RIP Paul Dana - Page 2

jluetjen · jluetjen's Garage

I don't know if anyone else noticed, but when I read the stories on the accident on-line, almost all of them (with the exception of Speed) took the opportunity to list every race car driver who has died on-track going back into the 90's and earlier -- as if that had anything to do with the accident at hand.

Noah930 · Noah930's Garage

Quote:

Once upon a time, A.J. Foyt had a (lack of) experience.

Yes, but I can't recall the last time AJ rocketed into another car (stopped on the track for a good several seconds) and got someone killed as a result. Thanks, motion, for sticking in the link I was referring to. Not saying Dana belonged in the car or not (though his actions are pretty inexplicable). But it's just a sad situation for him and his family. The only silver lining is that he died trying to live a dream.

Jims5543 · 03-27-2006, 04:32 PM

Being an ex-Autocrosser and now learning how to drive on the track. I am alarmed at how I am instructed to look for markers on the pavement 10 feet in front of the car and not to look as far ahead as possible.

I rounded a turn 2 months ago and came up on a wreck. I saw the wreck the second it was visible up track as I hit the apex of my turn. I saw it past the car in front of me and was on the brakes before him. I also had the awareness to look up behind me only to find a Corvette barreling down on me (at this point ON the straight and out of the turn) not seeing the accident and not processing I was slowing down. I had to speed back up so as not to be rear ended.

I was on the track last week (Miami / Homestead BTW) and a Ferrari wrecked in front of me. I was in the passanger seat and saw it before the driver. He was an excellent driver and I was suprised he did not see it sooner.

I am noticing a lot of "track racers" drive about 20-40 feet in front of them, or even worse they drive the rear bumper of the car in front if them.

Wat happened in Mami was totally aviodable. There are lights all over the track to indicate trouble. Also, when driving at 200 or 175 MPH I would imagine you would need to be look REALLY far in front of you.

As I am learning how to drive on a track I refuse to drive 30 feet off my bumper. I prefer to miss that perfect apex point or exit point in exchange for looking down the track and anticipating whats coming.

techweenie · techweenie's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by Jim Cesiro
I am noticing a lot of "track racers" drive about 20-40 feet in front of them, or even worse they drive the rear bumper of the car in front if them.

You need to hang out with better drivers. 100' or more is about the minimum for a club racer doing 70-80. the track markers may be 40=50 feet out, but you pick 'em up with peripheral vision.

I don't think any of us really is qualified to talk about a 200 MPH closing speed. That's fast enough that a 'twitch' can kill.

motion · 03-27-2006, 06:01 PM

Thinking more about this, I think Robin Miller and everyone that's jumped on his bandwagon has it wrong. The guy has been racing for 9 years now. He started in the smaller formulae and ran two years in the IPS. Last year, he finished 2nd in that championship. So, the guy's not a slouch, he has plenty of oval experience, and IPS cars have a good amount of HP. Around 450, I believe. Hell, Formula Atlantics only had 245 HP and that's the feeder for CART.

I believe he was just happy as hell to be back in a car on track with his peers after the accident last May. He was over-exhuberant and blew it. The ride-buying thing is an issue for sure, for guys like Dennis Vitolo and some of the other $hit-for-brains that we've seen on the track. Even Hiro Matsu****a was running CART for years and running dead last just because he was in the Panasonic money. I don't think it applies in this case, however. I think Dana was qualified... he just made a small error in judgement and paid the price.

Mr Beau · 03-28-2006, 08:35 AM

Richard,

I think the only problem with your analysis is the IPS angle. Granted I don't follow either very closely, but my impression is that IPS is much less competetive than Formula Atlantics. IPS has had very small car counts, and while some of the racing has been very close, the degree to which car setup plays a role is a major factor in success.

Noah930 · Noah930's Garage

How fast do IPS cars go? I ask out of ignorance. I hardly have time to watch IRL, let alone follow its feeder series. They run on the same tracks as the IRL boys (& girl). And regardless of issues like car setup, or differences in IRL vs. IPS speed--the rules of the track are the same. So when Ed Carpenter crashed, and the yellow trackside lights went on, and Dana's spotter said (or should have said) "yellow, yellow, yellow, turn 2..." (or wherever the wreck was located) why did Dana not slow down? Maybe it wasn't so much an issue of not being able to handle a car at 200 mph, but (like motion said) an issue of overexuberence in the moment.

GDSOB · GDSOB's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by motion
Thinking more about this, I think Robin Miller and everyone that's jumped on his bandwagon has it wrong. The guy has been racing for 9 years now. He started in the smaller formulae and ran two years in the IPS. Last year, he finished 2nd in that championship. So, the guy's not a slouch, he has plenty of oval experience, and IPS cars have a good amount of HP. Around 450, I believe. Hell, Formula Atlantics only had 245 HP and that's the feeder for CART.

I believe he was just happy as hell to be back in a car on track with his peers after the accident last May. He was over-exhuberant and blew it. The ride-buying thing is an issue for sure, for guys like Dennis Vitolo and some of the other $hit-for-brains that we've seen on the track. Even Hiro Matsu****a was running CART for years and running dead last just because he was in the Panasonic money. I don't think it applies in this case, however. I think Dana was qualified... he just made a small error in judgement and paid the price.

I'm not sure winning in the smaller fomulae translate to success in the major leagues. Wasn't Hiro the Atlantic champ?

scottmandue · 03-28-2006, 02:14 PM

I just read Robin Miller article and it seems a little harsh.

Very sad anyway.

Mr Beau · 03-28-2006, 03:00 PM

I read an article with a similar tone but can't find it right now. The author's last name started with 'Osw' or something like that... Damn memory.

motion · 03-28-2006, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by GDSOB
I'm not sure winning in the smaller fomulae translate to success in the major leagues. Wasn't Hiro the Atlantic champ?

Well, he *has* been fairly successful in the IRL in the few races he's ran. He qualified ninth for the race on Sunday. Not too bad for a rookie. But, just because he can put a one-lapper in, doesn't mean he can run wheel to wheel at 200 for 2 hours. The real problem here is: how do guys get experience running wheel to wheel? I'm not sure what the answer is.

greglepore · 03-28-2006, 04:20 PM

Richard pretty much had it right. Lots of folks slag on the IRL, but this wasn't the prototypical IRL accident. This was a guy who for whatever unknown reason didn't see the yellows (or hear his spotter, if you believe the team) and drove full speed into trouble.

No one wants to talk about sensory overload, but look at the modern race car cockpit and comm gear. Way too much happening for my comfort.