"Even if you hate GM, it's hard to hate a Vette. It's almost not even a GM...It's hard to argue with the performance of a Vette."

Yeah, and it only took them from '56 til now to get it almost right. I realize there are Corvette lovers here, but the build quality until lately has been, how should I put it, less than desireable. If you doubt my words, go to any Corvette car show. The true fanatics are so diehard, they must replicate all the sloppy engineering, loose tolerances and glue splattering the assembly lines managed to originally apply. It's all according to "the book".

There's gotta be an American equivalent of the term, "rice" because I've seen plenty of it over the years., many in domestic car shows. For example, if it weren't for nostalgia, I'd include almost everything designed by Ed Barris. Err, come to think of it, maybe that American term is simply called bad taste.

MHO,
Sherwood

if you can afford $80K for this, why not spent the extra $ and get the 911? There's some breakpoint where you've got enough money to buy whatever so you should buy...whatever. I like this but I'd rather pony up the extra cash and get a GT3.

Imagine the aftermarket and chipping this monster. Turbo cars always have the most potential in the aftermarket for more power.

I have to see one in person. Pictures never tell the true story. The Cayman looks 10X better in person than in pictures.

Don't forget I am sure that the chassis will be amazingly computer controlled et al like the previous.

I say this is probably going to be ridiculously good even if it is pug fugly.

Totally true. I never even cared about it when I saw it in the magazines. I saw a few in person now and they are, IMO, the sexiest Porsche on the dealer lots right now.

IMHO GM's target is the Ford GT which is already quicker than the GT-R. 650 hp should facilitate that.

Pontiac is ricer division of GM, IMO. :)

RICE = Race Inspired Cosmetic Enhancement.

Although I am NOT a fan of the car's looks. I would bet that it has the performance to back up the hype. Once the tuners get ahold of it, it will be a true monster.

JP

I know it's hard for us here to fathom, but there are people in the world who don't care much for 911's, and who would buy the GT-R even if it cost MORE than a 911.

The other day, an NSX drove by and I heard a Blow Off Valve and whatnot. It also had a pretty aggressive CF Wing on it. This girl with us referred to it as silly and ricey. In that case, I agree with your definition and not hers, because I do not doubt that the car could back it up.

RICE to me is a broken down corolla with dented body panels, a double-planed wing, fart can, and plastic spinner hubcaps, or even better real rims with red spray-painted brake DRUMS.

The NSX looked good to me, IMO.

I can understand people opting for the GTR rather than the 997TT.

Firstly, I think the Porsche badge comes with a lot of baggage that the Nissan badge doesn't, and that matters to some people. When was the last time you heard that someone drove a Nissan because they had a small pen*s? Some people hate the Porsche style (obviously not me, I'm a Komenda fan!), and as hard as it might be for a Porsche fan to admit, there is a very real possibility that the GTR will be better in a number of ways to the 997TT. We already know it has a faster Norschliefe time (7:35 compared to 7:40).

I also notice that 997 and 996 Twin Turbos are becoming as common as Civics (ok, not exactly, but I do see a lot of them), whereas, atleast initially - and possibly always - the GTR will be a rarer sight. The nice thing about the GTR will be that if someone notices it, they are likely a car guy, whereas with the Porsche, everyone knows what it is, and that can bring unwanted attention too.

I also don't buy the notion that at some point, the money doesn't matter. All the wealthy people I have ever met got to that point by being intelligent with their money. If the 997 TT is 50% more expensive, even people with money are going to take notice.

On the otherhand, I do think a lot of new Porsche owners buy the car for the flash name, as they aren't real car guys (or girls - sorry). I don't know how many car guys there will be for Nissan at that price point, but its worked for Corvette for quite sometime. It just seems to me that the majority of GTR fans in North America are too young to be in the earning bracket to buy one of these.

I don't see wealthy people (smart or not) going for the looks and badge of the GTR.

For $80k it may follow in the footsteps of the VW Phaeton.

What? You did not like the '53-55's either?;)

(wishing I had my old 56 or 63 again...not for performance, just the "sheer fun")SmileWavy

I just wish the GTR was a little more "sleek" instead of so angular. We've had great luck with the wife's supercharged G35. 0-60 under 5 sec, and 1/4 mile time 12.7 @ 117. The only problem is initial traction. I really have enjoyed the build quality of the Infiniti.

There is generally some truth to that - performance aside, buyer's in the $80K range generally want some "prestige" to go with it.

Although I think the Acura NSX generally did ok.

It will be interesting to see how the sales go. It certainly will be better than the Phaeton, though. That was a real odd-ball - no one expects a VW to cost $80-90K (or whatever it was that the Phaeton cost, it was a lot).

But the GT-R is a little different, it is a legendary line of performance cars to many car enthusiasts. It of course isn't designed or expected to be a high volume car, my guess is they will meet their sales goals on it.

Well, based on the first runs, it sounds like quite a machine. Starting in the $70k range.

http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071017/FREE/71017001/1065

I think Porsche-philes should welcome this machine, as it has to put pressure on Porsche to come out with something better to justify the Turbo's high price. Right now, with a 7:35 lap time on the Nordschliefe, the GTR splits the difference between the Turbo and the GT2, for a large chunk of change less.

Sounds like a great car, but I still think it's a bit ugly. The last Skyline was far more attractive and purposeful looking.

Yep! But I have to give the car credit. Minute Rice has now evolved to 3.5 Second Rice.

I wouldn't be to critical of the shape from the standpoint of design and engineering. Nissan has some very talented people on the design, engineering and aero teams.

Porsche's are cool and I sure enjoy mine but when it comes to sports car racing they had their butt kicked more than once the world over by Nissan, Toyota and Mazda during the last 30 years. If any of them decided to come back in a big way it would happen again. (not to stir the $hit or anything like that)

German cars don't handle any better or go any faster than the Japanese cars (not as good as some). The German fit and finish and choice of interiors is nicer, in my opinion. But that is about where it begins and ends.

It's NOT a Porsche and will never be a Porsche!
Those that lead will always be followed, but those that copy; well they're just copy cats!

Porsche is an entire experience in ownership; few understand; but those that do; well they have the entire experience!

I've owned 240Z's, 280Z's, 280ZX's and a 300Z prior to owning a Porsche; but now that I've owned a Porsche, I would never even consider going to any other car, unless I get into multiple car ownership; and even then I've got two now!

I could see a stalion in the stable, but they can keep that Datsun.