71 911engine case crack help

Rusty 356 · 05-08-2013, 01:41 PM

Working on a 71 looking for an oil leak at rear of motor. Put two bottles of dye in the oil and ran, found a crack in the case above the freeze plug at the end of the oil galley top of motor behind the fan housing. Tried JB weld but looks like still coming out.
Does anyone have a different solution than JB weld? We might be able to sleeve the area at last resort. Any help would be appreciated.

Henry Schmidt · Henry Schmidt's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rusty 356

Working on a 71 looking for an oil leak at rear of motor. Put two bottles of dye in the oil and ran, found a crack in the case above the freeze plug at the end of the oil galley top of motor behind the fan housing. Tried JB weld but looks like still coming out.
Does anyone have a different solution than JB weld? We might be able to sleeve the area at last resort. Any help would be appreciated.

Pictures might help.
Is the engine a T, E or S matching numbers to the chassis.
If not you might consider just replacing it. 2.2 cases can be pretty cheap to source. I thing I have a few.

HawgRyder · HawgRyder's Garage

Small point...there is no such thing as a freeze plug...sorry.
They are core plugs...and if inserted correctly...they do not come out until 10 seconds after the case has cracked.
Just one of the things that bugs me...once again..sorry for the rant.
Bob

Rusty 356 · 05-09-2013, 05:24 AM

Rants are okay, maybe a welch plug. At any rate Henry, I"ll take some pics later today. I think we may have on available on utube.
This is a 71 T just purchased by an F18 pilot from the family of the original owner, numbers matching. 72K miles.

Henry Schmidt · Henry Schmidt's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rusty 356

Rants are okay, maybe a welch plug. At any rate Henry, I"ll take some pics later today. I think we may have on available on utube.
This is a 71 T just purchased by an F18 pilot from the family of the original owner, numbers matching. 72K miles.

I look forward to the pictures but I think I have a blank 3R case that you could number if all else fails.

Rusty 356 · 05-09-2013, 09:12 AM

1971 Porsche 911T oil leak - YouTube

Keep trying to learn new technology, which is about 15 years old by now.

Henry Schmidt · Henry Schmidt's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rusty 356

1971 Porsche 911T oil leak - YouTube

Keep trying to learn new technology, which is about 15 years old by now.

That leak is something I haven't seen before.

Remove the plug (drill,tap and slide hammer), grind and weld the case. Replace the plug with a slightly large one.
If you have trouble finding the magnesium rod, let me know. I have a stick or two I can send you.
Cheers

PFM · 05-09-2013, 10:15 AM

Rusty,

I will toss out a hunch, the factory plug was removed at some point a one was fabricated to replace it. The fabricated plug is likely solid and when driven home split the boss. Just a hunch.

winders · 05-09-2013, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Henry Schmidt

I look forward to the pictures but I think I have a blank 3R case that you could number if all else fails.

That would be dishonest......

Scott

Henry Schmidt · Henry Schmidt's Garage

In actuality, if you own the case you own the number. Porsche dealers did this quite often back in the day. If it was common practice back in the day, it might be impossible to detect. Restoring the proper number is not dishonest. A lack of disclosure to a third party may very well be.

winders · 05-09-2013, 10:40 AM

Henry,

The whole point of a "numbers matching car" is that the car has the original engine. If you stamp a case with the original engine number, that is deceitful. This guy is fixing a '71 911 and wants to keep the matching engine if he can because it makes the car more valuable. Did blank cases get stamped with the original number back in the day? I guess. But doing so today on a classic numbers matching 911 would be for one reason only: deceit.

Scott

winders · 05-09-2013, 10:51 AM

Henry,

Frankly, I am surprised you would suggest such a thing. This statement is scary from a guy that might do engine work on older "numbers matching" cars:

"If it was common practice back in the day, it might be impossible to detect. Restoring the proper number is not dishonest. A lack of disclosure to a third party may very well be."

That "may" in the last sentence is particular disturbing and disappointing....

Scott

Aurel · Aurel's Garage

As far as I am concened, I would be more concerned about having an engine properly rebuilt or not, rather than having engine numbers properly matching or not...of course having both is the ideal situation, but if the case is cracked...

Rusty 356 · 05-09-2013, 11:50 AM

We have her apart again, it appears that the leak initiated as a result of the JB not adhering to the welch plug. We will give her one more try and allow for additional curing time prior to firing her up.
Will keep you guys posted. Trying to stay focused on the issue at hand, not so much numbers matching at this time.
I have a 356B with a worn out matching numbers case which I keep on the shelf and running a nice 912 engine in the car. The case will go with the car if sold.
Appreciate the help on this one. Don't really want to pull the engine apart at this time.
The owner is looking for a set of deep sixes. I have two very nice ones if someone has just two they want to move.

Henry Schmidt · Henry Schmidt's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by winders

Henry,

Frankly, I am surprised you would suggest such a thing. This statement is scary from a guy that might do engine work on older "numbers matching" cars:

"If it was common practice back in the day, it might be impossible to detect. Restoring the proper number is not dishonest. A lack of disclosure to a third party may very well be."

That "may" in the last sentence is particular disturbing and disappointing....

Scott

Wow, thanks for the judgement.
Just so I'm clear, how much of the engine must be original for you [oh keep of what's right] to consider it original. Does piston replacement negate the "original " status?
When the factory restored Seinfeld's "first 911" with a new case with the original number was that deceitful?

Daniel Cooper · 05-09-2013, 03:10 PM

Hear Hear !

James Brown · James Brown's Garage

numbers matching? who really cares, it is a repair of a part, if you must, sell the bad case with the car.

winders · 05-09-2013, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Henry Schmidt

Wow, thanks for the judgement.
Just so I'm clear, how much of the engine must be original for you [oh keep of what's right] to consider it original. Does piston replacement negate the "original " status?
When the factory restored Seinfeld's "first 911" with a new case with the original number was that deceitful?

Henry,

Now I know where you draw the line.......what they don't know won't hurt them, right?

Scott

Henry Schmidt · Henry Schmidt's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by winders

Henry,

Now I know where you draw the line.......what they don't know won't hurt them, right?

Scott

The truth is: you know less than nothing about me and I find your accusations offensive.

The internet is a interesting place where an absolute zero (that's you Scott) can challenge my integrity by simply distorting what is said.

I come here to offer options and you come here to cast aspersions. Why all the spite?

James Brown · James Brown's Garage

look at for sale adds that state numbers matching engine/trans/frame then look at what they did to maintain it. Most every part is listed as being replaced (crank, pistons, cylinders, cams, valves, heads, fan, ignition, induction system, etc) BUT the case is the same. numbers matching? sure. original? no way. It would never bother me having another engine in my car as long as i know it is properly repaired/modified. Keep going Henry