Steve Irwin, natural selection at work

[Moneyguy1]

One could really do an interesting psycological study based on the posts here. Some show an insensitivity that really should not surprise anyone. This was a human being. He had a passion. This passion killed him. He had a family, friends, and thousands, perhaps millions who knew him through his adventures. He had a positive influence on many. How many of You can say the same?

We are all diminished by his passing. Read John Donne and Ask not for whom the bell tolls.......

[nostatic]

Originally posted by techweenie
P
EDIT: one other comment. This 'died doing what he loved' thing irks me. When a guy burns to death in a race car, is having his flesh burned off "what he loved?" When a guy convulses and suffocates from a neurotoxin, is that "what he loves?" I think this phrase really applies best when death is instantaneous and not immediately anticipated.

In '87, I was snorkeling alone on the Great Barrier Reef when I encountered a lone sand tiger at about 3 meters out. Had the shark turned and attacked me instead of swimming past, I can assure you my last thoughts would not have been "oh well, this is what I love doing..."

My comment was not so much about the particular circumstances of his death, but rather he was living his life doing what he loved and doing something that he thought was important. In other words, he wasn't phoning it in. What he was doing at the particular time of departure was rather irrelevant...

[dd74]

Only time will tell whether he did good. Awareness of animals? Yes, he made his viewers aware of them and what dangers they possess. But the question I have is "why?" and for "who?"

On Animal Planet, there are a couple shows which mimmick Irwin's actions with animals. In one, a person (Australian, ironically), intentionally stun himself with several insects to see which insect gives the worst sting. He finally did have to enter the hospital as one sting he received nearly made his arm gangrenous. All of this happened in the wild.

Absolutely, for prospective veterinarians and zoologists, this is good information. But if these shows can practically play to such small minorities, in overal viewership, I still can't get around what Irwin was doing didn't funnel down to simple sensationalism.

[Moneyguy1]

tech

You are out of character, which rarely happens. The event (the particular) is far removed from the overall dedication. Being a firefighter is inherently dangerous. Being an astronaut is inherently dangerous. What if folks in dangerous occupations were paralyzed with the "what ifs"? Hell, most people, if really concerned about their safety would not want to get out of bed.

[svandamme]

Originally posted by techweenie

EDIT: one other comment. This 'died doing what he loved' thing irks me. When a guy burns to death in a race car, is having his flesh burned off "what he loved?" When a guy convulses and suffocates from a neurotoxin, is that "what he loves?" I think this phrase really applies best when death is instantaneous and not immediately anticipated.

it's not about the last 3 minutes of agony , i'm sure it hurts like a mf to be stabbed in the heart with a toxic payload...

but look at it this way, he didn't wake up in the morning feeling miserable, coughing up blood , puking or wired up with tubes and whatnot in a hospital that couldn't do anything anyway...

right up to the moment where he got done, he was more alive then any of us sitting here at our keyboard, and yeah , the dying part was probably horrible, but or having a 2 ton weight dropped onto your head without you even knowing it, i say there are worse things...

but off course, death is that one leap we will al have to make
and in that split second in time, however it maybe , violent, nasty or peacefull , in that split second alone we will find out what it is like, what else there is... or not, maybe it is just like getting knocked out , or going to sleep

personally , i think it's the latter, in which case the things to avoid are

chronic illness
prolonged agony
beeing a plant
mental degeneration
beeing alone
beeing depressed
not having any control of what you are doing
...


just beeing alive, active, doing what you like doing with people you choose to work with
and beeing done in 10 minute or less is none of that...

[HardDrive]

Originally posted by Moneyguy1
One could really do an interesting psycological study based on the posts here. Some show an insensitivity that really should not surprise anyone. This was a human being. He had a passion. This passion killed him. He had a family, friends, and thousands, perhaps millions who knew him through his adventures. He had a positive influence on many. How many of You can say the same?

We are all diminished by his passing. Read John Donne and Ask not for whom the bell tolls.......

I edited my post to include an appology.

It was a mean spirited thing to post.

[techweenie]

Originally posted by svandamme
but look at it this way, he didn't wake up in the morning feeling miserable, coughing up blood , puking or wired up with tubes and whatnot in a hospital that couldn't do anything anyway...

Point taken.

[masraum]

I saw little wrong with what he did. It seemed crazy, but he'd forgotten more about most of the animals that he worked with than I'll probably ever know. As someone has stated. I'm sure to some people the stuff that many of us do in cars, motorcycles, sports, etc... seems crazy, dumb, and/or dangerous. I guess if someone thinks that about us then that must mean that we are idiots too. Going 125 in a car or on a bike is probably just as dangerous or more than what he did. He's been working with those animals since he was a kid since the zoo was his dads. Until that point, he had never been envenomated by a poisonous animal. I'd say that after working with poisonous creatures that long, for this to have been the first time, it's not luck, he knew and understood the animals pretty darn well. I seem to remember that he's been bitten by crocs a couple of times, but nothing too serious (relatively).

His enthusiasm and love for the wild is a sad thing for the world to lose. Too many people think the rape and pillage of the wild is a good way to get back to nature. Hopefully his enthusiasm was catching and 5 more people dedicated to the study and preservation of animals and nature will spring up in his place.

It's unfortunate too that he's leaving not only a wife, but an 8yo daughter and 3 yo son behind.

[techweenie]

BTW: For anyone who hasn't seen it. I recommend renting "Grizzly Man."

The subject of that film was a bit more detached from reality than Steve Irwin, but at least as fascinating, IMO.

[930addict]

Originally posted by Nathans_Dad
Sorry, but the title of this thread is amazingly insensitive. It isn't even true to the facts.

If Irwin was killed putting his head inside the mouth of a crocodile or something like that, I would say that was a stupid way to die. The guy got a little too close to a stingray while swimming above it and was stung. Happens all the time. His amazing misfortune was that the barb happened to penetrate his heart and killed him.

How many people said that Dale Earnhardt dying on the track was "Natural Selection at Work"?? What about Payne Stewart or JFK Jr. dying in an airplane?

I agree with everything you said above. I don't think the guy had a big ego or was arrogant when it came to the creatures he studied, namely reptiles. I think he simply knew what he was doing when it came to reptiles and his showmanship came off as arrogant to the folks that are otherwise ignorant. But sharks were a different story. I recall Irwin on Jay leno a few months back where he talked about beginning to study sharks and such. He admitted then that he was not as knowledgeable about them but was excited to get in and learn. This was just a case of someone being in the wrong place at the wrong time - not blind arrogance. I was not one to watch his shows but he did seem like a likable guy the several times I saw him on Leno. I think it's just tragic.

[Moses]

Originally posted by Sonic dB
The events were caught on camera and the footage is now in the possession of Queensland Police.

Police? To file charges against the ray?

The first thing that struck me about this is that the couch potatoes of this world have very little risk of meeting an untimely end due to a wildlife encounter gone bad. Like the grizzly guy, Irwin was not an observer of life, he was a participant. These guys have a pioneer spirit that has been largely repressed in modern society. I'm sorry he's gone, particularly for his family but I sure admire the way he lived.

[singpilot]

I flew him to Oz a couple of years ago.

He sat on the jumpseat when we landed at Manila for fuel. He thought what I did for a living was dangerous (forgetting that he was a passenger in the same plane). I told him I thought what he did was too. He said he worked with animals, who, for the most part were predictable. As we taxiied to the gate, I responded that I worked with the rules of physics, also fairly predictable.

He said the only variable he really had to deal with were people he worked with around him. Just then, the flight attendant came into the cockpit, and tripped on his shoulder harness that he had removed after landing.

We both smiled as I said 'Same, same'.

[techweenie]

Originally posted by Moses
guys have a pioneer spirit that has been largely repressed in modern society. I'm sorry he's gone, particularly for his family but I sure admire the way he lived.

Repressed? Look at some of the posts and substitute the word 'reviled.'

[svandamme]

Originally posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts
That's really too bad to hear. Gosh though, if you believe in karma, this is one for your notebook.

Still, the guy was a nutjob - not for what he was doing with animals, but for the fact that he put his 1-month son in jeopardy by bringing him into a croccodile pen. I lost all respect for him after that incident.

-Wayne

that was blown well out of proportion, and is no worse then carrying a kid in the back seat of a early 911 without seatbelts...for a very short emergency drive and i'm sure many have done that

or people who leave babies in a room with a dog...it happens all the time, and i'm sure that more babies have been mauled by housedogs that just snap out of envy , then crocks...

again , you have to put it in his perspectrive, a crock to him is more predictible then daily traffic is to us... and if you see the footage, he held the baby away from the crock while he was feeding it , at worst he would have been bitten , not the baby, crocks don't jump up 4 feelt , they aren't that nimble...not even the big ones..

sure it's not normal , but it's no less dangerous then soccermums driving 55mph in heavy traffic, with phones, makeup, coffee cups and kids in the back ( even those with seatbelts )

[nostatic]

as opposed to people who strap a 1 month old into a carseat (that they probably didn't mount correctly) and then proceed to drive 80mph on the freeway while talking on the cell phone and eating a Big Mac...

[singpilot]

Originally posted by nostatic
as opposed to people who strap a 1 month old into a carseat (that they probably didn't mount correctly) and then proceed to drive 80mph on the freeway while talking on the cell phone and eating a Big Mac...

Todd;

You forgot the while driving an SUV part....

[masraum]

Originally posted by singpilot
Todd;

You forgot the while driving an SUV part....

while drinking a starbucks double grande no fat 4 sugars double shot...., smoking a cigarette, and talking on a cell phone. Maybe even picking up a hitchhiker.

[cegerer]

Steve Irwin can't be compared to 'The Grizzly Man' - Tim Treadwell. Steve did some crazy stuff, but Treadwell was mentally unstable. Intersting documentary tho, I've seen it twice.

[jdm61]

Originally posted by Nathans_Dad
Sorry, but the title of this thread is amazingly insensitive. It isn't even true to the facts.

If Irwin was killed putting his head inside the mouth of a crocodile or something like that, I would say that was a stupid way to die. The guy got a little too close to a stingray while swimming above it and was stung. Happens all the time. His amazing misfortune was that the barb happened to penetrate his heart and killed him.

How many people said that Dale Earnhardt dying on the track was "Natural Selection at Work"?? What about Payne Stewart or JFK Jr. dying in an airplane?

Sorry, Rick, but if there was ever a case of natural selection at work, it was JFK, Jr. He had very little time in that plane and was not really qualified to be flying when he was. He got a case of the "leans" and flew his plane into the ground. "Pilot error" which usually tranlsates into something between "gross negiligence" and "chronic stupidity" like the recent crash in Kentucky. With Payne Stewart, it was equipment failure. For Dale Earhardt, it was job associated risk.

[jdm61]

Originally posted by svandamme
that was blown well out of proportion, and is no worse then carrying a kid in the back seat of a early 911 without seatbelts...for a very short emergency drive and i'm sure many have done that

or people who leave babies in a room with a dog...it happens all the time, and i'm sure that more babies have been mauled by housedogs that just snap out of envy , then crocks...

again , you have to put it in his perspectrive, a crock to him is more predictible then daily traffic is to us... and if you see the footage, he held the baby away from the crock while he was feeding it , at worst he would have been bitten , not the baby, crocks don't jump up 4 feelt , they aren't that nimble...not even the big ones..

sure it's not normal , but it's no less dangerous then soccermums driving 55mph in heavy traffic, with phones, makeup, coffee cups and kids in the back ( even those with seatbelts )

You have obviously never seen the "Gator Jumparoo" show at Gatorland Zoo in Kissimee. Crocs can outrun there typical prey over a short distance.