Motorcyclists

[Danskman]

Interesting thread... I too have owned motorcycles on and off for almost 25 years. I always take the attitude that Gary has - no one can see me. And I have to say, even though it is legal in CA to split lanes, I would never do it. As a rider, when I am driving my car I like to think I am aware of motorcycles on the road in my vacinity. That said, I know there have been countless times that a bike splitting lanes has startled me. If I am creeping along in traffic at between 5 - 15 MPH, and a bike "flies" by me at 25-35 MPH, it just does not seem safe for the rider. If me and the other thousand cars around me are traveling at 5-15 MPH, I am not looking for something, a bike or anything else, to pass me at 2x the speed I am doing. I would venture to say that lane splitting is safe for the rider only if his speed is not any greater than 10%-20% of the vehicles he is passing.

[zymurgist]

I was really surprised to see bikers splitting lanes in LA when I was there. Never saw that in Florida, where I grew up, or Maryland, where I live now. I don't know how many folks out there are from somewhere else where lane splitting is not legal, but I bet it's a fair percentage. On that basis alone (let alone the number of rude and inconsiderate people who seem to crowd the highways more and more each year), I wouldn't split lanes. No matter how good you are at spotting jerks, it's the one that you don't see that will do you in.

[Nor Cal driver]

Yup - really loud and obnoxious is really really annoying - to all of us.

Interesting issue this lane splitting - IMO lane splitting is not good when going over 15-20 mph faster then traffic, or if traffic is flowing along smoothly and quickly period. However, lane splitting on the freeway is safer IMO then simple city street riding with all of the cross street intersections just begging for a red light to be run and a rider or driver to be crushed..... I always look both ways before crossing the intersection and am frankly prepared to jump as high up off of my bike as I can to avoid getting crushed by a car if one runs a red right at me.

Lanesplitting - I split in the city and on the freeway - hey, I have already taken a few little bumps from cars - it's not toooo bad - but still makes for a good reason to wave at those that yield to you as you ride by smoothly and in control.

[911SC Pilot]

I ALWAYS intentionally create a bit of space for them to pass.

[elbean]

Sammyg,
Sorry you don't like loud pipes(it aint just harleys anymore), but I do think they save lives;MINE! People hear you coming and that's half the battle. Now looking at your websight and all the cars you have had i.e. turbo 914, 914V8...I guess you had silencers on those right?
Getting Old ?, hell your 6 years younger then me. Just a kid!!!

[caliber60]

I think 911 owners probably also owns bikes as well as you can see from the poll most of the votes would move over. It's will be different if it's the general public.

[Nor Cal driver]

My full exhaust system is not a silencer, that is for sure. And I do like to be heard because that does mean that I am now on the "radar" screen for those drivers.... still though - super loud and obnoxious stinks.

[Nor Cal driver]

Originally posted by BillyPilgrim
I could be wrong, but I think the law says you can't go more than 15 mph faster than the vehicle next to you. Almost all of the lane splitters I see are going about 10 mph between barely-crawling, stop-and-go traffic. This doesn't seem all that unsafe to me.

I don't ride, but my dad splits lanes all the time on his GSXR. Unfortunately, a lot of people think it's illegal here, or are just jealous that he's getting where he's going and they're stuck, so he gets people trying to block him or even spitting on him.

Yup - I believe 15mph is the allowed overage for "lane sharing" as we call it here in CA.

I do think that folks get mad at being passed when they can't go anywhere - and I do also think that many drivers unconciously and conciously speed up just to not be passed even though they are going SLOW in the FAST lane, then slow down when you have too move in back behind them, then speed up again when you go to pass again, only to finally slow down when you have passed with force and created a bit of a gap between you and them. It happpens to me every day. Like today, the guy that sped up enough to nearly have a rear end accident with the nearly stopped guy in front of him, just to keep me from passing him - when they were moving 5 miles per hour!!!!!

[sammyg2]

LOL, my turbo 914 was actually quiet as stock exept for the turbo whine. The turbo cut up the sound pulses and i had a very long exhaust pipe that ran from the top of the engine all the way back and then crossed all the way to the driver's side. I made it quiet on purpose. Sleeper.
My V8 car was loud when i first got it running. I took it down to the local muffler shop that same week and had them weld in a crossover pipe and smaller diameter extensions out the back from the mufflers to quiet it down. At idle and normal cruising is was difficult to tell it was a V8. Of course when i went WOT it was much louder due to the intake noise form the big carb but I rarely went WOT on the street and did not do it on residential streets. Again, i like the sleeper effect.

In my experience I rarely hear loud bikes until they are next to me. At that point it would be too late to change any possible outcome as far as safety. I'll pay more attention on the way home today and actually see if I can hear a loud bike coming before I would sense a quieter bike. I doubt it when they are coming up from behind. In that situation all they do is cause me to say bad things about the rider's mother

[widebody911]

Originally posted by sammyg2
At least once a day on the way home I'm sitting in traffic minding my own business when one of these low-lifes passes right by my door and rings my ears with their POS exhaust.

Amen. Especially the *****he@ds who feel the need to blip the throttle at every car window as they pass. When I see a Harley splitting lanes in my mirrors, I intentionally, but subtly, slide over to block.

The whole Harley-poser thing is out of control. I'm this "" close to rigging piano wire across the street for when the RUBs come blopping home @ 3:00am. I'm sure they wouldn't appreciate me putting on a set of track pipes and banging the rev limiter in front of their house.

Or when you see a gaggle of RUBs in front of Starbucks; what's the point of starting the bike, and then revving the ***** out of seven times in a row? If a kid in fart-pipe Honda did that, you'd laugh at him, yet it's perfectly acceptable behaviour for a 45 year-old HR Generalist with midlife-crisis compensation issues?

[sammyg2]

LOL, Thom I don't know if I'd put it quite that strongly, but it looks like we agree

[DonDavis]

Hey Billy Pilgrim, are you a Vonnegut fan or is that just a coincidence?

[Victor]

Hmm. I actually wind my window down to get a good listen when a Harley rides past. Love the sound.

[Nor Cal driver]

Originally posted by widebody911
Amen. Especially the *****he@ds who feel the need to blip the throttle at every car window as they pass. When I see a Harley splitting lanes in my mirrors, I intentionally, but subtly, slide over to block.

The whole Harley-poser thing is out of control. I'm this "" close to rigging piano wire across the street for when the RUBs come blopping home @ 3:00am. I'm sure they wouldn't appreciate me putting on a set of track pipes and banging the rev limiter in front of their house.

Or when you see a gaggle of RUBs in front of Starbucks; what's the point of starting the bike, and then revving the ***** out of seven times in a row? If a kid in fart-pipe Honda did that, you'd laugh at him, yet it's perfectly acceptable behaviour for a 45 year-old HR Generalist with midlife-crisis compensation issues?

Ok - agreed that the whole Harley / any rider poser thing is ridiculous - so is the driver / racer poser thing. That being said - keep the car out of the way - why would you expose your 911 to potential Harley chrome crash????

As far as I can tell, Harlet riders can't even split lanes because their bikes are way to wide and they typically have zero riding skills.

[jhugh]

When you get on a bike, you accept your mortality. It can come at any time, and will likely come exactly when you're NOT expecting it.

The anti-motorcycle thing is based on jealousy and machismo. When I lived in Marin, the commute to SF in a car took an hour. On my bike, it took 35 minutes. There were people I passed who wanted to kill me just because I was beating them to work. WTF? And people in cars think that because their vehicle is bigger than yours, they are bigger than you and they're going to dominate you. An old man in a Lexus, enraged at the way traffic was crawling, once intentionally rammed me and my friend as we went by on my bike. He didn't act so tough when we got off the bike, kicked his mirrors off and dared him to get out of the car.

As far as the noise thing goes, put yourself on a bike in a daily lane-splitting freeway commute. Watch the way people drive, then see how you feel about a louder exhaust note. It works. I had a Ducati 900ss with a glorious sound. Not brash & cruddy sounding like a Harley. I blipped at people from behind if they weren't seeing me or were looking like they were going to do something stupid. And if they did something stupid or gave me attitude, then damn straight they took 140 decibels of 8000rpm glory right in their ear as I went by. I know that kind of thing doesn't endear motorcyclists to the general public. But there's something cage drivers need to know... the motorcyclist is going to beat you to the city no matter what. If you block him, you won't slow him down. You'll just lose a mirror or an eardrum.

I miss my bike. But my number was up. All the adrenaline and speed is so addictive. But ultimately the same adrenaline and all the aggression it stirs up became a downer for me. Too much negativity. Not to mention the prospect of spending the rest of my life in a wheelchair. 911 was a good substitute.

[Adam]

Originally posted by Nor Cal driver:
keep the car out of the way - why would you expose your 911 to potential Harley chrome crash????

Hmm. Let me start by saying, I've ridden bikes before and it's great fun, but the potentiality to wreck is astounding. It's illegal to lane-split here too, but everyone on two wheels does it, blipping the (usually loudened) throttle at every open window etc. Even when the traffic is already stopped and waiting at the lights... WTF for??

I hate it when you're at the front of the queue, at the traffic lights, waiting for the green. Some dickhead is splitting all the way upto the front line and then pulls across in front of you, waiting for the green, also.

Then he'll adjust his gloves, scratch his butt and jerk around until well after the green has lit, making you wait while everyone else is off and moving, then roars off at WOT. That really *****s me. It's inconsideration at it's best.

Originally posted by jhugh:
If you block him, you won't slow him down. You'll just lose a mirror or an eardrum.

Were you wondering how bikers get a bad traffic reputation? Imagine if all of us 911 drivers got out of our cars and kicked people's mirrors off because we were slowed down by Joe Sixpack in his Accord?

Courtesy saves lives: and it's FREE!

[widebody911]

Originally posted by jhugh
The anti-motorcycle thing is based on jealousy and machismo.

And motorcycle ownership is of course absolutely devoid of machismo...

He didn't act so tough when we got off the bike, kicked his mirrors off and dared him to get out of the car.

Again with the machismo, oye! Did you get a matching carrying case with that ego?
Reminds of the "sport bike" idiot whose foot I ran over a while back. I was making a right turn, but was having to time my entry into traffic. D1p***** tried to go around me on the right, and of course I didn't see him; I'm in the right lane - there shouldn't be any vehicles on my right. An opening appeared, and I was off the line before he even got his foot off the ground, and I rolled my right rear 315/35 over the top his left size 9. He yelled at me, (well, [i]I]/i] didn't feel anything) so I stopped and got out. He's indignant as hell and upset at me about running over his foot, and I just ask "So what was it doing under my car? Since when are you allowed to pass on the right?" Suddenly it wasn't a big deal anymore, and he limped back onto his bike and rode off in a huff.

Watch the way people drive, then see how you feel about a louder exhaust note. It works.

Until you condition them into Pavlovian rage at the sound of a bike. I know I don't flinch any longer at the sound of a bike.

I blipped at people from behind if they weren't seeing me or were looking like they were going to do something stupid. And if they did something stupid or gave me attitude, then damn straight they took 140 decibels of 8000rpm glory right in their ear as I went by

If you were riding defensively, none of this would be necessary, save for extreme circumstances, in which case you'd be too busy dealing with the situation (ie keeping the bike upright) to wave your penis or your throttle around.

I know that kind of thing doesn't endear motorcyclists to the general public.

Gee, ya think?

But there's something cage drivers need to know... the motorcyclist is going to beat you to the city no matter what.

Horray! And the cage drivers are going to beat the semis, and the semis are going to beat the freight trains - it's a party!

Back in my fireman days (Station 14, Sunol), it seemed like every other week we were scraping another aggro biker off the pavement. "Donor cycle" my a$$, they never seemed to leave enough usable parts behind.

[island911]

Originally posted by sammyg2
. .. .
In my experience I rarely hear loud bikes until they are next to me. At that point it would be too late to change any possible outcome as far as safety. . . ..

. ..are you sure? Just to be safe maybe you ought to carry one of these below.
. . . so you can return the "safety favor" just as he passes.



Great rant, BTW.

--------
RE: lane splitting;

What exactly is the law regarding lane splitting in CA ? Does the traffic need to be below 5mph, or what?

BTW, this is big in Rome. . . though it's more like lane threading and with scotters. I was amazed as women would manuver slowly between the cars, constantly rowing the handlebars to avoid hitting mirrors. All while sitting in some goofy position to keep their bag in their lap, and their skirt inplace. heh-heh. . .great entertainment, when your stuck in traffic.

[paul571]

Interesting post epically for this board. The fact is, it is legal to split lanes in a motorcycle in California is because the motorcycle are "air-cooled" vehicles. To prevent the motorcycles from over heating and cause traffic jams, a law was passed to allowing motorcycles to split lanes in a slow moving and/or a stopped traffic condition.

So, on the same school of thought, and since we can't split lanes. I think we "air-cooled" Porsche and VW drivers should able to use the carpool lanes anytime we want here in CA. Call me crazy, but I think this is a very logical idea.

Paul

[BennyBroadcast]

10 points for knowledge of arcane legislation Paul !! :-) Now, do air-cooled vehicled need to be preceeded by a person with a red flag at all times ??