I Got "Road Raged" Today!

[McLovin]

My goal on the road is to not engage with anyone in any way.
Thus, I never “brake check,” “shower check” or do any other type of “checking.”
I never try to impede anyone, no matter how “wrong” they are.
I never make any effort to “educate” or “enlighten” others.
If I’m doing 80 and someone comes up behind me doing 90 I’ll promptly move over and let them go.
If I see someone driving like a maniac my goal is to get away from them as quietly as possible (almost always by getting out of their way and letting them go ahead).
You never know who is behind the wheel of other cars and I have no interest in finding out.

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by McLovin

My goal on the road is to not engage with anyone in any way.
Thus, I never “brake check,” “shower check” or do any other type of “checking.”
I never try to impede anyone, no matter how “wrong” they are.
I never make any effort to “educate” or “enlighten” others.
If I’m doing 80 and someone comes up behind me doing 90 I’ll promptly move over and let them go.
If I see someone driving like a maniac my goal is to get away from them as quietly as possible (almost always by getting out of their way and letting them go ahead).
You never know who is behind the wheel of other cars and I have no interest in finding out.

^^^^ This is how I strive to be ..... now. Vash made a post about "chillin' out" a few years ago which caused me to reach this point .... it isn't easy . Cliff and McLuv are very smart guys .... I used to be sorta stoopid in situations when I could have been less stoopid but chose not to be.... fortunately it never happened with the "wrong, crazy person" and that's just beating the odds.... again.

Rethink your actions Jeff .... and rethink what "might have been".... regardless of what "you thought" .... and please, everyone.... be safer out there.

I miss Cliff, but learned a lot from him before he "poof .... goned!"

Happy New Year everyone!

[Bugsinrugs]

I was the lead car in the left lane stopped at a signal on an off ramp that merged onto a four lane street. I needed to get all the way into the left lane to turn left into Costco. When the light turned green I proceeded to merge left as the traffic on the road had a red light. I did not realize the guy behind me thought he could pass me on the left while I was merging left. He laid on his horn surprising the crap out of me. He then pulled around me on the right barking out profanities and looking very angry. I rolled down the passenger window and said that I didn’t see him( he was in the wrong) and that I was sorry. Diffused the whole situation. Getting into a brawl at 70 isn’t worth it anymore. I say sorry to everyone…. Mostly my wife!

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by KC911

^^^^ This is how I strive to be ..... now. Vash made a post about "chillin' out" a few years ago which caused me to reach this point .... it isn't easy . Cliff and McLuv are very smart guys .... I used to be sorta stoopid in situations when I could have been less stoopid but chose not to be.... fortunately it never happened with the "wrong, crazy person" and that's just beating the odds.... again.

Rethink your actions Jeff .... and rethink what "might have been".... regardless of what "you thought" .... and please, everyone.... be safer out there.

I miss Cliff, but learned a lot from him before he "poof .... goned!"

Happy New Year everyone!

Hmmm... I would be very interested in hearing just what you believe my actions to have been. Which ones I need to rethink, and why. I'm not being argumentative, nor defensive here - I value your opinion, and would honestly like to hear what you think I did, and how you think I should have done it differently.

[astrochex]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

Hmmm... I would be very interested in hearing just what you believe my actions to have been. Which ones I need to rethink, and why. I'm not being argumentative, nor defensive here - I value your opinion, and would honestly like to hear what you think I did, and how you think I should have done it differently.

I’m obviously not KC, but I am still curious why you thought turning on your high beams was the “right thing” at the particular moment, especially since it was obvious the guy was already highly agitated.

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

Hmmm... I would be very interested in hearing just what you believe my actions to have been. Which ones I need to rethink, and why. I'm not being argumentative, nor defensive here - I value your opinion, and would honestly like to hear what you think I did, and how you think I should have done it differently.

By tapping your brakes and not doing EVERYTHING possible to de-escalate the encounter with an idiot driver, you made it worse imo. I have actually hit someone who did the "slow down" routine before and .... they pulled off and I drove off. I've also tapped my brakelights too, but I've learned and strive to be like McLuv these days .

And I wasn't amped on meth or just a crazy SOB with a gun who did NOT GAF about his or your life.... but some are.

It's not easy .... but I try.

Be well Jeff .... live to post another day

[Chocaholic]

A different question:

If you’d known for a fact that the guy had just been called to the hospital following a family member’s tragic accident...would you have behaved any differently?

That should always be our assumption when in that situation. It can be your motivation to effectively and unemotionally get out of the way without prompting anger. If it turns out the guy was just an ass...the end result is the same...no altercation.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by astrochex

I’m obviously not KC, but I am still curious why you thought turning on your high beams was the “right thing” at the particular moment, especially since it was obvious the guy was already highly agitated.

I'm obviously being a smart ass when I say it was the "right thing" to do. It clearly was not, and I know that. But, yeah - I finally got a bit peeved when this ass hat escalated this whole thing by trying to brake check me. Like I said, he was in front of me, free and clear, on his way. Absolutely no reason for what he did at that point. So, yeah, I wanted him to know he had my full attention, and that I was thinking about him...

Originally Posted by KC911

By tapping your brakes and not doing EVERYTHING possible to de-escalate the encounter with an idiot driver, you made it worse imo. I have actually hit someone who did the "slow down" routine before and .... they pulled off and I drove off. I've also tapped my brakelights too, but I've learned and strive to be like McLuv these days .

And I wasn't amped on meth or just a crazy SOB with a gun who did NOT GAF about his or your life.... but some are.

It's not easy .... but I try.

Be well Jeff .... live to post another day

Thank you. Like I said, I do value your opinion.

I've always seen the quick little brake light tap (as opposed to actually brake checking) as a way to tell someone to back off, they are too close. Maybe not "polite", but I've never seen it as "aggressive", either, in the absence of a real "brake check". Just "informative". I'm not sure how else to communicate that I feel someone is following too close?

I've lost track of how many times I've used it that way. I have never, ever been met with this kind of a reaction, until this incident. Most folks get the message and simply back off. No harm, no foul on either end. I guess this one kind of "broke my cherry", so to speak. Totally unexpected reaction from this guy.

Like you say, I absolutely made things worse. I obviously had no idea that what I saw as a somewhat innocuous action - flashing my brake lights - would do that. Totally outside my realm of experiences, until then. If I had any idea, I would not have done that. I learned a lesson, for sure.

But I guess I'm not sure how to "communicate" with tailgaters going forward... "Horn broke, look for finger"? I don't flip anyone off under any circumstances, for any reason, much less in traffic. And I never, ever honk at anyone. This incident is an example of that - I flipped my high beams rather than leaning on the horn. I see the former as less aggressive, less of a "challenge" to other motorists. Maybe I'm wrong about that?

In the end, I am glad that we are having this discussion. I'm getting some valuable feedback. I hope this conversation is not only helping me, but helping all of us in working out what we might do when confronted with a similar chain of events.

One thing that occurs to me at this point is that I may not have sufficiently communicated the timeline in which all of this occurred. I feel that timeline might not have come through very clearly. So, to be clear, this whole thing took, at the most, ten seconds. Ten seconds from this guy beside me on my left, seeing he didn't have enough room, to when he threw the coffee cup at my windshield.

Here I find myself, a day later, after a long conversation with you guys, re-evaluating my choices. That's a good thing. Some would accuse you guys of "Monday morning quarterbacking", but the mere fact I threw this out before you should demonstrate that was exactly what I was looking for. Feedback. Positive and negative. I've been around here long enough to know I was going to get plenty of both. Some of it very thoughtful, very well considered and presented. And much appreciated. Thank you.

[Superman]

Honestly, I've been grinning through this conversation because my take on Jeff is that he's not naturally a "back down" sort of guy. He's more of a "poke the sore spot while grinning" type. And yet, here he is acknowledging the wisdom of not poking. Perhaps his testosterone levels have come down over the years. Ya think?

And this can be especially important when facing someone with a concealed latte.

[speeder]

Road rage is a no-win situation. It is hard sometimes to let bullies win out on the highway but if you engage in any way, either you, "win,' meaning that you were the crazier one; or more likely, the other person escalates and then it's a matter of who is dumber and wants to take it further.

[speeder]

Originally Posted by McLovin

My goal on the road is to not engage with anyone in any way.
Thus, I never “brake check,” “shower check” or do any other type of “checking.”
I never try to impede anyone, no matter how “wrong” they are.
I never make any effort to “educate” or “enlighten” others.
If I’m doing 80 and someone comes up behind me doing 90 I’ll promptly move over and let them go.
If I see someone driving like a maniac my goal is to get away from them as quietly as possible (almost always by getting out of their way and letting them go ahead).
You never know who is behind the wheel of other cars and I have no interest in finding out.

Wise words. Stay safe and Happy NY, everyone!

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by Chocaholic

A different question:

If you’d known for a fact that the guy had just been called to the hospital following a family member’s tragic accident...would you have behaved any differently?

That should always be our assumption when in that situation. It can be your motivation to effectively and unemotionally get out of the way without prompting anger. If it turns out the guy was just an ass...the end result is the same...no altercation.

A legitimate question. Let's remember how I "behaved", though. He was crawling up my bumper, so I gave him what I believed to be (re-evaluating that, see above) the universal "back off" signal - a quick flash of my brake lights. That's it, that's all.

To answer your question, yes - even if I knew he was rushing to the hospital, I would have sent the same signal. In that case, with the intent of trying to communicate "hey buddy, if you hope to make it there at all, you might want to calm it down a bit". Remember - I had nowhere to go. No way to get out of his way and let him through. I was sandwiched between two other cars. I could not change lanes, and I certainly could not speed up sufficiently in my '93 Land Cruiser to outpace the two cars next to me and let him through.

From that point on his behavior made it abundantly clear that he was experiencing no such emergency. Like I've said several times already, he was free and clear, on his way, clear sailing ahead. And, again as I have stated several times, I never did a thing to hinder his progress. Held my lane, held my speed.

So, yeah - I would not have done anything differently, because I was essentially unable to do anything to help him.

[KFC911]

I thank Jeff for this thread .... and doubt many of us are naturally the "let it go" type of personality when interacting with an idiot.... I know I'm not . That said, I've learned from my own stupid actions in hindsight, and from all of you guys posting all these years... but it isn't easy even now.

I've been doing better tho'

Thank you Jeff and all of you guys ....

[stevej37]

^^^ You're welcome.

[McLovin]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

I've always seen the quick little brake light tap (as opposed to actually brake checking) as a way to tell someone to back off, they are too close. Maybe not "polite", but I've never seen it as "aggressive", either, in the absence of a real "brake check". Just "informative". I'm not sure how else to communicate that I feel someone is following too closely

But I guess I'm not sure how to "communicate" with tailgaters going forward...

I’d suggest that you reconsider your presumption that you are required to communicate with tailgaters.

[Chocaholic]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

A legitimate question. Let's remember how I "behaved", though. He was crawling up my bumper, so I gave him what I believed to be (re-evaluating that, see above) the universal "back off" signal - a quick flash of my brake lights. That's it, that's all.

To answer your question, yes - even if I knew he was rushing to the hospital, I would have sent the same signal. In that case, with the intent of trying to communicate "hey buddy, if you hope to make it there at all, you might want to calm it down a bit". Remember - I had nowhere to go. No way to get out of his way and let him through. I was sandwiched between two other cars. I could not change lanes, and I certainly could not speed up sufficiently in my '93 Land Cruiser to outpace the two cars next to me and let him through.

From that point on his behavior made it abundantly clear that he was experiencing no such emergency. Like I've said several times already, he was free and clear, on his way, clear sailing ahead. And, again as I have stated several times, I never did a thing to hinder his progress. Held my lane, held my speed.

So, yeah - I would not have done anything differently, because I was essentially unable to do anything to help him.

Understood. And considering the options a day later with plenty of time to think it through (luxuries you didn’t have)...I suppose instead of the brake light, a right turn signal would indicate that you’re trying to get out of his way once there’s an opening.

Thankfully all you endured was a half cup of warm coffee and nothing more.

[oldE]

With the behavior and increasingly over reactive nature of some drivers these days, it is probably a good thing they can't hear our eyes roll.
At times I have thought a scrolling sign in rear window saying something like, "If you like my rear that much, why not buy me dinner you a$$ bandit?" But that would probably offend someone.

Best
Les

[masraum]

Originally Posted by herr_oberst

heh heh. I like that. (I also wonder if actual bump-drafting on the highway may end up being a thing in the future, the way things are going)

There are certainly times when practicing a PIT maneuver is a bit of a fantasy.

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by oldE

With the behavior and increasingly over reactive nature of some drivers these days, it is probably a good thing they can't hear our eyes roll.
At times I have thought a scrolling sign in rear window saying something like, "If you like my rear that much, why not buy me dinner you a$$ bandit?" But that would probably offend someone.

Best
Les

LOL .... You might miss out on a free dinner with Steve's Hooterz girl

[Superman]

Ha! We've had that discussion. We could turn the reflector strip above the bumpers of our G-bodied 911s into a scrolling reader. That way, we could give tailgaters some specific suggestions.