chip. There are hidden costs here depending on your cooling solution. You will need to replace your Carrera tail with a turbo tail if you go down the air-to-air I/C road. After .8 bar, the Carrera fuel injectors clamp closed

4. 450 RWHP @ 1.0 bar for $13-14k. Do #3 above, replace Carrera injectors with 944 Turbo injectors, replace Carrera fuel pump with Bosch 044 fuel pump, add a 1.0 bar waste gate spring & replace stock ECU with custom Protomtive chip.

All of these options tie you down to Protomotive and leave you with no good way to really tune in your engine. #1 is the best option in terms of bang for the buck, but if you want ANY more HP, you really need to crack open the wallet. I went down the #2 path a few years ago, and have since decided to replace my Carrera ECU with a full blow aftermarket engine management system. The possibilities really open up once you go down this road, but of course, it's not cheap. If your goal is 450 HP, you can achieve that by going through Protomotive, but you'll probably spend more money and have less flexibility down the road.

Here are my specs, which I'm *hoping* can make 500 rwhp at 1.0-1.2 bar:

Narrow body '87 Carrera with 3.3 L turbo cylinders & 8.0:1 compression pistons
ARP rod bolts & Supertech head studs
Electromotive TEC-3R EMS w/ distributorless twin plugged ignition
Carrera Cams
Custom AMS headers w/ T4 Flange - thick wall
Aquamist HFS-3 Water/Methanol Injection w/ 50:50 mix
Water-to-Air Intercooler
Carrera Intake Manifold
55 lb Bosch injectors with Bosch 044 Fuel Pump

Let me know if you any questions - happy to help.

[TurboKraft]

Old thread, a blast from the past.

Originally Posted by mikedsilva

Just started looking into this.. seems prices are much much higher today!

Prices are MUCH higher today than they were then.

Steve built this engine with 97mm P&Cs, remanufactured crank & rods, ARP bolts & studs. He found an unused set of B&B headers for cheap, and a Tial wastegate. Stock Carrera cams & rockers.
TurboKraft prepared the twin-plug heads with upgraded valves, and finished out the top end with:
* programmable engine management
* coil-on-plug ignition
* billet full-width intercooler
* Garrett GT35R and custom 3in stainless muffler to fit the custom bodywork

First dyno pull on 91-octane was 515whp, and she settled in at 545whp @ 1.2bar.

She's still running like that today.

With the light weight and G50 transmission, the car was frighteningly quick.
Like _dangerous_ quick.

[Geronimo]

I need to call you Chris and see if you can help me put a plan together for my sad lil SC turbo dreams.

I have a Rarelyl8 header and a 3.2 Intake manifold to replace the PMO's I am currently running.

[TurboKraft]

Originally Posted by Geronimo

I need to call you Chris and see if you can help me put a plan together for my sad lil SC turbo dreams.

I have a Rarelyl8 header and a 3.2 Intake manifold to replace the PMO's I am currently running.

Stay conservative on the compression ratio and the boost, and it'll be a wonderful all-around driver with plenty of off-the-line pep and that signature hit of midrange torque that only a 911 Turbo can deliver.

[Geronimo]

Yea, I want to give you a call and get a bang for the buck plan put together. I will need many of the goodies you sell. And some guidance on things like ECU set ups and all the fiddley bits to make it come together.

I need to sort the head studs this year, while at it check the comp and leak down. I want to start from the stock engine and shoot for a well running .5-.7bar set up.

But if I can get a sort of list going I can pile up parts while I get ready to dive in. My wife can live with costs if I spread them out a good bit lol

[tadink]

Originally Posted by Geronimo

My wife can live with costs if I spread them out a good bit lol

gotta sign up for this thread if there is wisdom like that being posted herein!!!

[Geronimo]

She lets me spend more money than I should, so long as I give her a lot of lead time.

I'm thinking a 5 year plan to get all EFI'd, turbo'd and 930 flares.