E Bikes

[Jeff Higgins]

These things kind of fall between the cracks, neatly splitting existing regulations. Which, believe me, I'm all for - we are far too encumbered with regulations covering every aspect of our lives.

Which is all well and good, of course, until the day when I hear that annoying clicking sound and pull over to find one stuck in the tread of my Land Cruiser's tires. How did he get there? Why was he operating it at 37 mph on an uphill in the inside lane of a multi-lane 55 mph highway on a dark foggy morning with a non-DOT approved headlight and tail light? Why was it not licensed for highway use as a motor vehicle? Why was he not wearing the mandatory DOT approved helmet required of motorcyclists?

Lots of questions need to be answered as we integrate these things into our transportation infrastructure. And no, the "answer" is not to make existing motor vehicle traffic slow down and accommodate them...

[Brando]

Excellent video Jeff and thanks for sharing. I think this is a more prominent issue in metros. I see E-Bikes all over the place here in SoCal and they almost matched the number of cars on the road when I was last in SF.

I think Fortnine outlines it easily, that "Any geriatric or pre-pubescent can hop on one and go...", at 30+ Kph. No training, no education, just treat it like a bike and roll on that throttle. Take the carelessness of your average bicycle weenie, then give them roll-on throttle. It's like twice the entitlement with half the awareness needed.

[dedbird]

Good video and really opens up a larger discussion regarding bikes, e-bikes, pedestrians, and traffic. Let me preface this by saying that I am an avid road biker and ride a motorcycle. I also live in a mountain town and not a city, so my perspective may be somewhat different. Also agree that we don’t need more rules, just people to understand the etiquette of the roads. This applies to drivers as well. Somewhere parents stopped teaching the basics.

I have long thought that bikers had a bit of an identity crisis. Are they pedestrians or are they vehicles subject to the rules of traffic? No need to fan the anti-biker flames here as yes, they need to adhere to the rules of the road. I see them riding the sidewalks, which drives me crazy. But then, having attempted to ride a bike in some of urban area I can completely understand why. You are really taking your life into your own hands when you venture out on the streets in a big city on a bicycle. But the reality is, bikers that identify as pedestrians just fly out into crosswalks at speeds well in excess of what any pedestrian would be travelling. I had one just zip out in front of me on a crosswalk as I was exiting a roundabout this summer. He would have gone over my hood had I not slammed on the brakes. Who would have been at fault?

I could go on but all of this is just exacerbated with e-bikes. Again, and identity crisis on steroids. They think they are pedestrians but they are dong over 30mph. They think they are bikes, but they are going double the speed causing all kinds of problems. My daily bike ride is up Vail Pass in the summer. The e-bikes have no idea how to ride safely and politely. When climbing, they regularly pass me within inches going 10-15mph faster than I am going without the simple courtesy of giving space or saying on your left. Can’t count the number of times I’ve almost been hit. When descending I come around a corner only to have them riding four abreast taking up the entire uphill and downhill lanes. All this despite the no e-bikes sign at the base of the pass.

Sorry, let’s call them what they are. They are bicycles with a motor, also known as motorcycles.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

I agree - these things are dangerous because they enable people with no discipline or situational awareness (which you necessarily develop as a motorcycle rider through training and experience) to basically have the same abilities - even more actually since e-bikes can avail themselves of “gray areas” in the traffic laws that motorcyclists don’t get away with.

It’s the same reason I really do not ever want to see “flying cars”. I’ve gone through the rigor and training to get a pilot certificate from the FAA and so has (at the moment) anyone else using the National Airspace System (there are a few very limited exceptions but generally speaking that’s how it is). Given the skill (or lack thereof), discipline (or lack thereof) and respect for rules (or lack thereof) displayed by the average car driver, is it any wonder why I want these people nowhere near the NAS?

I do think e-bikes are going to be regulated soon. Government won’t pass up any opportunity to make money... er... “enhance safety”. Yeah, that’s it.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by dedbird

Sorry, let’s call them what they are. They are bicycles with a motor, also known as motorcycles.

Agreed. A bicycle with a motor - a "motor" bike. No matter how underpowered, no matter the source of the power for that motor. Pretty clear distinction. I'm old enough that my first real motorbikes absolutely had less power than these - with gasoline engines. These absolutely should not get any sort of a pass simply because they are electric.

In my younger years, I was a very avid cyclist. I raced on a local velodrome (at Marymoor Park, in Redmond, WA) into my early 20's. I commuted off and on into my fifties, averaging over 200 miles per week. I continue to ride recreationally, just not nearly at my old mileage. Today virtually all of it is on dedicated bike trails set aside for the purpose. I only mention this to illustrate that I do have some background and experience as a cyclist, on a true human powered cycle. There is a marked difference between these and any sort of motor assisted machine. A huge difference.

I'm also a lifetime motorcyclist, with well over half a million miles under my belt. And, unfortunately, the scars to show for it, even as an "ATGATT" kind of guy. And yes, motorcycles are great - I love them. That's why I have stuck with them. They do, however, require a significantly higher level of training and commitment than a bicycle. They attain much higher speeds far more easily, even the electric ones, and demand more effective safety gear. And, most importantly, how they are operated around other vehicles is of far greater concern from a safety standpoint, for both their operators and everyone around them.

Pretending these e-bikes are simply easier to ride bicycles for the older, infirm, less fit or intelligent (like folks in Eugene) is a grave mistake. And we have been seeing the results of that charade - lots of these fools are getting hurt. I've never been one for more regulation, but maybe it's time the adults protect these folks from themselves, and us from them. They have proven themselves incapable of exercising the discretion necessary to do this for themselves.