Used Cayenne experts?
 

The other thread I started about the one on BaT got me wanting more info on these beasts. I know there is a lot of ownership experience here plus some pro mechanics, what can you guys tell me about years/models to avoid/seek out, mechanical pitfalls, etc.?

I know that they are awesome drivers and owners love them. I know that they drink fuel like there is no tomorrow. Just wondering if significant changes happened other than the total redesign of 2011?

TIA. :cool:

Can't offer much on the changes but will comment on the fact that my '15 Diesel gets amazing gas mileage, at least compared to my previous X5 diesel. I absolutely love it, great daily driver, tow and road trip vehicle. I got a CPO with extended warranty for 8 years or 100K miles because of dieselgate. Looking forward to many more miles covered under warranty but haven't had any issues at all so far.

I am not a pepper wagon expert but have been toying with the idea of adding one to the fleet . In my research via the net the V6 models have less engine issues than their V8 cousins . I think it was 2008 or 2009 when the V6 went to 3.6 litres , if you can find a clean one I would recommend it . Like any used Porsche get the cleanest and with the best records you can . I am not 100 % sure but I don't think any of the V6 models suffered from the " coolant pipe " issues .

If you are going to do a lot of towing or you carry four passengers on a regular basis then maybe the V8 is a better option . I have been told by a local Porsche guru that the V8's suffer from bore scoring but it's kind of like the IMS......... hit or miss . Same expert said the bottom ends are bullet proof .

Owned a 2006 base model; don't be afraid of the 6 cylinder.
I accumulated over 40,000 miles towing my 85 Carrera track-car on a steel open trailer, and never felt it was going to run out of guts.
Just don't go looking for any trophies in the stop-light drags.
Bill K

2015/2016 S models are most excellent...

I just paid again to have the seat recliner motor replaced, died the same as the last one. Not for the weak at heart. Also I need another instrument cluster because the turn signal speaker is out again. Might just live with that one since it's a bigger headache to get it replaced.

Mine has been the typical German Car ownership experience. Its been good, but I have had a few whoppers . The steering lock went out. huge money to fix the right way. One guy in the country repairs them, and I had to wait about 6 weeks .
The tailgate locked itself shut . It honestly , took me a few days to get it back open. I had to resort to violence . Easy fix once it was open. The damn auto closer closed, and locked on tight, never to be released again .
My coolant pipes were done before my ownership, and so was the prop shaft bearing .
I've had a few check engine lights, . My accelerator pedal sensor went out, I have had to replace both headlight ballasts now. Some vacuum leaks, and a catalytic convertor.
Thing goes like stink. Not much can pass it . It gets horrible gas mileage, and its not easy on tires . Driver door sags a bit .
2004 turbo 125,000 miles .
It was my wifes daily in and out of the city for 2 years. I kind of took it back over , and it has grown on me .
Not BMW unreliable, but not Honda reliable either .
Overall, not that bad to work on . Lots of info online

Forgot, we had the tailgate problem too. Oh and the center bearing twice.

my parents have an 2011base v6 with now about 70k miles on it that my mom drives. she loves it, my pops hates it. wants to do brakes on it and it requires a special torx type bit for the job that to this point has dissuaded him. 4-5 other nagging issues that drive him crazy such as the AC now works only in manual mode (climate zones are out), constantly getting a low coolant error message in error as the reservoir is topped off, wheel finish is chipping off and a few other things that escape me at this point.

not many indy Porsche shops will touch them so the stealership is the only option for such repairs and they are expensive as im sure you all are aware. pops wants to get rid of it and get her something new (not another pepper wagon) with a warrantee and absent of the nagging issues they've been experiencing the last couple years. im not aware of what years to look out for, but pops (and I) believe it will start to cost stupid money to keep it right moving forward.

like I said, my mom loves it, so pops is in an unenviable position and would not buy another one.

On my 4th used Cayenne. Upgraded my S to a turbo for the turning lights. My S had air suspension (an option on the S). The turbo was great but got totalled. Got another turbo and it got totalled within a month of getting it. Went back to an S titanium edition. It has the turning lights, but not the air suspension. Rides a comparitively rougher without air suspension and the titanium is a little sportier.

Replaced just the turn signal speaker on my first S. No biggy. Also replaced the water pump and valve cover gaskets. New brake booster on the first turbo. Neither was what I would consider expensive, under $500. Otherwise no issues.

The current Titanium had a 4wd system fault light. But a low battery. Replacing the battery fixed fwd light.
Really like the silvery/white gage faces.

The two turbos and the titanium were/are 2006 with just over 120,000 miles.

Thanks for all the replies so far. What on earth is a "turn signal speaker?" :confused:

Also, what is the coolant pipe problem again? Do they crack or leak under the intake manifold? Big job to fix? Thanks again.

There is a speaker mounted to the gauge cluster for the turn signal clicks and other buzzers, bells, and notification noises.

Coolant pipes are plastic and crack/leak. Not that big of a deal except all the other stuff the leaking coolant messes up that is in the cam valley. They are replaced with metal pipes.

Are the coolant pipes still an issue on the newer ones, (2011+)?

Coolant pipes were upgraded on the first facelift on 2009. The kit in the early models isn’t a ton of money but you have to pull the intake. Supposedly not a bad DIY job.

I owned a 2009 GTS, drove a 2012 S, and a 2006 base model. The PASM air suspension is generally reliable by air suspension standards and offers fantastic handling, body control, and comfort, I would highly recommend it. Fortunately many S and all of the Turbo and GTS models have it. The sport seats are way better than the standard seats, standard on the GTS. Sport exhaust is a must have option, again standard on the GTS and optional on the others. Finally Sport Chrono is a nice option, really wakes up the responsiveness. Again standard on the GTS and optional on the others. Notice a trend?:D

If I were to get another it would be a GTS. The base model with a V6 was an absolute dog in my book, totally underwhelming. The newer S was competent but honestly boring, and it didn’t have a meaningful sporting feel. Just a good luxury SUV. The GTS is the best driving SUV that money can buy IMHO. Drives like a sports sedan, and comes with all of the good options standard. One note is that the interiors get progressively better with each generation, which is the biggest reason I would spring for something newer than my old 2009. While I would still personally prefer a sports sedan (hence my E63), the GTS is fantastic for an SUV.

2011 V8 3rd owner... other than an annoying leak on the floor due to clogged drain (which I had cleaned 6 months ago), has been trouble free as my DD. Granted I did see a few things in the service history that were fixed under warranty, and I guess that’s the important piece for me. POs took really good care of it.

I bought a CPO 2011 turbo in 2015 for from a Porsche dealer for half the window sticker. Within the first few months it died on me twice. It started after several minutes but it’s scary driving along and having the engine just die! The dealer replaced the high pressure fuel pump the first time then it did it again. Then they replaced the low pressure fuel pump and the fuel control box and that fixed it. A tail light went out that was covered by the warranty. Just before the 2 year warranty ran out I had the dealer give it a once over and they replaced the transfer case.

When the warranty expired Porsche had not yet recalled it for the camshaft adjuster bolts but I rolled the dice. About a month later the recall came out and I had the bolts replaced.

I’ve replaced brake pads, air filters, a battery, and done oil changes myself with a durametric to reset the computer. I’ve also cleaned the sunroof drains. The horns were barely working so I replaced them with hella horns which required removing the front bumper. I recently changed the transfer case fluid since it’s a known weak spot.

I had an air bag light come on that I couldn’t reset but it went away after a few days.

We are on our second Cayenne Turbo. First was an 05. We had it 6 years and ran it up to 225,000kms (140K miles). Great vehicle. Replaced a driveshaft bearing and then around 100k miles replaced the suspension bushings. We sold it 4 years ago and we still service it at our shop.

Current one is a 2011 Turbo, we have had it for 4 years and it has about 120,000kms (75K miles). It gets about 50% better mileage than the 05 did. Far better interior layout, amazing seats, is lighter and handles significantly better. Have had no real issues with it. Brakes for this model are expensive though. We have an ecu tune in it and cat delete pipes. It is ridiculously fast. Can break traction with a roll on in second gear. Wife has a heavy right foot so the power gets used.

That said, as much as I love this vehicle, we would probably have a tuned Macan Turbo if we did not have our 2 boxers.

We service quite a few Cayennes from across the model years. The 2011 onward 958 ones certainly seem to have fewer gremlin type issues than what we have seen on the earlier 955 models.

I get asked all the time what I think of it. I tell people that of the 35 or so Porsches I have owned , it is in my top 5 favorites for sure. And those who know me know I am a sports car/race car junkie... :)

Cheers

Everyone is mentioning the poor gas mileage. And yes it eats brake pads and tires on the 955 first years especially but the reason is this is a VERY heavy vehicle.
Every car now has 5 star crash ratings but nobody talks about the physics of a light car vs a heavy car (think of a cats cradle). I'm very happy with a heavy Cayenne so when a texter/drunk hits me or my family we will have every advantage. Yet the turbo engine can move it very nicely. I'll pay for the fuel and brake pads.
My 04 is at 99k miles and one of the cheapest cars I've owned (do work myself). It's amazing what you can get for the money now.

You won’t find anything similar with better MPG. That just comes with the territory.

I have a 2006 Cayenne TT. I bought it CPO about 6 years ago. Despite being 13 years old, it still hauls the mail.

RKD, OneWhippedPuppy, and David summed up the issues of different years/models.

For reference:

955: 2003 - 2006 models
- oldest, cheapest, and least attractive exterior styling
- identical interior to the later 957s
- very capable vehicle with H/L transfer case and 7500lbs towing capacity

957: 2008 - 2010 models
- essentially the same car as the 955, with a facelift
- handsome styling, better (bigger) brakes
- some risk of bore scoring on the 2008/2009 V8s which is a big bummer
- direct fuel injection gets better fuel mileage

958: 2011 - 2018 models
- newer, more jelly bean body style
- weighs 500lbs less than 955/7s
- better fuel economy, faster performance and better handling
- more modern interior
- lacks H/L transfer case (but honestly, no one ever used it)
- Additional performance options like active suspension and torque vectoring
- Diesel engine option

In my opinion, the Turbo is almost always your best used value/choice, unless you're really focused on lowest purchase cost and/or best fuel mileage. The turbos have enormous power and are usually spec'd with (most) all the options including air suspension, which is also a must. The Cayenne air suspension is one of the best - - sporty and comfortable, even without active suspension.

My personal opinion is that they all require regular and proactive maintenance - - in my experience, that works out to about 15-25 cents per mile (excluding fuel) for DIY maintenance depending on highway /city and driving style. As mentioned above, they eat tires, brakes, and gasoline. I get about 10mpg, and ~15k miles on a set of tires. But the smiles are worth it.

I would never recommend one to someone that does not do their own wrenching. Dealer costs for maintenance on the Cayenne would be a total nightmare - - easily 3x my estimate above. Cheap (<$200) Porsche-specific scan tools can diagnose/reset most everything on the car, and the DIY community/forum support (RennList) is very good.

Each model has some bug-a-boo repair that costs several thousand to fix, but it's usually a once and done (or a once every 100k miles) issue. The only heartbreaker issue is bore scored V8s in the 2006-2009 manufacturing window - - Google that before you buy one. A Cayenne with a blown engine is a most likely a part out car.

The Turbo S and the GTS models carry a collectible premium. Not worth it in my opinion as the "regular" turbo is not much different than the "Turbo S" levels of performance and clearly exceeds the GTS (although the GTS does often have slightly better styling and did come with a 6 speed manual option which is coveted by some).

Good luck!

What is the mpg of a Cayenne, let's say a 958. Suppose you drive with a light foot vs a heavy foot?

Edit : just saw above post. They don't really get 10 mpg do they? Surely with a light foot you can get substantially better mileage than that!? What's the mpg at a steady 70 mph highway?

Hell my old '96 Range Rover LWB got 15 mpg in town. My F250 460 X-cab 4x4 got 10-12 mpg - carrying a freaking camper.

Any experience with either the diesel or the hybrid?

I was looking for a used Cayenne but ended up with a 2011 VW Touareg TDI and love it.
I've only checked the fuel mileage once since we bought it in May and it was 27 MPG.
I expect the Cayenne diesel would be similar.

According to EPA numbers, the diesel gets pretty decent mileage, (better than the hybrid), the hybrid gets disappointing numbers and the gas models are all about the same. The surprising thing is that the V-6 BARELY gets better mileage than the V-8 turbo. This is for the later Cayennes, which I am focused on now.

Here are the numbers:

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/PowerSearch.do?action=noform&path=1&year1=2012&yea r2=2013&make=Porsche&baseModel=Cayenne&srchtyp=ymm

With a light foot, 955 Cayenne TT can get 15-17mpg on the freeway during extended cruising. Mix any city in that and the mileage quickly plummets. My 10mpg figure is mostly city and spirited driving. The direct injected 957s were a couple mpg better, and the lighter 958s a few more. So a 958 TT might see 20ish on the highway with a light foot. Non-turbo and V6s were better.

The diesels are easily 10 - 15mpg better - - mid 20s to 30ish. I don't know them as well, but they have a strong following. They were subject to Dieselgate and have an extended engine warranty which is a plus. But they also have some carbon deposit issues which are an extra maintenance item.

This post scares me a little. I'm looking at out-of-warrantee 2012-13 turbos and I can handles the expensive tires and brake pads but eating transfer cases and HPFPs might be a deal breaker. I appreciate you sharing your direct experience, thanks.

Then this one makes me want one again. The tuned 958 w exhaust sounds like a fun DD. As for the early ones, I could never own a 10mpg vehicle unless it was an amazing muscle car or a Ferrari or similar, not a DD. You have to remember that we pay close to double the price for fuel here as opposed to the rest of the country. It would cost an absolute fortune to run an older Cayenne in CA. between normal wear items and fuel, not to mention repairs. :eek:

The newer ones I could rationalize because it would do absolutely everything in one car; fun DD, tow trailers, ski vehicle, 22 mpg road trips carrying everything I own, etc...

2012 958. V6 loaded. 80k miles. Older VW V6 cast iron design. No issues really

I do a lot of preventive maintenance. Going good. Would love to put 200k miles and report back
Very happy with it.

Does absolutely everything. Including towing to the track. Towing package is awesome. Changes gearing and timing. Full torque at 2500 rpm. You don't even know you hauling a trailer.

Drive it on the beach. Goes skiing

23mpg cruise control
16mpg summer towing
17mpg in town

Don't need or miss turbo power. I'm not a red light drag racer. Speed limit is still 65.
Don't need air suspension. It doesn't age well here with the salt.

Any large heavy vehicle with a gas engine will have a hard time with MPG . My wife's 2010 Volvo XC90 weighs about 4500 pounds so similar to a Cayenne . Ours is a 3.2 straight six and the best we have achieved on the highway has been 20.6 per the on board computer . And it is a front wheel drive not all wheel .

I think a Cayenne diesel would be a sweet rig but they are much harder to find .

My '04 TT had the fuel pump fail as well. Really not too unreasonable to happen once in 170k miles. All one has to do is pull the fuse for that pump and the car will switch to the second one...so no need to get stuck by the road. One should replace both while you are in there (downright malpractice for a wrench not to do so)...as the second one will probably fail soon after and you already are working in the same area under the back seat (one on either side of the hump). It is not a difficult DIY project. I paid an indy wrench to do mine...but he screwed it up a bit and I had to fix it myself (redo install) but it did not require additional parts. The fuel tank is like a saddle over the driveshaft hump and has a pump for each side.

I think I get about 14-16 MPG. It doesn't seem to care if I am towing a 911 on a trailer at 80mph or tooling around town. Maintenance is about the same as with any vehicle...it is just harder to find someone else to do it right for a reasonable price. I was initially scared to work on it....but now, treat it like the rest of the herd (once I broke down and bought a durametric to read/reset codes). I only get someone else to do the things I don't want to do. I just did the brakes myself and while the parts were massive (and not cheap)...the effort was not unreasonable. Straight forward once you have the unusual tools. I am weak on preventative maintenance...do not change the oil as often as I should, etc...but the car looks and drives like new at 16 years old 170K Mi. I bought it well optioned/used at just under 50k miles at much less than half original sticker price, so I really cannot complain.

It does use a lot of tires, but it is a heavy vehicle for the soft compound tires that most of us use. It is probably not that different from an similar sized performance vehicle.

Gas is commonly $3.50 here and has been over $4.00 in the last several years. I sold the Range Rover when gas was $4.00 and got a Prius, and boy that was a good thing. The only way I could own a 10-15 mpg vehicle is if it were hardly ever driven.

I pay from about $2.04 to 2.10 a gallon for regular and 30 cents more for the midgrade I run in my TT. I use a Cayenne as a daily driver...but the taxes and insurance are so low (and no payments) that I would need to get 100 mpg to replace it. Plus, I use it to tow (when things are too big to go inside the cargo area with the seats down)...so I would need another car/truck for those duties. I have also used it to pull stumps...it has a lot of utility

i have a 08 turbo i purchased with 114k on the clock in 2017. I now have 165k on the clock and three sets of michelin pilot sport a/s3 tire sets! no other major problems, oil changes every 10k. no lights and works outstanding, just eats tires (295/35/21) ugg

The later plug-in hybrid Cayenne is the model I'd consider, maybe. 14 miles electric range means it would be running on battery for half or more of our daily usage, if we plugged it in every time it is in the driveway. I would probably remember to do that. My wife probably wouldn't. So for me, the plug-in hybrid wouldn't be terribly expensive to run - until our gas is $5+ which is probably going to happen in the next few years.

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/PowerSearch.do?action=noform&path=1&year1=2014&yea r2=2017&make=Porsche&baseModel=Cayenne&srchtyp=ymm

But the later models haven't depreciated enough to make them interesting.

Our 05 Turbo got around 14mpg around town, did far better on the highway. Our 2011 gets around 18mpg around down but is considerably more efficient on the highway. But, if you bury your foot into on the highway the difference is less.

Did two identical drives a couple of summers ago one week apart. Here to the interior of the Province over high mountain passes. First drive had wife with me and my two racing bicycles on the back of the truck. Never really got into the boost much, drove about 125kmh once in the mountains. Sipped fuel. Fast forward a week and it is just me that needs to get back up with my bikes for some racing. I leave late but still need to arrive on time for a group dinner. I get behind a Z06 vette and an M3 once we get in the hills. Figure they can find the radar for me. We average about 165kmh in the mountains. I'm in the boost a fair bit :). I don't have the exact numbers but the first trip was 3:40. Second trip was around sub 3:05. But I burned approx an extra 1/3-2/5 of a tank....

Just curious in your opinion why is it such a tire eater ? Is it just the raw power ? Or performance alignment ? Too soft a tire compound ? If I understand your statement in 51k you have gone through 3 sets of tires , that seems excessive to me . But maybe not .

I’m not trying to scare you away with my Cayenne experience. I still love it and can’t think of anything I’d rather have. I would try to buy a CPO if possible so any issues are sorted out before it becomes a DIY vehicle. If not CPO then make sure it’s priced accordingly. I found that Porsche dealers had the best used deals anyway. It seems like other dealers think they’re worth more than they are.

Rennlist seems to have the best Cayenne forum so you can research there.

Thanks for the data points, they are valuable. I went by my local dealer, (Beverly Hills Porsche), yesterday to check out a used 2012 Cayenne turbo they have. I drove it and was not at all impressed but two things; A) it was not a great example and B) a drive around Westwood, even on a Sunday, never really shows off a Porsche in its best light.

When I jumped in it, the dash display was reading, "Chassis Failure" and the ride height would not adjust from its lowest setting. Maybe just a minor issue, maybe not but not a harbinger of great things in a complicated, feature laden used luxury car. The salesman let me drive it anyway and in hindsight, he probably should not have. The ride was truly awful, not merely too firm but it bounced over any undulation in the road like it had no shocks. Some malfunction of the air suspension, I guess, because they could never have sold one of these new if that was the normal ride.

It was powerful but not particularly responsive or fun in any way. It reminded me of a Bentley I've put some miles on, another powerful, heavy turbo vehicle that is not fun. I was expecting a rocket and it was a dog until you sunk your foot into it, at which time it displayed its massive lungs and would probably pull forever. Just like the Bentley. I want to say that there was something wrong w it but there were no CELs displayed, just the chassis warning.

It reminded me that I've driven one other modern Cayenne, a test drive of a new 2014 or '15 a few years back at the dealer when I was helping a lady friend buy a new car. That one was a V-8 S model and in city driving, it did absolutely nothing for me. I realize that it's an SUV and this time it was driving around the USC neighborhood, (DTLA Porsche), but old man Porsche always said that a great car should be fun to drive around the block. He meant that you do not have to take a 911 to the track or even drive fast to appreciate it, that it was enjoyable at all times. We left the dealership and continued on to other makes of cars.

All that said, I still haven't given up on them. In the lot where the turbo was, they had a slightly scratched-up black Cayenne diesel the really intrigued me. I sat in it and it was less complicated but still plenty luxurious enough w leather, heated seats, etc. It turned out that it was a dealer car that they used as a shuttle, parts runner, etc. Low miles, (41k). I made a cash offer for it on the spot that was plenty fair and he called the boss right in front of me but alas, it was not for sale. That is the model that has my interest at the moment; 400+ lbs. of torque @ 1700 rpm and ~30 mpg highway sounds like a love affair. I'm hunting the classifieds. :)

They are a a complicated, feature laden used luxury car. The driving response is adaptive, and will (when fully functional) move modes between pedestrian Toyota and psychopath Porsche, depending on use.

On gas mileage. I can easily get over 20mpg on the highway, but hoovering around 55mph is a bore. I've been surprised with how long brakes and tires last. Both are huge, I suppose.

Which year and model are you driving these days?

It's all about vehicle weight, power and driving style. If you drive a 5500lb, 500hp vehicle hard in a city setting, 10-15k miles of tire life is not surprising or particularly poor. Long, gentle highway cruising will likely extend tire by 3x or more.

The factory alignment on the Cayenne is very mild - - almost no toe, and only moderate camber (~.5 degrees negative). With correct pressure, alignment and good bushings, tire wear is very even. Hard cornering (especially with braking/acceleration) will not surprisingly accelerate outside wear of the front tires, but overall wear is very even.