Off-Topic Forum

[jyl]

A BBS like this should have an OT forum.

It helps make a community, loyalty, and in the case of PP ultimately sales.

Also, people will post OT topics anyway. Simply deleting people's threads will send them to other BBS'es.

It's beyond me why anyone gets upset at the topic of an OT thread - excepting topics that are blatantly offensive, which I've never seen here (I mean racist and the like). If you don't like it, don't read it. I only even glance at maybe 1/10th of them.

[Zeke]

Lose the OT forum and the BS will migrate back to the other 'tech' forums.

So what if somebody emailed Wayne about the Bush thread? Why the hell did he take that personally? I would have replied to the emailer just what many of you have said here, if you don't like heat, stay away from fire.

Must have been a very threatening email.

Wayne: "This is a business site." No, this is a BBS supported by a business. The business site is Pelican and DriveWerks. I'm sorry to disagree here, Wayne, but forums are just that, forums. They will wander as they will. Witness the 911 site. Fifty percent technical info at best.

And if the OT gets shut down or everyone pisses Wayne off to the point that the Pelican site is overcontrolled, then people will leave in favor of another site which will host the activities. When one dance is closed down, poeple don't just all of a sudden stop dancing.

I guess if we are to preserve the Pelican site as we know it, politics will have to become verboten.

[ted]

Pelican is a car parts business.
Anything beyond talking car parts here has become a liability.
If one customer is lost due to the OT board it should be shut down.
If one customer’s perception is that any thread anywhere is too controversial it should be deleted.
If the OT board is shut down and OT posts migrate to technical boards those members should be banned.

It is not censorship for sake of differing opinions. It is censorship to protect the future of a person’s livelihood.
How he supports his family, his employees, pays his bills and taxes.
Shame on the OT board members that presume they should be permitted to compromise any of that.

If I were Pelican I would want to protect the business.
I would have ZERO tolerance for anything that would diminish my business.

Imagine your political views lettered on the side of your work truck,, no wait imagine some one else's political views posted on the side of you service truck. If those views (which may not agree with your own) cost you buisness and money would you continue to display them??

If Porsche people want to talk politics I'm sure there are political forums with political experts that will play crossfire with you indefinitely.

P.S. Zeke you you are an awesome craftsman/artist, handsome doors!

PSS Disclaimer....I did not complain nor was I offended or even interested enough in reading the deleted thread.

[island911]

geeze, a lot can happened here 24hrs

Originally posted by LynnsABCs
I vote you eliminate the Off-Topic Forum. . . . .trying to argue politics and other contentious topics causes much more harm than any benefit derived from it.. . .

Hmmm, seems that I've heard an old adage along those lines. It goes:
If you can't stand the heat of the kitchen, then . . .the whole restaurant really shoud be condemmed.

hmm, maybe I'm off a bit on that.

The great thing about the OT forum is that the political threads are like the deep-end of a swiming pool. Everybody knows the risk of the "deep-end" but just because some whiney brat has to climb back down from the high-dive board, sniveling and crying all the way, doesn't mean the deep-end has no utility.

[nostatic]

Originally posted by ted
Pelican is a car parts business.
Anything beyond talking car parts here has become a liability.
If one customer is lost due to the OT board it should be shut down.
If one customer’s perception is that any thread anywhere is too controversial it should be deleted.
If the OT board is shut down and OT posts migrate to technical boards those members should be banned.

It is not censorship for sake of differing opinions. It is censorship to protect the future of a person’s livelihood.
How he supports his family, his employees, pays his bills and taxes.
Shame on the OT board members that presume they should be permitted to compromise any of that.

While you are free to offer your view, I staunchly disagree. And this from someone who is VERY sensitive to liability issues. This is not the same as a "work truck" or any other traditional advertising medium. This is an online community, and people now have expectations and understandings. People know that an OT forum is just that. Well, evidently at least one person doesn't "get it", and got their panties in a wad over something they read here. That imho is petty and pathetic.

I would offer that if Wayne did not have this BBS (the entire BBS), he would not have as thriving a business. Period. Why has this BBS been so successful? The community that has spontaneously formed is eclectic, vibrant, and largely well behaved. Part of that mix is a cast of characters that spend time in OT. And Milt is exactly right that it keeps the crap off the other boards, so it serves an important purpose in a community made up of thinking, creative, insane people.

I was in that thread, and think I know what posts pissed of the individual. Frankly, they weren't that bad...poorly chosen, and offensive, but not the end of the world (unless I missed one towards the end).

This is an odd place with an add relationship between Wayne and the board. He functions as "dad" on occasion, but he and the moderators do far less work here than in any other bbs I participate in. But everybody makes mistakes, and everybody overreacts from time to time.

In short, I think that the OT forum is a necesary outlet for some of the more insane of our group. If it is removed, then either the noise on the main boards will go back up, or people will leave. Now some people might say "who cares?", but I think that all the members of this place are important...not just the "cool ones" with the cool cars...membership here is not based onexclusivity. Hell, I'd even be happy to have BigBPainta back...

No beer and no TV make Homer something something...

[Icemaster]

Here here.

Todd, your a gentleman and well spoken scholar.

[nostatic]

and Ted, if you really want to consider liability, talking about car parts and repairs on this board puts Wayne at much more risk than political rants. One could construe that the advice given on the boards is sanctioned and vetted by Pelican Parts. Then if someone follows the advice and breaks a part, breaks their car, or kills someone, PP is a party to the tort claim.

So if liability is really your fear, then you're looking at the wrong soft underbelly to poke.

[dd74]

No one that I know of has bought a Porsche yet because of the OT board, but there have been plenty of people who have taken a vicarious interest in the cars after reading the OT board. Yes, this seems far-fetched, but it has happened. Business is business, no matter how it's ferreted out.

Of course, the usual remark from these people, more or less, is, "Hey, you guys have an interest other than cars, huh?"

I'd have to say "yes, we do." There have been brilliant, well-educated remarks on this board, whether acerbic or not. But then again, brilliance is often snuffed out as intelligence threatens any in-place system.

They used to burn poets, didn't they?

BTW: my PMs are working again. But the msgs sent to me aren't there. It would bother me under other circumstances, but then again, Big Brother knows more than I do about his own skunk works.

[pwd72s]

Originally posted by JackOlsen
What little I've read of the political-themed threads on the OT board make me quickly close them, and move back to the 911 stuff. There are a lot of guys here who share my interest in 911's, who are also total nut-jobs when it comes to other issues. So be it.

My advice to everyone would be to not participate in the political threads. It never improves things to pick a fight with an idiot.

"Suppose you were an idiot. Suppose you were a Congressman.
Ah, I repeat myself" -Mark Twain (To those who will look this up, a pre apology. Going from fading memory here, so if every word isn't exact, no flaming needed)

[350HP930]

The only thing worse than the mystery mental weakling complaining about that thread was Wayne deleting it.

While I am supportive of Wayne for creating this site, engaging in either personal or political favoritism and censorship on an OFF TOPIC area of a community forum crosses the line of being a good moderator and host.

I could understand locking the thread or banning members after certain people starting hurling personal insults but sending it down the memory hole was another thing all together.

[bell]

"you can give a monkey a picaso, but it doesn't make him an art critic"........quote from me
there hasn't been too much clashing in the ot board......there's always a few who push buttons but i view it as entertainment, it's nice to know there are people more insane than myself.

[dporsche74]

NO OT section is outragous, If ppl can't read differnt opinions of fellow porsche nuts without feeling all emotional ... there has got to be serious mental issues up there.. and the porsche ani't going to fix it either... lol.

Come on ..all topic's should be able to fly here, As long as the content remains within acceptable forum guidelines (ie keep it mature) not hateful or childish.... right???

[speeder]

I'm dying to know WTF caused the super-offense and deep-sixing of the thread??

[dd74]

Same here. My bet is there are obviously those with thinner skin than you or I - at least too thin to "change channels." In other words, they got their vicarious kicks off the thread, but felt extreme guilt from those kicks.

The funny thing is Noah hasn't chimed in here. And he's a moderator, whatever THAT is on this board.

Probably it was a collective group - not one big spender - who could have said, "Either delete it, or I'm going to Performance Products."

[slakjaw]

ok i see where this is going

if the OT fourm is shut down, i will NO LONGER buy any part from pelican or drive works! PERIOD.

now

quit crying

if you dont like it then go play somewhere else.

[ted]

The OT board is a liability in this sense.
It has far more negative potential than positive on Pelican sales.

The way it reads to me is that some of you feel that every thread should remain. Even the threads that result in lost sales for Pelican parts.

A few of the OT regulars post with out concern, respect or remorse for the Pelican business.

Perhaps my analogy of a political slurs on a truck was weak, the internet and these messages are seen around the world, 24 hours a day. Not a plus for an internet mail order business.

Is turn around fair play?
Everyone OK with the fact that we should be allowed in your place of employment and openly discuss anything? Then should we be harsh to you when our actions drive a paying customer away?

Can no one but Pelican justify some acceptable amount of good behavior and good manners on the OT board?

You call yourselves Pelican-heads, though you feel your threads are more important than Pelican?
Then have you not become the Pelican's cancer?

[dd74]

Ted: I don't see how you justify that. OT is OT. It means "off topic." If it is a liability, and if you're Wayne, and you remove it, I can guarantee you your business will lose more clientele than if you were to leave the forum as is - along with leaving the thread in place. Customers, which most of us are, don't like to be told how we can express ourselves. It's like telling you don't do "this" or "that" to your car.

As I said, a Porsche is finite. It has a limit as to the knowledge it can give. The Bush TV post was one of the most insightful threads on this board. If no one learned anything from it - at least in the way of what personality types contribute to the Pelican board and Pelican Parts - than they're just thick and ignorant.

As a result of that thread, I haven't seen anyone threaten anyone else, though I did get some strange Emails as I've said earlier.

So where's the damage IMO? It's from deleting the thread.

[ronin]

may I ask which threads will-would-should-did-could- or even might have lost sales for Pelican??

just curious

[dporsche74]

nah ... There are 1000's and 1000's of 10,000's of Porsches in the USA, they are not rare in anyway... a few members posts ani't going stop a 944's from needing water pumps and 911's needing new tierods and ball joints.. If anything the OT section will sell MORE parts becuase ppl will be understanding the point of view of fellow posters. will you not read the how to time your 2.7rs engine because the poster hates the Bush's or the Clintons come on .. ...... evenyone know's pelican is the place for parts and nobody beats the excellent customer service...

[island911]

Considering that OT started out as "OT RANTINGS" it would seem reasonable to expect a certain amount of 'ranting' to persist.

Also, it is apparent, from this thread, just who's afraid to swim in the deep-end . And, who are likely to complain to the lifegard, when others are 'playing in the deep-end.'

Splitting the difference between a wading and swiming pool generally ends in a 3' deep pool that goes unused. . .except for the moss that hangs on.